Ep. 1120 Pablo Fernandez Interviews Angelo Varvaglione | Clubhouse Ambassador's Corner

Welcome to the Italian wine podcast. This episode has been brought to you by the wine to wine business forum twenty twenty two. This year, we'll mark the ninth edition of the forum to be held on November seventh and eighth of twenty twenty two in Verona Italy. This year will be an exclusively in person edition. The main theme of the event will be all around wine communication. Tickets are on sale now. So for more information, please visit us at wine to wine dot net. Welcome to this special Italian wine podcast broadcast. This episode is a recording off Clubhouse, the popular drop in audio chat. This clubhouse session was taken from the wine business club and Italian wine club. Listen in as wine lovers and experts alike engage in some great conversation on a range of topics in wine. If you enjoy listening, please consider donating through Italian wine podcast dot com. Any amount helps cover equipment, production, and publication costs. And remember to subscribe and rate our show wherever you tune in. Hello, everybody. Welcome to the Italian wine club on Clubhouse. This is the ambassadors corner. The our usual fire chat session. With one of our Italian wine ambassadors. And today, our Italian wine Ambassador, actually, he's a new Italian wine Ambassador is Pablo. Pablo, Pablo Fernandez. Charles Dv, Charles Ruan, hi. This is so exciting because actually, I think Pablo, we've met each other in club house first. Right? Exactly. Yeah. I think I'm following Yeah. This this room since they won, I think. Oh, excellent. Excellent. Listen, like, can you tell us how many have we done so far? Like, of course, these are, clubhouse, backstage manager. She just got married again. Congratulations. Like it. Come back. Come back. Okay. Hey. Okay. I Are you still married? Opening the file? Yeah. I'm so sorry. We're still married. I'm actually happy that the the music, the background music is not working well because that cringy clap is Oh, my goodness. Margarita's gonna be so upset. I can't believe you said that. Anyway, so there's, it's the sixty eight episode so far. Oh, my goodness. That is amazing. So like, of course, is our clubhouse manager. So Pablo, listen. Do you wanna tell us a little bit about yourself? You're actually an engineer. Right? And and where where are you from? First of all, you're from? I'm from Florida, please, Brazil. And, Floriano police, Brazil. Say that ten times fast. Floriano how do you say in in Brazilian, I guess? Philadelphia. Florida. Okay. And whereabouts is that in Brazil? This is Southern Brazil. It's close to Argentina, close to Hawaii. So it's a subtropical place. So it's different from the rest of Brazil. We also have a wine regions here, so it's very interesting one. Mostly sparklers, right, or no? Yeah. Yeah. We have but here, especially, in the States here, which is called Santa Katarina. We have also whites and red wines. Very good because we have altitude here. So even snow here during the winter. So it's a very interesting new region. So Hey. Did you go to did you attend the event that Vinitally organized in, Brazil recently? It it was in that part of town. Yeah. Yeah. Was there. Winds of America. It's like seven hour drive here, which is closed for Brazilian standards. And I met Gabriela. So it was amazing. Oh, great. Great. Great. Great. I'll I'll see him actually the day after tomorrow. So, he's organizing. Of course, he's many, many tastings, and I'll be attending. I saw him the other day actually last last week as well with Chansa, but I'm glad you gotta get a chance to meet the very first master wine from Italy. Gabrielle Gorelli. He's such a nice person and very smart as well. So that's that's fantastic. Okay. So, Pablo, tell us a little bit about yourself before we get into it. So I have a background engineer, but, in two thousand nineteen, I I decided to take a sabbatical from my career, and I I went to Europe and, and, especially Italy. So I was thinking about what to do when, when I stayed this month in Italy, which was only a month, I say, almost three. So I decided that this is what I want to do, like, something related to Italy. So when I returned to Brazil, I started to study wine, and then the pandemic started or happened. And then I started to to to formalize my my my studying wine. So I got WCT and, I Italian wine scholar in other courses. And in two thousand twenty two, I started my diploma, and I tried the Vineito International Academy's Italian wine Ambassador in London. Which I passed. Whoa. So Whoa. Whoa. Wait a minute. Hold on. Whoa. That's unexpected, but anyway, I was there to try and invest. Yeah. Listen, Pablo, but you you you knew something about mine before. Right? So for the pandemic. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I I had a wine club with friends, and I I did some harvests here in in Santa Katarina also three years following the the whole cycle. So But it was just a passion, not, something that I was pursuing, at the time. So, but, yeah, I I So is this like your decision to abandon, you know, your engineering career? Was that like a midlife crisis or what? Definitely. A midlife crisis. I don't know if this is also a therapy, but, yeah, definitely. But are you over over that lump, or are you going back to being an engineer, or you want to do a wine full time? I'm not sure you can make a living doing that. Yeah. Most people do it as a hobby. Yeah. It's not an easy task. And now, so it's not, a a smart thing to to transform your hobby in work. Right? But, yeah, I think, I think, I'm still working part time with visioneering. I I do some consultancy in contracts and contract management, project management, which is my background. I used to do I usually I I used to work with, in implementations of energy, big, and energy power plants. But wine is my passion. I'm developing a program of Italian education here. And I, really, I'm now I'm I would take the VA educator, which is, I wanted to to bring the Maestro courses here. And, yeah, I I I strongly believe that that we have a lot of quotations for Italian. Wine for Italian wine here, and I I think that there's a, a potential also for education and experiences in Italy. We have a lot of Italian heritage here in Brazil. So That's fantastic. We are so happy to have you on board Pablo. Thank you for doing that. So tell us why you selected Angela Valvolione as your favorite producer today? Well, it's a it's a funny story because, as I said before, I took a sabbatical in two thousand nineteen. I ended up going to Italy. My month in Italy became three, almost three. So and what was supposed to be just a weekend in pulling a three week three week trip. So I made a lot of friends there. I met a lot of people. So I I followed him up for food for the culture, and Boulia became my favorite region. And so with that, one of these friends that I made there, it's a cheese maker in Altamura, a vito de jacket, he was going to show his cheeses in a party at Barballione. So he brought me there also. And then I met Marcia, met Angelo, their parents. I felt so welcomed there. I loved the wine. I loved the whole experience because it was a party with cooking classes. Oil, olive oil, oil, cheeses, a lot of wine. So, I kept touch, with Angelo ever since. So, it wasn't one of those moments in the Maesa protocol that I really thought, well, this is something that I really want to do. Like, have, give that, that, those experiences to people. So, when I became, I taught an ambassador, and, of course, I'm following the ambassador's callers since the beginning, I thought, well, one day if I host a a a show there definitely has has to be a value on it because of that. So Oh, fantastic. That is Yeah. I'm I'm pretty excited to, here also. Angela, because I'm I I know Marcia and and demand are more the female side of, so I'm excited to hear Angelo today. So listen, I'm going to leave the mic to you, and then I will try to come back later, to see if there's any time for some questions. Take it away, Pablo. Okay, Stevie. Thank you very much. So we're going to talk with my friend Angelo here. Chow. Welcome. Welcome. Thank you so much for your feedbacking me here. I mean, virtually, I'm a dad for, so I'm very sorry for for the noises in the background. Oh, no problem. The sound is is great. First, we will introduce you. Angela Varyoni, thirty one years old. This is the second son of Kasimo. With his two sisters, Martin Taneska, he's bringing innovation to the company as his father asked them. Angelo has an economy and management degree and two master's degree in food and beverage industry management and sustainability management. Still, he has worked as a seller man during harvest time since he started working in his family company applying the classic learning by doing to do their wine culture. Angela runs the company's vineyards. He's the director of sustainability department, taking care of the raw materials purchases and new businesses developments. He is also responsible for the Asian markets and his exported manager with his export manager, Fabil Khashani. Also, his sports and astronomy lover, And, firstly, I would like to introduce our learning objectives here. Steve didn't ask me, but I think it's very important to to put it here. We we, we want you to learn more about the tejo out of Salento, starting taran to ipulia. It's native grapes and how it is essential for sustainably sustainable and organic winemaking at Vavalioni. Also, also we're going to learn how a century, world winery, like Vavalioni successfully communicates its brand and image. And also show how good stories help sell even more bottles of wine. So Angelo, first question needs tell us a little about Farvalluna's history, the journey and how you got here. I would say that, to be honest, I'm the one company because of my sister. Because, like, you know, as a the only son of my father, we had a very, a big conflict in our relation And then my sister after my studies say, oh, come on, Angela, why don't you try to to get inside the company? And then, you know, it was like a vortex. Once you are inside, then you never go away from that. So that's why I actually started this, this business, but, of course, now I'm full of affection for it. I mean, it's my life. It's my surname. It's my it's the history of my family. So I'm very proud to do this job. Interesting. And Farfetch only has a hundred years old. Right? The last year was the Oh, yeah. Last year was the first century of the company because, everything started with my great grandfather, Cosima. So I used to produce a small quantity of wine, in the center of the house. I mean, as it was very, used to do at the time. And, and then it started selling, it's around the town. But we really give the the shape of our real winery. So the company was my grandfather Angelo, who was the person who started to bottle on the wine and selling it to the navy forces. The the quarter liter. You know, it was, like, very small bottles that he he used to sell to the navy forces. And after that, he started to be very focused on the production of the bulk wine. Because as you know, Puya is, is the region, very well known for the bulk wine. Is the highest, I mean, is the region, well known as the highest wine producer in Italy? Which is the the first country in the world as a wine producer. So which means that we produce a lot of wine. And, this apulia wine in the past was used to be blends to enrich, all the wine from all around the world. But I would say that's twenty, twenty five years ago. The winemaker Symoria, they started to change their mind. And so to put all these wine in the bottles. And, one of these winemakers was my father. Who gave the, I would say, the next step to our company. So it was always focused on the quality instead of the quantity, and, it was always focused on the export. So it brought our product around the world. And, this was, like, the, the way to to grow. Interesting. Interesting. Yeah. I I this is one of the things that caught my attention about, of Arvalioni because, of course, we're going back to talk about the the the the terroir and the geek stuff about the technical stuff that I know that you it's your thing, but Since you brought this topic, I really want to to to to talk about a little bit about this focus of our value on markets outside Italy. Tell us a little bit about the winery size, where you export to, and what is the percentage of what is exported, and how you work the communication and pro promotion of these wines abroad? Yes. Okay. So Barballoni produce around five millions bottles. And, the eighty percent of these bottles are sold, abroad. So not in twenty percent, yeah, twenty percent in Italy and eighty percent abroad. So, actually, I would say that we grow thanks to the work. Thanks to the globalization. And, we were lucky because, the Apulia wine and the Apulia as a region, they grow together at the same time. So now, the Apulia region is is becoming a big name as a tourist touristic place, and the same thing is happening for the for the primitivo, which is the most famous grape variety from Julia. And, also, thanks to the, to the body of this one. It is very easy to be paired to different, way of cook, around the world. So spicy, I would say, or barbecue, I mean, Italian food, but also Asian food. So it's very, well balanced wine, which is easy to be paired with different food. And this is, I mean, in my opinion, why the primitive is having a big successor around the world. Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. It's it's very rare to see a a a wine that, especially from Southern Italy. That is very focused on exports, and it's, amazing. That that's one of the reasons that caught my attention for vallejo disease that they won. So getting back to the technical due to things that, you work in your day to day basis. Let's talk about the wildest place, the the the salem to, let's talk a bit about the war, the grapes, the impact of the terroir on the wines, sustainable use of resources, that is something that is very important these days. And also the production of organic wines at the winery, please just tell us a little bit about those things. I mean, Salento is in Polia. So we start from Polia. Pulia is a region of Italy in the south of Italy, which is the hill of the boat. So we like to say that we stand Italy. Because from a because from, an agriculture point of view, Pool is very important in Italy. And then we have the Salento, which is our small area. Salento is a southern part of Puya. And, Taranto is in Saliento, which is our city. And, the story of Taranto is very beautiful, very beautiful because it was the first and only colony of Sparta. So we will yeah. We like to say that we are warriors. Yes, sir. Yeah. It was, the capital, the great empire of Greece, like, three hundred fifty years before Christ. So we are very long tradition, and they are ready to use wine on that period. And we were one of the last cities in the south of Italy to be defeated by the Roman empire. So we have a a very, very old story. And, it's been about the Terrace. The Terwater is very generally speaking, is made by twenty five, thirty percent of a tilt, thirty, thirty five percent sand, and thirty five, forty percent of clay. So it is very well balanced. Soil, very, I mean, perfect for the vineyards. And, but the most important condition that we have, is, is the wind. The winder has a very important role in the in the quality of the overall grapes because it's very sunny. It's very hot. It's very dry. But thanks to the, thanks to the wind. We have a very, we have a perfect temperature range. Which, as you know, is very important in the, in the in the vineyards. So which means that during the day, we have sun, a lot of sun, which gives a lot of color and tonnage to our product. But at night, we have, always wind from the north, which, make the temperature go, I mean, below twenty, nineties degrees. So which is very perfect. So the plants the the vines can breathe. Mhmm. It can bring all the product to the right, ripness. Mhmm. And that's why we have a very, very balanced, and complex product and ready, I would say, because, our wines don't need to be aged, for ten, fifteen, twenty years. I mean, after, two or three years, they are already full of complexity. Interesting. Yeah. Yeah. So, you you talked a lot a lot about a lot about creativity, but also you have, other grades there. Oh, yeah. So yeah. Oh, yes. Of course, we have a negra motto. Which is a combination of two words. Negro from Spanish, which means black and marvelous from Greek, which means black. So black black because of the skin of the grape, because it's very deep. Also, in fact, the the carbon guamaro is very, very deep. And beautiful in my opinion. And, also, we have, Verdeca, we have Piano, which is a typical, white suede variety from, from the south of Italy. We have also the Malvasie Black, we have the Aljanico, which is well spread all around the south of Italy. And, yes, this is the most, I would say, famous great variety that we have in Pollia. Mhmm. Also, your, I just noticed that was even, in a story on the Italian wine podcast that you guys just released, a resistance on Susomaniello. Right? Oh, yes. Susomaniello is, the the name of the of this moment, I would say. So it's becoming big because we have a very, smaller, quantity of rape spread around Polia. And, every everybody want to make the sumanello wine. So now we are finally. Yeah. I'm on ending up with producer. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And and in fact, because of this, we are now growing by ourself, our susu Susu Manuel. So in the next, I would say, three, five years. We we will be able to produce, only by ourselves for the the Susu Manuel that we need for our bottles. Interesting. Yeah. Which is I would say that so sorry to interrupt you. And so is, is in between, the primitive and the negramaro. Okay. Because the negramaro is very elegant. It's very gentle. Primitivo is a full body wine, very strong. But in the Gramaro, it's more flavor. More elegant spread fruits. And it's just man yellow. It's exactly in the between. Of the two. So with the, nice body and, very nice bouquet. Yeah. It's this alternative to, to make, rosette wines, besides being a incremental. Usually, in the southern bully, they do a lot of with negromato. Right? So, Susumanejo's they think it's a interesting name. Also, so it's a cool name to say. So I don't know. Just staying down here. Yeah. So, Samantha comes from, asinalo, which means little donkey. Mhmm. Because, for the first seven years, it produced a lot of grapes. And so it looks like a donkey, with a lot of heavy on on it. That's why the name. Yeah. And it's also related to SanJovese. It's one of the sons of SanJovese. Son jobese. So yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Speaking of wines, we are I don't know if you're stewing harvest season there. I don't know if it's anything like maybe Alyani, but I don't know, we're in October. Anyway, talk a little bit about the two thousand twenty two harvest and your expectations about it. What can I we're gonna say, in my opinion, it's the the best harvest of the last six years because I I started to to to make the harvest six years ago? For my for my father, it was one of the best of the last twenty years. Because the weather condition was perfect. I mean, we have, the crease of the production by twenty five, thirty percent this year. But, so, Joyce is more concentrated, but the the vines were very, very healthy. So we didn't have disease because of the wind. We are we all we have, for a two months winds from the north side, which is dry and cool. So the lift were dried. So, I mean, the the quality of the grid was was perfect this year. Things that we have some fermentation wine, which are on seventeen point five percent of ARPU. Mhmm. That's crazy. Yeah. It's it's beautiful. And, but, yeah, but, of course, this is not, I would say, a normal condition, because it depends because of the climate change, of course. Because, this is the second year that we have a summer, very, very, very dry. And, of course, this is not good because you can have one, two, three harvest I mean, like this, but after five years with no rain, I I don't think that square gonna have a a market anymore. Yeah. Yeah. It's interesting that you brought this up, That's one of my questions that comment on the climate changing facts on Varvallioni, and how Zarvallioni is preparing to live with it. And I we cannot say in the future because it's already here. Right? So how you guys are discussing this and, preparing and tell tells a little bit about that. Yes. I mean, the the only way is, to use a technology, because the climate change is real. It's happening. The level of the water under the soil decrease by thirty percent. So Wow. For sure. So for sure, we we need to reduce the waste of the water. I mean, the level of the water decreased by thirty percent all around Italy, not only in India. This is a global problem. And and we introduced the the waste of water first, of course, and the impact of the grid production on the environment. So, I mean, music I mean, being organic, producing inorganic in a green way. But, of course, to this, that that the company needs investments. And, so it's not easy. So what's what we're doing? We are investing technology. So, whether station, s smart sensor all around, all around our wee vineyards. Mhmm. Very precision agriculture solve the Yeah. It is. I mean, be because it's a big port. Mhmm. Sorry. No. No. It's it's it's very important to collect data because it is not, sir, like, in the past, you know, where, you used to do something so you do it. No. Now every year, it's very different. From the previous one. And so if you want to have a forecast, you have to collect a lot of data and and to be and to be ready, in order to reduce the risk of the climate change. And, there was a very interesting, combination in Rome. It was called the vines on the space. And basically, they are doing some experiments on the vines, on the vines with no gravity. Yeah. It was something, I mean, sounds like super in interstellar movie, but, it's something that's the they are doing. And, It was very interesting because, without the gravity, the external parts of the cells of the vines changed. And just because all the alive, things on this planet, they have something called the self guide evolution inside the self, which means something that's, push you to survive in bad condition. To adapt to all the condition in terms to survive. And the the scientists thought, okay. We we all we always seen everything change because of the climates, because of the temperature, because of the sun. But what happen if we change the gravity? So without the gravity, this soft guide evolution was pushed very, very fast. And in a few days, the cells of these vines, I thought it was, French vines like Cabernet, something like that, which in few days changed the cells. And these experiments are are made in order to prevent the the climate change, the new disease. And, it's a very interesting topic, but it's it's something that is already happening. So I, I don't know, I believe in the in the scientists and the science in general. So I'm okay. I feel like we can go about it. We have to try everything, and we have to be fast because it's already happening. So Yeah. Yeah. So this is experiment very vital because, you know, the climate change is here. So, yeah, interesting. I didn't know about that. Interesting. Thanks for for bringing this up. I've gotta let's change a little bit the topic. The technical to the the marketing and the communication, because one thing that caught my attention at Varian is the beauty of the labels. It's so beautiful. Oh, it's very, like, you have a lot of care with the labels. How you present yourselves in the social media, in the bottles. And this is one of the things that caught my attention when I met you guys in two thousand nineteen. Like, you have that wine that dodie can met. So and have a lot of sub lines, bio, Colazione, fashion edition, which is different ways to communicate your wines. So talk a little bit about this various line, various lines of wines, how you define this that this way of communicate. And how does impact the the sales and the brand awareness? I mean, for sure, the marketing is very important. Because we say that, thanks to the marketing, you you you have the the first, sales. Then you need the quality to have the second, the third one, and and and circle on. So that marketing is very is very important. In terms of approaching the the final consumer. And, in our case, is, my sister, Marcia, who is in charge in the, as a marketing directors. And, of course, we are surrounded by smart people who works with other designers who help us and try to apply Baraglione philosophy to to our labels to our bottle, which is a mix of, tradition and, and innovation, I would say. And, of course, we have a different lines. So we we start from the, I would say, the, the medium level because we we don't, we don't have a entry level wines. So the Dodicea Mazzo, Dodicea Mazzo means twelve point five, which is the hard call volume. So that's why the name, Dodicea Mazzo. And, is our best seller. So thanks to the Dodice Aneadza, which is a line, that we create for people who are not, that much into the wine. So they are having the first approach to the wine. So they are very easy, wines, easy to drink, but very well balanced. But it's also, the the wine that you can have with your friends, during, a normal authority table. So that's not something complex, just a good glass of wine. This is the, the the phi philosophy of, of the doditionazzo. And then, of course, we can grow in in quality and, complexity, and everything with the other lines, like Papaleo, call it Cuna Privata, which won the, Trebri Gambarosa. Mhmm. For example, and, but the the keyword of, our wines for my father as I said, is the balance because my my father wants this the wine has to be drunk. So we we have, the easy wine. We have the wine for the we have the meditation wine, which are those wines, that doesn't need to be fair with food, for example. Okay. Let's give you emotions. Let's give you something. But at the end, you have to drink it. Yes. That's true. You don't have to comp to contemplate them. So that's why I think in my opinion, all our wines are very balanced and, very easy to be drink. Are you enjoying this podcast? There's so much more high quality wine content available from mama jumbo shrimp. Check out our new wine study maps. Our books on Italian wine including Italian wine unplugged, the jumbo shrimp guy to Italian wine, Sanjay, Lambrusco, and other stories, and much much more. On our website, mama jumbo shrimp dot com. Now back to the show. Interesting. Yeah. And I have to say, I I can easily find the dough that you met, so here in my town, which is globalization. Here we are, but, yeah, it's amazing that you it's a very good wine, and for Brazilian standards, are it's very, not expensive, and it's a very good wine. So, yeah, that's why I was so curious because I think it's the the the I don't know if it's the the the the the most, known wines from, anyway, another thing I want to ask you about is the Papali wine talking about Nom wine. Right? I'd like you to talk about the story behind this wine name and how that influenced an unusual contact with Vatican some years ago. This is a very interesting experience. Yes. Like, the Papala, was created in the two thousand eight, from my father, because we have, a place close to our winery, which is called the contrada Papale, or Papale area. Because, those vineyards were owned by the first and the only pope, from Pulia, Kaye Sanchez, in seventeen hundred. And, that's why he chose this, this name. And then in the two thousand ten, we had another amazing harvest like this year. So he wanted to give more importance to the Papale, and he created also the Papale gold, Papale, So an upper level of the of Harlem. And there is a is the the the label is very beautiful because there is a the article of Naples journal about the story of the celebrations by monks, by nuns, on the streets, because of the new hope. And it's the original one. And also the sign of the Vatican City is the original. And, thanks to our businessman from California, we We we have a we had an article on the journal, on a famous journal because they bought sixty cases of Papaleiro and the he gift them, to to the new pope. And we didn't know anything about that, but we had, preemptible on journal. So it was amazing. We we still don't know who is this guy, but thanks to him. Yeah. The the the the ones are in the Vatican now later. So it's, yes, it's very cool. So interesting. That's something that is very interesting because the communication, the brand, the care, is that that makes a result. And it's a marketing tool, later. So you can know it's the Papale wine. It's real Papale wine because the papa itself, himself got the wines on because of that. So Yeah. I think he appreciated that. Definitely. It's papa, francesco. Right? Yeah. That's right. Yeah. Yeah. Right. It's so funny story. And, also, I want to, mention the use of augmented reality and labels. That's something that you guys use, right, for the particular line, luxury. Right? Yes. Talk a little bit about this. So this label, which is called the masseria pizzeria long. Masseria is, our shadow, I would say. But, in Korea, we called them, masseria. And, so we we wanted to dedicate a label to our company, for the century, and we choose the, we choose to to produce this bottle only from the vineyards of the of our Warmaseria. And it's a blend among Primitivo, Negramaro, and Aljanico, which are the three grapes variety that we that's grow in, in our, peanuts. So, of course, there is a very high selection on the on the bunches, on each line, and, it's a very, as you said, the luxury, bottle. And so my, my sister, it is, amazing idea to to add the augmented, the, the AR on the on the label. And, with a cure, thanks to a cure code. If you if you use your phone, you can see, the difference between variety, gross into the label with all the, animals like bees and birds, all around. And, it's follow the the the the rights of the of the grapes. So the first, the first is the primitiva grape. Then you have the negamado, and, the last one is the the yankee. And it's very beautiful. Oh, so you just use a QR code. You don't need the app to to to to hear it. No. No. No. No. Because the QR codes link you on a, on a website. I mean, link on on the website, and then you can use it back Of course, there is I mean, this is just the the the the first idea. Then, you can work on it, sir, there are many new ideas that's I mean, I I cannot tell you right now, of course. Okay. It's just the start, I would say. Yeah. Let me start. Yeah. It's just about innovation and communicating a difference with to try to reach different audiences. So I think it's it it works, definitely. So get getting a link about this new communication, new ways to present ourselves. I want to talk about the video game, wine game that Farfadoni released this year. How did the idea come about and what was the game like? And, anyway, talk talk a little bit about that. Yeah. The game, was about, a way to, to teach, to, to improve the culture about the, the the grape, the vine, about, to the final consumer. So, thanks to this, up to this video game, playing, you you you reach, you had a lot of information about the video first, then the one production, and then finally, the the the the the bottling process. And it it was very funny because the the the main character was my dog at Cola, which is the guardian, which is the guardian of the master. Yeah. Actually, it is very famous. All our users, our clients, our consumers know him because the on our social media is always, you know, all all around our pictures. And, you know, it it was a a way to educate the final consumer. And we had a very good response. Not only from, from millennials, not only from genzet, but also by but also from a holder people. Because they're very curious, very interested on it. And so we're very satisfied, from this project. Mhmm. Are there any ideas that you guys want to repeat? Like, this initiative future or do something like a video game again? I don't know. Hey, you don't want to talk about it or you just don't know. I I I can tell you that, I don't know if, we will use, again, a video game, but I think it's very important to educate the final consumer, to to let him, understand about the quality, about the passion, and about the hard work that you need. What's I mean, what what there is behind a wine bottle, which is not that's, which is not normal because not all the people are, know very well all the all the process. And I think that's tends to the education. You can, you can have something back in sales, but also in brand awareness. But, also in in wine culture, because, I mean, the culture is always something positive in my opinion. So if we can improve the the culture of the wine, thanks to the video game or in some some other way, we are we are happy of it. Yeah. Usually, usually, people has no idea how how hard work is to produce a bottle of wine. How many months you have to spend that hard work, the how those desperation, guys. Oh my god. It's going to rain. It's not going to let's see. Oh, this is the time. So it's very important to people give value to that, not only to the final product. So Exactly. Exactly. You know, and sometimes sometimes, I mean, without words, when we we we speak with some clients, you know, with some restaurant that, on January, or on December, they they they already wants the the the new the new harvest, the new wine. I say, come on. Give me six months, almost, you know, and But but the market is like that. They push you because the everything should be new. The every everyone wants everything, and fast. So thanks to this this way. I mean, thanks to the education. People can understand better. What's what is, I mean, what means make the wine, making wine? Yeah. Definitely. I think education is everything, and also communicating your wine is very important. And Yeah. If you're not communicating well, you probably you have impact on your sellings. It's hard to go online if you you cannot communicate it well, which is something that I really admire, about that communication is very good. Like, seeing your social media, like, you feel your line before drinking it, which is very important. The design, like, I mean, the the last, pieces of marketing that you put in social media, like, the freshness, bringing the freshness of the the label, like, Murphy, the this is something very beautiful, and I think that Variani does very well. So, and I want to to to to to ask you about these ideas about, like, for some, let's let's try to to make us summer wine. So let's communicate to the summer wine. So let's bring people in the beaches and put in this website in the social media. So how that works and and and and how this this idea film, you are a very traditional library. It's not something that is usual. So talk a little bit about that. Yes. It that's true, but, as I said previously, we we are lucky because Pulya now as a region is becoming famous, is becoming a name in the around the the the the tourism markets. So the we we use, of course, this this tractor, for for our position. So what we try to do is to match our product with our beautiful environments like beaches, like the sea, like the weather, which is amazing. I mean, in full light summer for eight months per year, it's such a paradise. The food the food is crazy as you know. Yeah. Yeah. And the and and and the wine and the wine too. So that what what we want to do is to bring the people from all around the world, from United States, from Vietnam, from Denmark, to bring them into the pool. From the social media, using social media. The and then, of course, if you are able to reach in this way, the final consumers, and then you You are okay because if they understand the product, if they understand your your your philosophy, and if they see a correlation between what you show, what you communicate, and what you give them, It's it's a win. Yeah. Totally. And it's an universal language. Right? I think you guys export for all around the world. So I think in Asian markets, you can understand that. A Latin America markets can understand that. Europe, and it's, It's very good. It really makes you try this wine, you know? Oh, do you see that there's meat, images? Oh, this wine has something about that. So I really want to try this one. Really makes people think about it. They think it's amazing. It's very good. The the the the work you guys do on social media and in the in the communicating on the labels in in a very, very interesting manner. Yeah. One more question I want to to to ask you with. You just brought, Pullia. Pullia's, becoming a big, region for two reasons. So I want to talk about, talk to you about wine and tourism at Vervaljoni, about the experiences you have in the winery. So when did it start and how it works, how is important in Vervaljoni revenues, it's something that's just in the beginning or tell tell us a little bit about that. Yeah. I would say that, it's just, at the beginning, because, it's not well developed yet. Okay. We just decided to to start with hospitality when we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, we, into the wine house, but many, I would say, maybe these people are crazy, but, maybe they're not. It's it's because you are there all the time, right, why married. But then, I would say also that that thanks to the experience that me and my sisters, heads around the world, especially, I would say in California and, in a Australia where the wine tourism is very, very well developed. We understood that it's a needs of the markets that we have to satisfy. And, So we started in the last two years, I would say, to invest more, to dedicate to dedicate more time on it, and now we can offer, of course, the wine tasting, but also some experience, in the in the cellar, but also are around our olive trees or in the vineyards, but there are many, many other new project that's just needs, of course, sometimes, but, we are working on them. And, we will be ready for all the requests, of, our clients. Yeah. No. I I, I, I, I have a personal, experience in Veravallone because, as I said at the beginning, in two thousand nineteen, I went there to a party and was amazing. It is very curious that vulnerability didn't had one to reason until that year because two thousand and ten was three years ago. It was so awesome. It's like there were bits, cooking classes, pasta classes, and everyone. This was full of people there. They're having the great time of their lives, so it was so an amazing experience. And, of course, with the wines all there of office, There was in, in, Maseria Pisarello. Right? Yes. Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah. And it's a beautiful place. Oh, thank you. But in my opinion, it's because for us, as you say, all that food, Oh, that's fine. All the people. It was, a normal situation also between my family. In my family, we are we are a lot of people. Writing that on every Sunday, we have the tradition, to have the lunch altogether, you know, and we are, like, seventeen people. Wow. And we are and we are not told. So to have, to share, it's it's it's normal for for for as a family, as a winery. I would say it's, it's a matter of culture of my region. So that's why we we we needed more time to to to understand that what we were done was, was the wine tourism, but, not, I would say the it's having people in your home. It's who's a big scale. Right? Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. A big scale. Right. Yeah. Yeah. We just told me that it's not easy to do, like, every week or every month. It's, like, something. No. Of course. Also, because now, when when you say, Barballione, people people have, very high expectation. And, and we want to give back, the tire expectation. So that's why if we have to do something, we have to do it, very well. Yeah. Because you communicate big things and very, like, unique things. So people will expect a unique experience also because it's, like, a good thing and a bad thing to be good in communicating. It's like, the expectations are always high. So Yeah. It's Yeah. That's true. It's like, insustainability, you know, and all green washing. We have also communicating, just the, something invented, something not real. I mean, we want to, when we say something, it's because it's real, it's because we believe in it, it's because we can give that things to to the people. Mhmm. Yeah. And talking about family, as you said, your, your father, as you, the, the, you guys, your two sisters, and you to work in Varvalione. And, Stevy said at the beginning that she only knew the female part of Avallione, which is also very important because I read somewhere that, inclusion in gender equality is something very important for Variani. Like female employees in Variani are between forty percent or to fifty percent of the total. Tell us a little bit about that something that it was natural because of Marcia, because of Kika, and just that it's yeah. It because totally totally natural, I would say, because we are a private company. And so in a private company, if you are a good employee, you grow inside the company, and you stay in the company. So it and, the the the owner, in this case, my father, it doesn't have any I don't know. Why should, like, be more important to a man instead of a woman, if the woman is, is a very good employee. You know, so that we don't have is kind of, tote, I would say, in our company. So if if you're good, you stay. If you're not good, I'm sorry. Yeah. I would say it's the natural, evolution of the, of, of the things. But, but, of course, We we we know that there is, still, gender inequality, around the world, but, it's not our case for sure. Especially in the wine world. And, yeah, it's very hard for the main world. Yeah. I think that's I think that's my younger sister Francesca. She would be the next white maker because she is the only one who studied the analogy at university. And so this is also something, you know, I would say in the wine market because, there are not much, female, winemakers around. Right? Mhmm. Yeah. Yeah. No. No. Yeah. We we have We have some great stars in Italy, but it's that's not the road, the the the road that they're usual. Right? Like, you have a little puching basilicata, which is great. You have also Kiara. I don't remember her name, but he she's amazing. He is Romania. She does a amazing center of Es also. And but, yeah, that's not the rule. Yeah. In in per in percentage, I think that's, the the female winemakers, they are very I mean, they are they are below the fifty percent in metal payment. Yeah. Way, like, we we can still talk here, but if you if you have questions for the audience, we can bring it. Can you guys hear me? Yeah. Okay. So first of all, a great job. Good job. Listen. Angelo, I do have a question for you. So in your family, you have two siblings, Marcia and Franchesca. Have you got other other siblings? No. We are just three. Yeah. Three of us. So and then your your mom's still working in the company. Right? Yes. Yes. She's still company. Hey. Actually, she she supports my father, I would say. Okay. So how is the how is it one first of all, how are your roles divided? Who does what exactly in the in the company? And how do you get on? I mean, the the the roles are divided like that. My sister, she is, the marketing director. And she Marcia. Exactly. And she work also in the sales department, in the west side of the of the world, I would say. So she support the sales department, in the west. Myself, I mean, I'm I'm I will say that I'm the stalker of my father. What does that mean? Your official title is my father's daughter. Exactly. I I like to stress him a lot. Right. This is the end to end to be with him, as, Pablo said before, I'm trying to to to learn how to make the wine by the classic learning by doing. But during the year, I'm the sustainability manager. So now I'm very focused on the sustainability department, of the company. Now we're doing very big investments, on the energy and, on water, for example, in the industry, industry process. And then, of course, also, I mean, I'm in the sales department too, but in the east side of the world. So more in, in the Asia market, Australia and New Zealand supporting our expert manager. Okay. And what about our Francesca? And Francesca, my younger sister, now she's in California. She's doing her best there, in a in a famous winery that I cannot tell you the name. But, so she's, Because it's a secret, or you can't remember? The second. Okay. The latter. Yeah. Okay. Okay. That's fine. I thought it was like she was a spy industrial espionage going on here. Okay. Oh, you know, you have a you have to learn from the best always. So we have to you have to improve yourself. So it's a it's good that she She take this advantage on, on the on the market. So she has the possibility to do this experience. So she's doing this experience. And, after California, I don't know if she will be come back, or she will go to another binary somewhere. I don't know, but we are happy to end waiting for her in, in our winery. Okay. Excellent. Thank you, Angela. Very much. And Pablo, before I bring light on, I didn't ask you the learning objectives because I was saving until the end. So you tell us now the takeaways. What can we take away from your call with Angela Valle today? Well, we learned a lot about the about the wines of Horvallioni and the native grapes and the deal grapes that they are working now there, especially, we also, talked about a lot about the communication of Horvallioni, which is very effective and very good. In Italian brands. I think it's one of the best, in my opinion. And good stories. Good stories sells sells wine, which is the Papale one. It was an amazing story at the end. It is, a marketing tool until now, to nowadays. So, yeah, that's the the the things that we talked about here. And about family, very stable and working family in business. Not easy, but, yeah, a lot of, you know, compromise. You don't need to talk to your father. Right? Just kidding. Okay. Well, Pablo, thank you very much. You can still be the Italian wine Ambassador for us anytime. Yeah. I'll see you soon at nine two one. Right? You're coming. Yeah. I'm coming to Verona, and I'm very excited about it about the Gestic Cholastica. I also am going to pull up before Verona. So let me get my schedule there. Yeah. Angela. How are you? Okay. And, Angela, you should come to wine to wine, by the way. Have you ever been? Not yet, but Yep. So save the date. Okay. Save the date. Okay. Seven and eighth of November. Okay, Lika. Let's bring Lika back on. Shall I like that. Hi, Rika. Speaker there. Right? Alright. So we're two minutes. Okay. From seven. So for the next one, it's gonna be on Thursday, October thirteenth. So at six PM, So Anna Abu of Skyya, she actually asked me because she really wanted to interview Adolfo from Tinnitus Quato. I think she visited, the winery from the Jita Skolastica. So that's it. Alright. I love this. I love to connect the dots, and this is what we're all about. So thank you, Micah. See you, Thursday. And you, as you know, you all know, we will be replaying this on the Italian wine podcast where we have a lots of lots of lots of following. Tons of following. In fact, I think if not tomorrow, definitely this week, we will be hitting Four million. Yes. Okay. Incredible. So, great work. And thank you all for supporting us. And as we say, Chinchin with Italian wine people and see you next time. We hope you enjoy today's episode brought to you by the wine to wine business forum twenty twenty two. This year, we'll mark the ninth edition of the forum to be held on November seventh and eighth. Twenty twenty two in verona Italy. Remember, tickets are on sale now. So for more information, please visit us at wine to wine dot net. Hi guys. I'm Joy Livingston, and I am the producer of the Italian wine podcast. Thank you for listening. We are the only wine podcast that has been doing a daily show since the pandemic began. This is a labor of love and we are committed to bringing you free content every day. Of course, this takes time and effort not to mention the cost of equipment, production, and editing. We would be grateful for your donations, suggestions, requests, and ideas. For more information on how to get in touch, go to Italian wine podcast dot com.