Ep. 1162 Kevin Di Lucente Interviews Pierluigi Travaglini | Clubhouse Ambassador's Corner

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This clubhouse session was taken from the wine business club and Italian wine club. Listen in as wine lovers and experts alike engagements in great conversation on a range of topics in wine. If you enjoy listening, please consider donating through Italian wine podcast dot com. Any amount helps cover equipment, production, and publication costs. And remember to scribe and rate our show wherever you tune in. Hello, everybody. Welcome to the Thai and wine club on Club House. This is, of course, our Weekly. Weekly for a while, ma'am. More than a year. How which how many have we done so far, like a? Okay. So we've done this one is the sixty fifth episode. Oh my goodness. That's that's incredible. We have been incredibly consistent and persistent, and we've been doing every single week thanks to our clubhouse manager, Leica. So let let's give it a little cheer for her. Excellent. She's also new newlywed. Are you still married? Yeah. I'm still married. She just got married like a month ago. So anyway and then, of course, we have joy. She's right next door. Hello, Joy? Oh, wait. She's she's just there. Just not there kind of. I'm there. I'm there. My my my my phone is is old and slow. How are you? Joy. How is it going? Very well. Thank you. Do you want to share any news with us? There's so much news, but I think the most important one is the fact we are organizing a new donation drive Yay for Italian White Podcast, in November. And it's called I am a fan. And I know that's a weird thing, but it's a it's gonna be fun. We are actually going to be, having a link to our Patreon and to our Gofundme on our website Italian wine podcast dot com. And, yeah, that is what I'm working on at the moment. It's, super exciting, and we've got wine to wine coming up with lots of interviews that will be on the podcast next month and so many things. So take it away, Steve, because I'm gonna keep talking. Okay. Shut up. So joy, of course, is our producer for the Italian wine podcast. We have gone from, like, one, two episodes a week to, like, seven eight nine ten. So we are driving her absolutely mad. So she's always running around the office or rather, locked up in her little cubicle at the office, trying to produce all of these many episodes. And We do thank you very much, joy, and all of our, listeners out there because we are quickly becoming nearly three million listens just in the past twelve months. I think we'll actually get that. We've we've passed four million listens, and it all happened the past twelve months really. It really accelerated quite quickly. So thank you all for listening and tuning on with us. So thank you all very much. Now today's show, let's go on with the show. It's called the Ambassador Corner. You know the deal. The deal is that we have one of our members from the Via community, and we ask them to have a call with one of their favorite wine producers. And today, we have Kevin. How are you doing? Are you coming to this is a dude who's speaking italian from Buffalo New York? Hello? Twenty two. I can't remember. Oh, no. Unfortunately, because I work in wholesale, October, November, December, are very difficult times. Yeah. You know, ways. So, unfortunately, I won't be going there. Yeah. That's too bad because we've org also organized a Chitascolastica. Actually, three Chitascolastica. Immediately, following wine to wine, there's Chitilla dogs or there many people are going to Sicily, of course, one of favorites, Monque Fazco. Incredible program, including the truffle hunt. They're like fifteen wineries in four days. I don't know how they're going to do this. And then, of course, Frantra Corta. So that will be very exciting. We're sorry to miss you, Kevin. So Kevin, let me tell you a little bit about Kevin. Kevin did, the the course, the Vineital International Academy course, New York edition, and he came in with of course, his infamous, famous teal spittoon from bath, beauty, and beyond, or whatever that it's called. So, I wasn't very impressed that I was like, what is this guy thinking? And then he turns out to be the best of the class. So, very impressive, very studious and very smart dude indeed. So, Kevin, I know that you've been working in the wine world for I'm I'm looking up your, I'm stalking you right now on LinkedIn. So you were, of course, now you are, you're working for Weibo. Prior to that, you worked for David Bauer And prior to that, you worked for city wine merchant. But it caught my eye that prior to that, you were, some doing something else. How did you change from thalmic technician to wine? Well, if you if you dive even further CV, you'll notice that I have a degree in theater, which, you know, it it turned out to be not the most useful degree. Well, if you become an actor, I suppose. Well, I'm always kind of doing stuff like that, acting in improv and music. So I have my side topic, which, you know, at at one point, I would have liked to like those things to be my full time job, but, I'm very happy that I get to work in a field that I'm passionate about, especially, when I get to sell Italian wines. But so, essentially, I got out of, school, and I was looking for a job in Buffalo, New York. And there's some theater jobs around here, but, it's usually technical theater jobs. So I was just kinda scraping around looking for jobs, and I ended up, work finding that job working as a an assistant to the doctors and an ophthalmologist. And I was there for, I don't know, four or five years and, realized pretty quickly that if I didn't find something else, then that would be my career. And I wasn't very passionate about it. I never had an eye exam while I was there. Well, yeah. That's that's kind of a telltale sign there, Kevin. Yeah. Well, and then I had this, the serendipitous moment of of, discovering wine and, just being lucky to be able to land that job at the the wine store, which ended up being a windfall of information all in that three years span that I spent there and pretty much cemented the fact that I was gonna be, making a career of of wine. And then, you know, shortly after that, realizing Italian wine was definitely gonna be my focus and I I remember discovering that the Van Italy Ambassador program was actually a thing. And I said, oh, I'm absolutely doing that. Yes. And and and really, we are really lucky to have you on board because you're incredibly passionate, but very precise, very deep knowledge about Italian wine. So Well, thanks, Stevy. And I and if I can pay you guys a compliment, I think that the the program, if anyone is listening who's considering taking the program, I would say that CB and the team, Joy, and, like, and Cynthia, they all do an amazing job of just fostering a wonderful community where everyone feels included. And, it's kind of part of the reason why I wanted to take you know, the the program is to be a part of the community and feel like it belongs somewhere. Oh, well, thank you so much. Now with having said that, let's go on to the show, the real show where you will be interviewing today with I feel like I really need a right now. So tell us why, you've decided to choose, on the call today. It it's sort of a long story, but I'm gonna try and condense it as much as I can. So Yeah. Try. Try it. I will I will truly try because I really wanna talk to Peter Luigi. So, during the pandemic, I believe I connected with their, Instagram account, Tanuta Marte Rosa's Instagram account. And I, and I thought, oh, that's interesting. And then I realized that the wines were not imported in the US, so I kind of just put it on the back burner. To one day tasting the wines. My great grandfather is from a small town in Malize, and I also study Italian. So this September this past September, I spent two weeks in Malize in Adione specifically studying, you know, doing a language immersion course, but also with the intent to taste the wine as many wines as I could while I was there, it wasn't a wine trip where I was gonna, try any of the vineyards. But anyway, long story short, there was a wine shop in Nanyone I walked in. I immediately recognized the labels of Timothy Mark Dorosa because, they're beautiful labels. And I said, oh, I wanna try that. And the the the store owner of me, they said it was one of his favorite producers, and, and highly recommended it. So I I tried several different wines and and said, oh, these wines are amazing. I'm glad I got the chance to try them, and I'd like to help, you know, spread the the message of the winery. Oh, I must apologize. I really thought Travallini was from, Gartinara, but this is another Trevalini. It's from. Yes. So I'm sorry if you had Luigi. Sorry about my mistake. I am unfamiliar with, of course, Melissa, but I don't know very many producers there except, of course. But I'm looking forward to that then to learn more about that. So what are the learning objectives today? So it's it's, you know, obviously, you've just submitted that you don't know much about the region. So we're gonna talk a little bit about the region and the history. And, you know, this wouldn't be a a Van Italy Ambassador, podcast without or interview without talking about the Oct Talkters talked in a Sperridal, so we're gonna talk about TENTilia specifically. And that we're gonna get real geeky and have a lot of fun. Okay. I'm looking forward to that. Okay. Over to you, Kevin, I will come back. I will shut up now. And, maybe get a glass of wine. I'm not yeah. I think I actually have some tintelia in the office. And then I will join you towards the end to see if there are any other additional questions if we have more time. Okay? Sounds great. I'm usually the one that needs to shut up, though. Pierre, Luis. Hi, are you there? Hello, Kevin. Hello, everyone. How are you? Terrific. Thank you so much for, joining and agreeing to doing this interview. I'm really looking forward to our conversation here. Before we get into the questioning, I thought it might be a good idea to, have you you introduce yourself to the listeners and give yourself give everyone a background of who you are what your education is and, more or less how you, how you got into winemaking and and owning a a winery. Yeah. Thank you, Kevin. So, yeah, I'm through Regie. I'm with my brother, michele. I'm, one of the owner of, Kenuti Marosa. Kenuti Marosa is a is more winery, which is, located in Malaysia, which is, also a small region within within Italy. Before becoming a a one maker, I'm a chemical engineer. So, I've been, graduated, almost, I think fifteen years ago, and then I have started working as a process engineer. In a chemical company. But the, I mean, the log for, the area where I live, and the passion for, I mean, grapes and everything is around the the world of wine. Bring my brother and I to invest in this world and start making wine. So we are a pretty young, winer as I mentioned. We are making wine since, six years now, but we have a more, I mean, ancient history as, grapes, growing. This is, the third generation. So it's almost eighty years that we grow grapes and, in beginning, we used to sell, the grapes to other winery, And, just seven six six years ago, we started making, making wine. So that's me. Wow. That's terrific. So, speaking about the history, Let's talk about the history of Melizae in general. So when I was there in September, I learned about, something called Transzoumanza. And I, and I didn't know if that was something that kind of helped shape the area that you're in. I was more in the Alto Melissa, and that was a big part of, you know, how the towns came to be in in the history. Is that a part of the history of of where you are? And and if not, you know, what is some of the history of the area that goes back before your family was there? Yeah. The the what you call, Transumancer is really, I mean, well rooted in Mauriza. It's more related to the, animal farm, if I can say. It's not really, I mean, heavily related to the to the wine growing itself, except in the winery. Because what on Samantha makes, essentially, it's, during the the the summer, usually, who used to, let me say, how can I say in English, to breed animals? It's right. Alivale. Yeah. So we we should take this, this in Italian, I think. Yeah. And so the the the the farmer that, they used to breed, animals. So they used to take animals on the vine tanks on the mountains during the, the summer season because there was, a lot of fresh grass, which was food for, for animals. But during the winter season, when, I mean, obviously, on the mountain, he he was cold and we had a lot of, know. It was really impossible for, animals to have anything to eat there. So they used to bring old animals just working through the region, and they used to bring animals on the cross. So on the sea where it was much warmer. And, on summer, we had fresh crops there. So Transumasa is, like, this, round trip that, the farmer they used to make with animals, for, providing them food essentially. That that was, transplums. So but, I mean, we have, yeah, we have, a lot of, let me say, road of two months that we call, which, obviously, today is is not, yeah, what we call Chractory. This is today is a is a practice which is not, I mean, pierce to the anymore. So everything's changed. So this has been, abandoned. Like, I can say But we had this, what we call Chaturi, which, which are the raw the the older way that the the that farmer with animals, they used to work for moving from the mountains to the sea and by vice versa. Very interesting. I just thought that would be, something that would add to the, you know, giving people an idea of the background of the history of the region. Let's talk about the the temperature. So what is the climate like generally specifically where you're at, and has it changed over, the history of working the land? Is there an effective climate change? And do grapes grow everywhere in Melissa? Yeah. Melissa is, I mean, from from a one hundred point of view is, not not not really famous. I can say well well known, but, as a really ancient history in terms of, great drawings like, the majority of, of a center of Italy. I mean, so so in the past, we were just one big region with a brusso. You know, we have a brusso, which is close to us. We were, about eighty nineteen years ago, we were just one big region. And then after that, we just separated the and, we became an independent region called it, called Melissa. The climate here is really, I would say, a classical Mediterranean, I mean, climate. So it's really warm during summer. It's a good, level of humidity, humidity. We are essentially, campo marino. It's the town where we, where we are, where tenuto Martarosa, as the majority of, of land. It's on the sea. So the the we have a good humidity and it's pretty warm, also hot during, during summer. And, in in winter, it's, a really warm winter. It's not so, so rigid temperature. We can, The lowest we can reach is around the, zero one two c. So it's really, warm weather. I will, I I will say. So it's it's an ideal, weather or climate for having baniard and, adding them growing and, old grapes. So, I mean, reaching the right maturity before, taking, take taking up to the to the, to the seller. I mean, in this in the last years, I mean, when we are seeing, I mean, the the the the global warming, the climate issue, it's, also impact think, our region, we are seeing a cost and a continuous increasing in in temperature, especially during, during, during summer, where we have really hot, winds coming from, south. So from Africa, usually, which, I mean, it it turned, how it can really too negatively somehow impact our, our grades because, when this wind, is, is there It's really, I mean, around the forty c, and it turned literally to dry grapes and to dry also, the leaves on the on the on the inconvenience. So it's really something that we we are trying to fight as much as possible, but there is not really much that we can do. So you said there's not really much you can do. Is there anything that you can do? What are some of the things that that maybe that people are trying experimentally to combat this? But we we are trying to to to prepare the, I mean, the value add in the best, way that we can. So we are, essentially, we are not using any kind of, chemicals in the in our vineyards. So we can see that we are chemical free. Even if I'm a chemical engineer, you know, but we are, chemical free in our vineyard. So that means that also, for, for, we are not using any kind of pasty seat. We are not using any kind of disturbance. So we are just mechanically removing any any kind of, in the class that we don't want in, into Vineiard. We are, trying to making our banyard as sustainable as possible and consequently our our wines. We are not using any kind of, chemical fertilizer but only minor, mainly from cow or sheep. And this had somehow we are also what we do, right now in these days, we are sitting different, grasses in, in our area. Which they do you up during spring, and then they are, I mean, cut it and left on the soil. So they are going to enrich by, by, essentially, organic matter, the soil, which means to increase the fertility of the soil. And these are all are all practiced that had the the the vial to be more prepared to any kind of, extreme, obviously, extreme, climate, event. We also are removing a good part of the grapes that are on the on the on the plant. Just leaving few, consider that we remove about fifty percent of our grapes. So we we, essentially, we throw them away. So we they are they are just going to fertilize the soil. And that's because if the plant has less grapes, can better survive to this extreme, can better react to this extreme, condition. I love that. That's that's great. They're using just natural processes to make the grapes a little bit more resistant to things that are, changing in our environment. So speaking about the vineyards, what are the soils like there. And and and are they is there one general soil in Malize? Is there lots of different soils? How did they form? And and how does it affect, the grapes as they grow on the vine? Does it does it impart minerality? I know that's a hot topic, but, talk a little bit more about the soils, please. Yeah. Sure. I mean, I can say that we have really I mean, we can split the region in, in two areas because we have an area which is on, on the sea. Well, essentially, we have a more sand and clay, on on this side. And, I mean, here, we can can have really good white wines because, they are really intense from, no point of view. And the, the other parts of Melissa, which is the, what we call, Alto Mauriza, which is high moly. So where we have, mountains and hills. This, this area is more, I can carry I can carry area. So we are more carbonated there. We are the, it's more It's an area which we can, which can better, express the red wines. And this is where the ten Kia typically, take place because we are completely different soil there, which can better explain, at the interior. So, essentially, we are on cost, a really good, soil for white wine, on the, monteins and hill man amended mountains. We have a good soil for, for red wines, which, Tim Tilly, the, takes the majority of, of a of a of a banyard. Cool. Thanks for breaking that down. So Melissa is obviously a smaller region. I think it's the second smallest in terms of production in the country. Are there a lot of producers there? How many producers are there right now? Do you know, numbers wise? Yeah. We, Every year, we have a new new producer which, I mean, came and we can add it to the list, but we are no more than twenty right now. Wow. Yeah. That's that's still relatively very small. So talking more about the the history of your family, and you said that they first, planted vineyards in the nineteen fifties. Is that is that right? Yeah. It's, more more precisely in nineteen thirties. So it's more than ninety years that we are growing grapes. Yeah. So how did how did your family originally acquire the land? And do you have sites in you have, obviously, sites in both Altimaize and closer to the coast? Yeah. The, I mean, the the the issues like that, and, my grand, grandfather, my grandmother, they they are from a brusso, which, from a town in a brusso, which is about, I think, hundred kilometer, far from, where we are today. And, essentially, they were looking for a place where to where to, I mean, grew up their family, and say that they were some, They also were attempting to leave the area where they grew up, which was in, in a booth. So they start, started working, and, they found this area, which where we are now, which was, almost, desert. There was a whole, a lot of trees there. There was no farmer at that time. So they moved there. They found this, this, this area, which was, which has a nice view on the on the sea. And they decided to to buy that land to start, I mean, farm at that land. And so this is, what they did. They moved there. They they they bought to the the land, and, they, I mean, started growing their family in this, in this land. So, essentially, it's what they did So in the really beginning, they were, I mean, farming and and blasting, something else, maybe just, other other other things. And, few years later, they decided to to start the growing, grapes. So they declined their feast, they first baniard, which is almost, yeah, more than eighty years ago. And then from there, I mean, they're starting, them seeing that was a good business because it was easy to sell grapes for making wine. And so they decided to purchase additional land, and they started, I mean, growing and, in this, in this, in this, in this way. So this is how we how we started. This is those those are parents from, my my my dad's my dad's side. From my mom's side, what they did, the because Mauriza, the time it was, and also reach, I mean, region. I mean, and there was not so it was not so easy to find the job. So they they decided to immigrate that they moved to France. Are you enjoying this podcast? There's so much more high quality wine content available from mama jumbo shrimp. Check out our new wine study maps. Our books on Italian wine including Italian wine unplugged, the jumbo shrimp guide to Italian wine, sangiovese Lambrusco, and other stories, and much, much more. On our website, mama jumbo shrimp dot com. Now back to the show. And there, my grandfather, he was working for he started working for, a famous bunny at the famous, woman, which is dead, which is, not sure. I'm, I'm, I'm pronouncing a rider name. You're asking the wrong guy to pronounce anything from French. Yeah. So, he he worked there for, about ten years. And so he learned the, you know, the making wine, you learned everything around the the the world of of wine. And so when he was back, he was from, a town which, was in, in the center of Mauriza. So he was not on the costume. But when he was back, He purchased the land on, in Cabo marino. So when we are today as well, and he decided to plant in Baniard because he learned how to make wine because he want to start making its own wine. So he wanted the he's what he did. He he he purchased land. He started, I mean, he growing, grapes and, making wine for himself, obviously, and he was starting, also making, wine for some friends. And so is how we my brother and I also learned on making wine. So I remember when we were when we was tried, we were, always with our, grand grandfather making wine. I mean, our busting grapes and making wine. And then we'd drink wine, obviously, as well. It was, it was really nice. So, we we grew up in this environment. We grew up in this, contest in this farm. And, I mean, and aware, I mean, with us also, you know, as it, grew up or so, the passion for this world, for the winery, and, everything is around the world wide. Well, so I think that's really interesting, that they were in all your grandfather was in All sauce for a while. Is there anything definitively French about, the way that you make wines or is or if you kind of, what you can say nowadays is if kind of, you know, your own process based on a lot of different influences. Or is there something directly from Alsa? So you can say, we're still doing this practice that they would do in Alsas in the winery today that, based on what my grandfather taught us. I'm not sure because, I mean, the this word, is, based on the history, but it's also, I mean, really, IP's environment. And so things they are evolving and changing continuously. Try to improve all with everything, improving quality, improving the way you are growing, you know, and, are basing your, your, your grapes. So everything is, is really changing fast. And, I think the practice that we are using today, are for sure best in class practice that I'm sure also in France, have been used and, are used, are used today. So for sure, a lot of learnings, But, I think we are, if you step ahead to what, I mean, our, grandfather teaches us in terms of making wine. Terrific. Yeah. I think you're very fortunate to have such a wonderful family history in, in the region and, you know, influenced by other regions as well too. So I think it would be a good time to start discussing the wines that you produce at Tinuit de Martorosa. And, you know, what is your production level? How many different wines do you make? So if you could talk a little bit about that, please. Yeah. Sure. So, as I mentioned, we are, a little more winery. So we define we we used to define ourselves. We are an artisan, winery, and we are a family, business, winery. That's because, we produce something between seventy thousand, eighty thousand bottles per year. This is typically our standard. And we make, I mean, seven seven different seven different labels. But I like to to focus on few on few of them. So, obviously, we we produce white wines as I mentioned before, we are in Campo Barino. So we we are on the sea. And, we have we have some vineyards which are on, on a soil, which I mentioned, it's mainly sand and clay, which it's really, well placed the well, yeah, disposed for producing, white wines. White wines are really mineral, really fresh. So really, I I would like to say summer wine, you know, because, typically, you, you like to drink whites, wines, mainly in summer than than winter, typically, in winter, I mean, you prefer the lead one. So we produce fialo. Fialo, I'm sure, you know, it's white grape, is one of the most ancient grape that has been, robasted in Italy since, since ever. Some studies says us that the family has been imported in Italy from, from, from, the Greece and, through the through the Sicily. And then he started, I mean, escalating all the in Italian Peninsula. And in Malaysia, we are the only one which are the are making Fiana. We like Fiana because it's really smelling wine. It's a really, fresh wine for, our, fresh wine because it is really of, it it it's a a really good activity. But what I like, I enjoy most, Ociano is the greatest man of the wine because he remember, yellow fruit, typically, tropical fruit, which could be passion fruit, could be mango, could be NNS, pinapple. So all those, smells are typical of, of, of, you know. We are really happy about this product, and, it's selling really well. It's really represent our idea of, a white wire. Then we have another one. No. Go ahead. No. I I also like to talk about Intilla because Tintilla is, probably the, the future of, Melissa, in terms of, of wine. Tintelia is, is a, an outoctone grape, which grows only in a Melissa region. Which, has been, or vast at probably hundred years ago, three hundred four hundred, five hundred years ago. So there are some, historical, documents saying, saying that, but, obviously, there is no, we are not sure about that. Truly, yes, tintillo has been, abandoned in favor of other, I mean, variety, variety, which, went more productive, like, multiple channel or Trebiano for the white wine, for the white, or, Merlo, or, old friends, also, Mariah. Just because, considering that in Mauriza, we had, typically, ma the the the majority of producers, of Farm that they used to sell, to sell grapes. So as much in terms of quality, as much, as grapes, I was able to harvest. So I had much weight, and I was I was paid more. Because in India, is producing is a low, I mean, yield, variety. So it's producing not so much like, multiple channel, for example, was, somehow, abandoned, for, for for for this reason. But in the last twenty years, just because, it's a really nice, grape, and thanks to the, to the, to the young binaries, Also, thanks, to to Nutematerasu, who, invested in this, in this, grape, and, we planted few, actors of this, few land of these, these grapes, just because we think that this is the future. So thanks to a lot of small, wineries. This grape, is finally back. It's back and, I mean, is, somehow enabled and it's, it's building its own, place within the the the wine market, which is huge, as you know. So can you trace the origin of this grape varietal similar to what you suppose theano originated from Greece. And, were were these grapes there when your family first arrived, or did did they were they grapes that your family started planning after the fact when they were discovered later? Yeah. A better region of this grape, there isn't, I mean, some, some idea. There is no clarity, obviously. We are not sure about the that. But few few people, they say that it's coming from Spain. Just because the end, and the name Tintilia, it it becomes from, tinto, which in, in in Spain, does mean, heavy red color. I mean, if I can save. So heavy heavy color, white. But this is not, not sure this. Few other stateings that it's, it's, like, a brother of another variety that we have been, in, in Sardinia. But also here, if we match the, DNA DNA of Tintilia and of those other varieties, varieties, they do not match. So it is really not clear, where Tintill is coming from. The more probably thing is that, is coming from from Spain, but in Spain, there is no, any other variety which can match the the interior DNA. So that that's really not clear the the the the history of this, this grape, but it's different to any other grapes that we know. So what are the characteristics of Tinilia? What should someone who's tasting once for the first time expect to be typical of the aromas and the flavors and the structure and the color? Yeah. To meet interior, if I have to tell you, continue in one word, I will use elegance. Because, to meet in Tilia is a really elegant wine. The first, actually, the I I'm talking about my, my Tilia, because, since Tilia, we are making a typically mixed two years of aging, part of it makes twelve months in, into no, which is five hundred liters, in a good environment. So the first thing that you use mail when you you you you you you take the interior is, for sure, some sweet notes, which is coming, like vanilla, which is coming from the boot, in this process of aging. But then you have a lot of fruit because this is our idea of, of wine. It's coming from Fruit. So the first thing that first thing that you have to to choose man for sure is fruit. So you will, smell a lot of a red fruit, and this is the majority of, of what you can, you can see. So you have some, or some tobacco. You can have some, literature. I don't know in English. How how to say You know Kevin? No. I don't. Someone else on that? C v Joy like a. Licorice. Liquorice. Yeah. That makes sense. Yeah. I was like a Ani Aniccha. No. It's different. It's it's different. Okay. Yeah. And then, but the most interesting thing of interior that you use men also some spice, like a black black pepper, something like that. Which is, really unique. I mean, you cannot find another, in, you can find it only in one or two other, variety. So that's something that makes the interior great. But the other thing is that there's so, I mean, it's, Tintilla is really good wine for long aging. So you can have Tintilla aging, in a bottle for ten years, twenty, probably twenty years, and he will, he he will be still a great, a great wine. We are not there yet. So our first, vintage is two thousand sixteen, but we are, I mean, aging those bottles because we are curious to see how we'll be twenty years from now. Well, I can say that I did try your tintelia when I was there, and it definitely struck me as a line that had the structure that would would definitely be able to age. And and I can tell you it was definitely the most impressive tintelia that I had when I was there. So I really enjoyed it. Thank you, Tim. Yeah. So, let's talk about the the labels of your your wines. So my first introduction to your winery was just your Instagram account. And, you know, the the labels are quite vivid and there's some gold, you know, embellishments on the on the labels and whatnot. So who designs the labels? Who came up with the concept? Is there different, patterns and and symbolisms to the, the the labels themselves for individual wines? Yeah. I mean, the the the idea behind the label is, beyond the label was to try to, I mean, to attract as much attract as much as possible, the, the, the potential customer. I can say, like, surprising the, the customer because, I mean, if you look at our labels, are something that is probably completely different to what is the standard idea of labels that we have, webinar. So that was thought. To try to differentiate our, wine to what is, the rest of the market. Mainly, we were looking at the Melissa at that time. So I think that we are producing wines that are significantly different to the other ones making, in the region. And there was also the idea. So surprise the customer and to to say, hey, this is something you. This is something completely different to what you are testing today. But behind that, we tried also to to have in our label, so some, also some history of, of, or Mauriza. If you look at the, labels of a Fiano or the label of a mock Maskato, for example, or the label over tintino Roset, those label are representing, what we call, I mean, it's a an handmade, work. How can you say that? It's like a a tissue, which is, I mean, I'd made. Yeah. So I I was when I was in, pierluigi, when I was in, Melissa, we visited Esernia, and they have a tradition of of making lace. Is that what this is? Merlletto? Yes. What we call, it's made with the bobbin lace. Yeah. Something like that. Merlletto Tomballo is what we call. Yeah. You're all right. And so those labels, they are really representing these So they are on, silver, color, gold color just to represent, I mean, part of, somehow the history of movies and what we we do there. And so it's like a combination of those two things. Very good. Well, I I spend a lot of time for my job in and out of retail stores and restaurants, and I hadn't tasted your wines, and I walked into a store and immediately recognized them. So I think that the labels are working quite well. So, You mentioned earlier that you you use natural farming practices, and I think it's it's it's it's quite interesting that you're a chemical engineer, and this is a route that you chose, which obviously shows that you have quite a respect for the land. Was that something that you your family was doing early on, or is that a decision that you made more recently? We we started doing that, you know, coming in the last and, in the last decade, last ten days, that's any of I can say. Just because we're not under the, that, I mean, we really don't need all these chemicals in, in, in, in natural. I mean, natural can provide everything, we need. Network can provide everything, I mean, trees and, grapes they need. So everything is done. So there is no need to add anything. And I can tell you that, by eliminating all the the the chemical fertilizer. We have seen responding the soil positively. So we have seen the soil through the years changing. Also, thanks to the practice to adding, I mean, manor and, I mean, seeding, seeds and cutting them during, and, obviously, cutting the the the the the grass during spring, which means to enrich by, organic matter of the soil. We have seen the soil be more soft, if I can say. Okay? So less rude, less, less dry. And, I mean, that's the proof. And, also, it's ten years that we are, are fasting and making seven year we are making wines without chemicals. And, so we are proving that that's possible. So there is no need for all those chemical stuff. We I mean, we need I like the idea of being sustainable. I like the idea that when a customer drink a glass of wine, He knows that, he's made the, is as natural as possible, which is an environmental, environmentally friendly wine, and this is some sustainable wine because, I mean, we need to take it to the future. We need to take it to the next generation. And, that's all that's why we are doing that. Yeah. I think there's many people that would agree with you and and are are very happy that you made the decision to switch over to that. My myself included. So let's have a little bit of fun and and ask a hypothetical question. So Let's say that you, had to choose one other region outside of Malaysia. It could be another part of Italy or or really anywhere else in the world to make wine. Where would that place be and why? But, I think having that, I mean, if the the the the climate is the right one, I mean, the the the, I mean, if the the the, the vanier can survive to the extreme, I mean, climate I would say that, I would like every every region just because, I mean, what we do, it's a way to win, but essentially what we are telling with our wines, we are telling our territory. And I'm sure if I will take the tinctilla, which grows in Mauriza, and I will, go for example, in, I don't know, North North America or, in France or wherever. I mean, grapes are easy to grow. I will make a a really good wine there as well, which obviously will be different to what I do in Marisa. And this wine will be the expression of a different territory, what in France they used to call terroir. It it would be a different expression of a different condition, different inclement, a different way of maybe are busting the the and growing up grapes. And, I mean, I think we'll be good everywhere, but, I like, I really like, I mean, places where, it's too cold for having, for having any kind of, of a wines, of of grapes growing. I will say patagonia, but it's too cold there. So that's my idea. I mean, we can do good wine everywhere if we have the good the good knowledge and the good log for what we do. That's great. I I put you on a spot a little bit with that question, but I appreciate. There was a little bit of a political answer where you, you kind of indirectly told us that you like to make wines, that case, like, the place they come from, and I'm, and I'm quite happy that you're doing it in Moise. So, do you have any future plans, at the winery plants to, get different vineyards in different places, experiment with different varietals, or do, more more with TENTilia? Yeah. We we strongly believe that TENTilia is the future of, of, Melissa, will be the, the, for sure, the fundamental for our growth. So that's why we are investing on TynTylia. We are going to plant a new, a new veneer of TynTylia in another, region of Mauriza. So we are trying to differentiate as much as as much as possible. So we have some tintelia in, in a town which is close to to Campo, which is, Kasakalinda, but we are looking for other, soil in other, in in other town, just because, these three areas, they will bring us different it will be different wine, you know, because the wine that we made in, Casa delaney, different to the wine that we made in, in Fosalta, which is different to the wine that we make in Campolina, just because they are the expression of different territory. So this, we are doing that. We are planning that because that will reach the complexity of our wines, and that can better be the expression of, of Melissa. And we are also planning for, I mean, making a new, a new one area. So we want to expand. Essentially, we are in a smaller, in in the most structure now. We want to expand it because we are growing. And, we need to prepare for a high operating, fast growth. So is there a consortium in the region or a group of people that are trying to help market the the the wine in the region outside of the region right now? Yeah. There is a consortia of TINTilia, which we call consortia, of TINTilia. We should work on, I mean, talk about TINTilia outside the region, you know, so and, having TINT alone, everywhere all around the world. So we are, we are part of this consortium. We are, working on that. It's not easy because the, the region is really small. And just for the quantity of bottle that we annually produce of Tin Taylor is a is a really small. So it's it's challenging. It it's probably not enough for, having it in India, well known, outside of, Italy and, I mean, all over the world. So we we should we should grow. And, I'm I'm one that which thinks that, in Mauriza, we should, remove everything and have only, one year of of Tina. Because it's the only out of October grape and, I really like Tina. Well, I definitely do as well. So going back to your your winery proper, so you work with your family, and it's you and your brother that founded the winery. Correct? That's right. So what what is it like working with your family and who does what? Because are your parents also involved in the winery? Yes. They are part of this project. They are fully involved. Yeah. So are there specific jobs that everyone has, or do you all kind of pitch in in in every single aspect? We have we tend to have some, dedicated area where, each of us would, typically, focus on. Obviously, my mom and and my dad, they used to be more, supportive. Okay. So they are trying to to support us where it's more needed, mainly during the harvesting season where, I mean, the work is really, really harder and it's really, probably too much. We can work up to twenty four hours per day for making our, Lucy wine and white wine. It's a really intensive time. And so we really need the extra extra extra people there. But the majority of the the the majority of activities are performed by my brother and I. So my brother is the one which, I mean, takes care about, I mean, customer relationship is the one which he used to sell wine. So it's, It's the interface with the customer. So he's the one which, it's mainly taking care about marketing part. And, is also, I mean, coordinating all the the activities in in, in the vanadium. So he he coordinate, somehow sup supervise is the supervisor of, the the work and then test that needs to be performed at the true decisions. I'm the one which is more, I mean, dedicated that, which works more in, in, in, in the, binary. So I'm the one which, I mean, worked with the with wine directory. I'm the one which, work in the lab, checking the the some quality parameter of our our wine. So I run the analysis I checked that everything is fine. I work with, our consultant, which is, in Italy, I say an oligo, not sure in English was the right word. So Yeah. The winemaker. Yeah. Sorry. So I work with the with the winemaker, which, I mean, works for us. So I'm the one which make the the the oldest task within, within the, the the wallet. Oh, that's wonderful. So, you're not currently, in the United States. Correct? You don't have an importer in the United States? We do not yet. Yes. Okay. But you you may maybe would consider one and and be open to conversations. Correct? Yes. Yes. We already have in the past due approach, but nothing that, has been, I mean, which move forward? Yeah. No. I totally understand that, but I would also, part of this is, purpose of this interview is also maybe, you know, put your name out there a little bit more and maybe if someone is looking for a nice, producer from Melissa then perhaps they'll get in touch with you. And, maybe it'll work out for for both for all parties involved. Alright. So I have another fun question for you, and then we'll probably wrap up shortly after this. But, What is one of your favorite places in your vineyards, that you feel lucky to visit every time you're there? And and do you have a a special memory from a time in the vineyard with, with your brother or your family? Is there is there a funny story that happened? And I know I'm kind of putting you on spot. But is there anything you'd like to share even if it's just one little one little sliver of the vineyard that you always make make a point to go and visit? But, to be Kevin, I mean, there is not really a a place is more, being together in the in the money out. So it's also the same, same thing that I see when you I mean, I say it's a family, it's it's a family business, this one. So the most the which I like more of these activities is that I can spend time with my family. I can work with my family. We can I mean, I can stay with them and, I mean, we can project? We can make project. We can, ceresal it's either result of what we have done altogether. So staying together, I think this is the power of Tanuta and also this is, what I re really enjoy more in the in the van yard because, I mean, working the wine yard is really hard work. But being, together is what really is what you really like. And, this is, what enjoy enjoying more. That's absolutely wonderful. And, I think that's a good place to wrap up. Pier, Luigi, it's been an absolute honor talking to you. Thank you for taking the time. And, I will hand you back over to CB Kim if she has any questions or if there's any questions from the audience, if anyone has any questions for Peter Luigi. Steve, are you there? Yep. Hi. Thank you very much. Hold on one second. There you go. Congratulations. Guluigi. You did a great job. I do seeing that you're looking for an importer stateside. I would like to ask you a question just like very an an overview with regards to, I see you have eight labels, eight different labels. Is that correct? That's right. And how many, like, how many bottles do you produce of each? Just so that we can contextualize a little bit of your production. It it depend by the, obviously, the the the wine, but we are between, five thousand and twelve hour twelve thousand per per, the rich bottle. Okay. So is it, fair to say I mean, obviously, you're focused on TENTilia as we've learned, but what is your signature wine? Is it the IGT or is it the Antico Paudre, which is, which is more Monteco channel? I would say, tintelia. It's a tintelia de Melissa. Okay. Well, thank you so much. I I love the questions about the family. We didn't quite get an answer. I think like who does what exactly, but I look at the picture in your website and you just just exude, you know, like a nice family. So congratulations. And good luck to you, Pierluigi, and, hope to meet you in person sometime. And if you'd like to, you know, get get in touch with us, I mean, at wine to wine, for example, we're doing a b two b b two b event. That could have been a good place for you to have participated, but maybe next year. So we keep in touch and, you never know. Sure. Thank you, Stev. Thank you, Kevin, for, this really nice discussion and, stay in touch. Okay. Thank you very much. Listen to the Italian wine podcast wherever you get your podcasts. We're on SoundCloud, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, EmailIFM, and more. Don't forget to subscribe and break the show. If you enjoy listening, please consider donating through Italian wine podcast dot com. Any amount helps cover equipment, production, and publication costs. Until next time.