Ep. 1834 Luis Reyneri interviews Oreste Dogliani  | Clubhouse Ambassadors’ Corner

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Good afternoon, wherever you are. We are here back on Italian wine podcast Clubhouse Ambassador's coroners. Today's episode, we have Luis Renery, his back. Gotcha. So welcome back, Luis. Thank you for having me. Of course. How are you doing? I'm doing well. I'm enjoying a beautiful day here in South Florida about seventy two degrees. Oh my goodness. That's amazing. So I am so happy that you wanted to do another clubhouse because you We're really a good moderator back during the interview with Nadia, and that's really amazing. And I am looking forward for this interview. And so before we begin this session, I will be introducing you to our audience today. So hello to the audience. Hi, everybody. So we're so happy to have you here. And Luis, he's Cuban born, Advanced Somier, an Italian white professional, certified wine educator, and certified wine specialist. So him together with his wife Jen. They're the owner operator, and he's the wine director of the Grove Cuchina and wine in Hope Sound, Florida. So tell us about the mission of the restaurant. That you have. Well, we opened five years ago. Didn't know COVID was gonna happen, but by the blessing of the lord, we have survived COVID. And now we complete five years. Actually, next month, March fourth begins her sixth year. And we're excited that, we're still here. You know, if my wife will say we're still here. We're still married and the lights are on, and everything's good. So we started with a mission to have a family owned restaurant focused on Italian cuisine. We traveled to sixteen of the twenty regions. Over the last ten years. And, really to educate the local community about Italian varietals, there are so many, so much, and so rich in history and style and flavors that that's what our stewardship is. And I'm just blessed to be on the show again. Thank you for having me. And as many wonderful stories like Patasciolo that we can share with the public, that's really our mission. And and we've taken over five years, a lot of, let's say, non Italian drinkers through our wine programming, we offer a monthly wine class and a wine dinner. We've had several winemakers from Italy come and do the wine courses. Five courses paired with five Italian wines. The guests here really have embraced and engaged in Italian wines. And so it's been fun taking a journey from Asaic, New World, California, drinker, to explore Italy. There's so much to offer and to taste and enjoy with fellowship. Yeah. I I can imagine. It's very inspiring and incredible that you have taken on, like, embraced Italian wine in your restaurant and also inviting more people to be the lovers of Italian wine as well. So I'm curious how did you discover the wines of but the Ciola winery that you've already mentioned, but tell us more. Yes. So so when I was in Vegas, we're gonna belage. I had I had experienced the wines, but also one of our wine club members had introduced me to Roberto okay, I'm gonna I'm gonna taste him and see what's here in Florida available for us. And Roberto was kind enough to bring just about the entire portfolio, and we sat for about an hour tasting wine, just breaking bread, having the fellowship of these beautiful wines, and I thought This should be podcasted with, Tana Wanda Podcasts. And so here we are today to have such a unique story addresses family and so many different unique vineyard sites. It's a story that needs to be told, I think, and we still have so many new wine drinkers to Italy and particularly Piamonte and some of these varietals that, you know, every time, for example, we have three or their wines by the Glass Gabby. We have our names, and a lot of our community doesn't know is not aware of these varietals. So, again, our stewardship is to turn them off. They've taken on very well. And, we've had good good results. And then we have some of the Barolo as well and barbette on the wine list. We have the largest wine list in our county. We have three hundred and fifty wines. About two hundred are Italian. Why did you select Bataciello winery as your favorite producer to be interviewed today? Well, I thought the diversity of varietals that they offer is a story that needs to be told. Maybe a lot of guests, not Tuscany or Nebulao, but Do they know that these folks are making a little mental, the classical that's new to the market, which I'll let Donese tell about later. And do they know that they grow RNAs or Gabby or Chardonnay, this is the story that I think needs to be told benchmarked on the quality of the baroolos, the dulcetos that they have, barbados, which all do well. And so that discovery engaged me and excited me to tell this story here publicly. Okay. So my last question since We're all geeky here, and we have our Italiancoin Investors here. So thank you so much for being here. What are the learning objectives that we should be expecting from this interview? I think Odessa has a great story to share, and there's a great questions, and he is gonna be prepared to tell about the difference soils, the five crew, the different towns that they source from the small production. I like his emergence of modernity with tradition. So he'll expand on that how how we can incorporate both of those and use technology and his winemaking. And, also, the second would be how his family invested in Pimaota starting in nineteen seventy eight with the winery. And then what the third objective would be, what are some of the current challenges? And how do they adapt to maybe a global economy, whether it's weather and using satellite or monitor technology or consumer patterns. Alright. So I will be on mute, and I will give to the floor. So, next, Luis. Thank you so much. Thank you, Ernesto, Ricardo, everybody else on the show. I'll give you a little background on Ernesto. He is a winemaker for Cortina Bataziolo and guardian of the principles that have been the foundation of his family's worked for decades in La Mora, they're based in La Mora. He was born in Fosano and graduated in nineteen eighty nine from the Annological School of Alba in Belton Olokon. In nineteen ninety eight. He became a winemaker, and his training took place living in the vineyards in the countryside. From a young age, he was harvesting, observing, and assisting in the cellar. He was most interested in the technical aspects of Viticulture and learning every aspect of the cellar field work his mentor is the renowned winemaker Georgio Grai in two thousand and three, Odessa started overseeing the entire production process going to the vineyards every single day. His philosophy is to know well, the areas, the different vineyards, to best enhance the wines produced and invest in technology. Odessa explains quote, we continue to give what it gave repeating its characteristics over time and reflecting then in the grapes of producers, what changes our knowledge, technology and the refinement of cultivation techniques, treatments are targeted and calibrated to obtain healthy wines without residues. The goal is quality, consistency, and coherence for a final product that is the maximum expression of the land from which the grapes come. So we'll I'm the commercial director for US Canada for Bataziolo, an official translator for Mr. Ernest Doliani. So in the meantime, which means I will translate everything that arrested mentioned in Italian, to English. I think it's pretty cool to be able to have a a translator kind of a bilingual flavor for today's podcast. So, or as to the first question I'd like to ask you is tell us about yourself and how you got started in making wine. Job you know. My family is in many generations making wine. My aunt my uncle, my father. He said, basically, I started since I was a little coming to the vineyards do a little bit of a harvest. It started as a just a joke a little bit of a game. Now it becomes a passion. In Parando Propio. After I graduated immediately in nineteen eighty nine, I started working first at the laboratory at the winery, and they're all the way to the farms and the way we grow our vines. My mentor has been Georgia Grite, who's the one who took me to the leadership on the one production. And, two thousand and three, I basically took over the whole winery process from farming all the way to the bottoming. Fantastic. Thank you. How would you describe your winemaking philosophy, and how has it changed or adapted over time? My idea is that, actually, wines are making the vineyards. And then you bring it to the winery, and you just try to bring those beautiful notes of our fruit to be able to make the best out of it. Talked to part the Queenie, Delavinia. No. Okay. Everything has start with individuals, and this is a rule that I have implemented to myself. That everything is carved by the territory, the soil. Whoever work in Davinias before me, we need to follow-up in the same direction as the rules that we need to understand. In respect of where look at the event. The changes that we can see now in the past couple of years is technology that before it was very hard to get, and this is helping also to get the best expression for the ones. You. We do a lot of technical work now to be able to protect the vineyards to get, you know, the best expression, and then we get into the production of the wine. Come in or proceed the question. Because We're trying to avoid any treatments before, so that way we have always the best exposure for the food. So do you have satellite stations in all the vineyards You have a hundred and fifty six hectares of three hundred and twenty acres, five crew of Arola. Do you place them in all of these locations? Not question. Yeah. And I would imagine it's a big investment. So what has been perhaps the biggest payoff with the use of technology, modern technology? So this can help us to avoid any treatments into the Venus. The fact that we would support across the global. You know, we need to be sure that we always ship the best quality, also with the less impact, you know, with any fertilizers or pesticides within the videos, you know, and we realized within the past years that this has been a big reduction that it used to be made before, you know, we implemented. Perfect. Your production is approximately two million bottles. Is that correct? Do I mean you only do I mean you only meds or the book deal? Yeah. Yeah. Between two to point five million depends on the vintage. Excellent. So let's take a little deeper dive if you don't mind because I think you have such wonderful stories and vineyards. Can you describe your different estates and what makes them so unique? To the public. We are a very large area of production. We're one of the largest family producers in the region as a family producer. Which is very important. We have a hundred and fifty five hectares of land, which out of this, a hundred and twenty are for production of wines. Fundamental So for those who knows, the region of Piamonte, basically, we are right in the center of the region. You are covered by three hills. One is facing more of the Jersey Ocean, which is more, you have the other decentral. And you have the other towards the west part of it. I will need to add a little bit more over here. We produce five single vineyards and out of this five single vineyards instead of lungo de alba, which is one of the highest exposures we have. We produce postcard and bricolina. Put red the produr and all three, single line, today produced five single ringers. We have nine different ringers in the total area of production of Barolo. Are these you know, we selected the best ones. We could produce a little bit more single genius, but at the moment, we focus our energy on what we have. One of the beautiful things that we have is when you think about which is another appolation within the production of, barolo, We have two small vineyards, Cherecio and Brunate. There are small quantities produced on average of two to two point five Hector Zolan, which is located in the Sancativigna, which is around thirteen hectares so when you think about the total dimension of the region, we have small areas of production, you know, sixteen hectare, thirteen hectares, and we produced, as I said before. Nine different vineyards and four of the most important areas of production. Brico Dívernia. Also in the area of La Mora, we have a beautiful area of production, which is called Brico Dívernia, which is thirteen hectares. One of the beautiful thing about this is we have the exposure of everything is within the barolo appylation, and we have the availability to produce in the three hills that I mentioned at the beginning. Fantastic. So can you give us a a quick overview? What is the elevation of these vineyard sites? One of the beautiful thing is if you start thinking about Boscharetta and Ricoena, we start from the three hundred meters all the way to the four hundreds. You go to Brico de Verne. We are at four hundred and seventy meters. And the lowest elevation will be more forward to the alba. We do two hundred and fifty meters. Fantastic. What's the, average vine age? So that's a very interesting question, Luis, because we go from vineyards that are thirty years old, to vineyards, they are three years old. To vineyards, they are three years old. Every year, the fact that we have so much land, we need to be replanting and be sure that we are consistent, you know, with the aging of the wines and the vineyards. Is the replanting more towards red varietals or white varietals Italian wine podcast brought to you by mama jumbo shrimp. Sierimect. So we we moving county. So we need to plant whatever was already in that piece of land. We cannot change the varieties. My authority, it is red because of the ablation of where we are located. And I would imagine those elevations, you have a constant breeze. Would that be correct? Keeping disease? So what we're trying to do is with the use of the currents of air, we're trying to maximize the type of the grade that we will plant into it. You know, is if you stay within the center, hills, you know, basically the current air is the vines that are more protected. If you go towards the east side, they get the ocean breeze. So everything depends on the exposure of the vineyards. At the end of the day for the production of buley for Barolo, the most important elevation, exposure, and soil. Exactly. Speaking to us, a great segue to my next question, which is share with the audience the different varietals that you grow. And tell us about the vineyard sites and particularly the soil type in the pure longevity. If you think if you think about, you know, the alba, is the much co carrier soil, which is a warmer soil, which makes one more powerful, and take more time to be ready and age. That, punga and teco Matonino. So if you look at the map and you see Bricolino and Boscarieto, they are the ones that are closer to the ocean. So that's why this carousel makes this potential wines. Then you move to the center, as we've said before, which is, balfani, which is a one that is a little bit less calcareous, a little bit more sandy, and the ones are more elegant, more floral, and more feminine on the approach. This is a very important point because then you move towards a little bit of another park. So the other hill, which is where La Moras Sonquete is located. And, produce a wine, if you think about Zarralunga, I'm on Forte, wind that is in the middle of the structure, you know, you can see it just on Cereco and Brunate. They are facing each other. The distance is only five meters of distance between one and the other. And just by facing one, the southeast, the other one, the southwest, produce a completely different wine. To. So then we we go to the to the area of, always La Mora within Brico de Verne, which is the area that actually opens to the valley, and you get all these cold breeze from the mountains, from the alps. So it produced a much more floral and more fruitful wines, such as tocieto, Brico, D' Vermi, that we produced a single vineyard. And we also saw the barbera and even the chardonnay. The barbera Solvano, just for Ressa's knowledge, we sell a lot of it by the glass. Our guests are really enjoying that as well as the, the galley and the Arnais Tell us about the harvest. What point does this cold breeze from the outstart coming into the valley? When does it normally start, an end? Because you have so many sourcing options between the whites and your reds. Can you expand? And the the the So it's amazing because if you think about the you just mentioned about the exposure and And when the air cold air comes through it yesterday in Brico de Verne, there was, a drop of coal, and there was even snow. And when you move towards the Barolo area, it was only rain. So which means the cold front always comes through the area of, Brico, Dibernia, which is the first, the one that hits the vineyards. So if you do a harvest in the area of Brico de Verne, which has these cold fronts that comes from, these are the grapes that we use to get the structure of the nose, the fruit. But then if you want to give the structure to the wine, you need to pick up fruit from the area of the barrel, which we are blessed to be able to have so many different vineyards. I would imagine using these, weather stations than to anticipate, like, these changes and maybe there are no shifts from one vineyard site got rain, and the other one got snow. These satellites must be helping you. With our doubt, this will help a lot. The technology is very important because they help us, you know, not only in the vineyard, but also at the winery. So I was curious to share with the audience about your charter named pinot noir projects and also the middle of the classical that you're producing. For us today. So we were one of the first one who started the project of Metodoclassic in the region in eighty seven. We'd have a little bit of pinonero, you know, in Chardonnay, in the lower elevation. And, we are one of the first one in eighty seven, even before Artalanga became, you know, famous. I believe it's a new offering to Florida. So I'm excited to, have it in market because we'll be selling that by the glass as well to show our consumer how beautifully sparkling wines can be in that style from Pimonte This is exciting and rewarding because we've been doing it for such a long time. Then now we decide to even extend it within our winery, a special area, just the production of the fermentation for the Espumante, looking always for the future to have a little bit more bubbles around the world from Kimon. Please keep it going. So that's For sure, for sure, we'll continue and we something new will come soon too. Oh, we're excited to hear that when you're available to release that information. We cannot mention that yet. We're getting there. Well, you know, we have a a trip plan. My wife and I and our chef, Jeff Joseph Andrade, to visit you all in, early September just, during the harvest time. So I look forward to meeting you in person and maybe We wait for you. Maybe we find some truffles, I have my my dog. So I can't bring her. If you find it, you're welcome. It has to be towards towards the end of September for sure. Okay, Banny. I would ask that question for you. What have you learned about the changing consumer taste in wine? And are you developing wines, better wines to adapt to the traditions of Pimonte or using that modernization technique to consumer changing patterns? Traditionally. Look out there. So we we we have we have adapted to the changes of the market without a doubt. We we always want to keep our tradition because for us, it's very important to be traditional. But at the same time, we need to adapt to the market. So the barbera Sabrana, the shadow name Moreno, these are wines that has been adapted in big investment on the winery to be able to make these new style wines. And we change, Barriques, we work with three different sizes. So You started using French Oak, approximately when? The first one that we used, French Verite was our chardonnay Moreno in the nineties. That's when Oreste graduated from college came to the winer and implemented in your systems. Did you happen to visit France and then fell in love with French oak, or you were just trying it on a dead well? So graduate from college, start coming to the to really fully merge into the winery. And our previous winemaker was already, you know, trying to implement the direction of the French folks. So at that point, he continued to do it and and learn about also what they're doing, you know, the places. So we understood the typical tradition is devoted. The ten thousand head fully distinct. But then we started implementing the French body you know, and we realize it that we need the wines to be able to hold for this type of, fruit. Such as Sharpenino. Sharpenino, you put it in a dark glass. And if you don't see the wine, you might think just because of this structure could be a a light red. I'm gonna have to try that out. That sounds interesting. Speaking of truffles and all this wine. Do you have a favorite wine? And what food pairings would you recommend to the audience? Caul elvino two of Faborito, a So he say that, basically, for him without a doubt is the barolo. But if you start choosing between the barolo's that we produce, boss carreto is one of the most traditional style production of barolo's in the region. And he talked to his his uncle, you know, his older one who used to drink so much barolo than him, and they say, boss Carreco with Aratão is the one who brings the structure and the typical notes of the old style barolo. I love that description. This is a one that you can actually have to have with with the second course meal, you know, a little bit more structure, but also you can put it as a meditation wine, lunch, you know, which means you're not going back to work. That's what I understood as a meditation. I'm gonna use that one. Meditation one. It's a meditation then go to sleep. And I like that. I'm gonna call you. I'm gonna copy that here. My meditation one. So my final two questions are, which I like to ask winemakers. What is the funniest thing that's happened to you as a winemaker? Chines, a visitor in Argentina, So there was a delegation from China who came to the winery, start tasting some wines with us. They came at, at lunchtime. It was ten people for the first time, you know, enjoying all these bar olos. The problem was that, you know, the the taste in the big tasting was supposed to happen, you know, at at lunch, but at at the moment of the tastings, he start pouring some wine and one of these gentleness, send up and, screen, campaign, and everybody have to get this out of Varono. In France. He's a very memorial lunch because every time the the glass was empty, the summer here is still pouring some wine. This guy continued to stand up and say, come pay, come pay, and the launch lasts forever, and everybody fall asleep. It was, hey, without a doubt, one of the most memorial. That became the meditation one. Well, I hope you got some good sales out of it. It was a lot of meditation that day without a doubt. That sounds like fun. Thank you for sharing that. And my final question, more for the general audience. Are your wines available globally? And how would we order your wines and these distributed worldwide. That's on the point. Ricardo. Okay. So our ones, you can find it in seventy two countries worldwide. Mostly, we work a lot with restaurants, eighty percent of our business is restaurant. You don't find us in, supermarkets. You find us in fine wine shops, and, online, it's it's not available at the moment. But my suggestion, go to Luis, enjoy his restaurant and start trying some of the Bataciela wines. That will be my best advice. That's the best advice I heard all day. Me. Yeah. And I just, our wonderful chef, Joseph, andrade just showed showed up, and he wants to say hello, and we'll see you guys and italia. It's gonna be his first visit. Yes. I will. I'm I'm looking forward to to joining you guys. Driggas of good wine. You need some good food. Maybe, I I cooked too. Who knows? Yeah. We talked about that. Not a problem. We have everything. Well, you tell what you wanna cook and we give it to you. Yes. Good job. We look forward to thank you for your time today, everyone on the call. I suppose now, if anyone has any general questions, the floor is open. So I guess nobody wants to ask any questions right now. But then, if there are any questions for those who will be listening on this recorded session, you can email us at info at thalia Wine podcast dot com, and we will also be including on the show notes, the website of Betaciello winery. So Thank you for having me on. I hope that, the audience enjoyed the show and learned a little bit more about Patacios, wonderful wines. Of course. Okay. I'll also send a message to see you when she's back. Okay. Thanks guys. Bye. Listen to the Italian wine podcast wherever you get your podcasts. We're on SoundCloud, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Emilia FM, and more. Don't forget to subscribe and rate the show. If you enjoy listening, please consider donating through Italian wine podcast dot com. Any amount helps cover equipment, production, and public costs. Until next time.