Ep. 107 Monty Waldin interviews Francesca Bava (Cocchi Spumanti) | Discover Italian Regions: Piedmont / Piemonte

Italian wine podcast. Chinching with Italian wine people. Hello. This is the Italian wine podcast with me Monty. All in today's guest is Franchesca Baba from the cokie winery in coconutorasti in Piamonte. Welcome Franchesca. Thank you. Now, first of all, let's dig down. How many wineries run by the Bava family are there in this part of Piamonte, Astia Piamonte? It's actually a couple of wineries. Well, you tell me the names. Yeah. First one is a Bava winery. So the family business, which we run-in Coconut since nineteen eleven. This is a traditional period Montez wine. A lot of barbera, many different kinds of barbera, nebbiolo, but also chardonnay, and so on. So, yeah, and your father is? My father is Roberto. He's the I'm manager of the Robert Obama. And he's in another interview that we've done. Yes. Okay. So that's Robert Obama. So you're his daughter, your Franchesca's daughter, and you run a separate one called Kokie, c o c c HI, which is in the same area, coconutodasti. So what do you make at your winery at the cocky winery? Yeah. Koky makes a sparkling wine and aromatized wine, which is, basically vermouth, vermouth, turino. Right. Okay. So me about the sparkling wine. Koki has been making sparkling wine since the beginning of its history. So, eighteen ninety one, which is a long, long time ago. And we we have, always been making sparkling wine and the aromatized wine. So since the beginning, as we are in the astir region. Of course, astice pumante has always been one of our main focus. So you make astice pumante. We make astice pumante. How many styles do you make? There's a dry style that's just come out as well, isn't there? Yes, sir. We we don't make the astice echo. So far. ASTis Pumante. We will see maybe in the future, but at the moment, we prefer to focus on the sweet side of the Estis Pumante. So just to remind everybody, Estis Pumante is, how is it made and which grape is it made from? Which grape is it made from, which grape is it? Moscato? Moscato? Moscato. Bianco, which is really the one of the main grapes in the in the Asti hills. But, beside the Estis Pumante, we also like to focus on the dry varieties. So, Biamante is a longer history of Pironero and You make peanut orange chardonnay? Yes. They're still wines. Not sparkling. Traditional method sparkling wine. Yes. Okay. Which is now called Altaango. Okay. So Altaango is the docG, like, new appylation, but with a long history And I'll just say to Deborah, what what is the language or the language? Langge is the Hills region in the south of Limonte. So near alba, the area of Barolo, of course. And the area of truffles as well. Of truffles. As well. Yeah. But besides Barolo, like in the southern part of Pemonte, there is a very longer, like, long history of white grapes and, like, made for the sparkling wine. And so you make barkling wine, at cocky winery, and you also make this some aromatized wine, which in French would probably be called vermouth, which is a very popular style in Northern Italy, the spot in Northern Italy, isn't it's historic style? So just tell me how do you make it? What's it made from? What does it taste like? What what I drink it with? Yeah. Aromatized wine is, based wine. Of course, in our case, the most frequently available wine is, muscato. So, basically, we take muscato, and we add extracts of herbs and spice is? What kind of herbs? Rosemary, garlic? Not garlic for what I know, but Rosemary can be used, for example. Really? But the most important one is the, warwood. Oh, what's your cell. It's the name. Artamese. Artamese, I've seen exactly growing in the halps. So as long as we can, we prefer to use the local varieties. So Pierre Monte is at Asia, but also, like, exotic spices, such as a rhubarb, but also Cucardamone, cinnamon, and so on. The list is very long. We use up to thirty different spices and herbs. It's the recipe secret. Of course. How much do I have to how much money do I have to give you to get the secret? No. No. No. No way. But I don't know it don't know it. Is it rude? So who does the blend? Is it like a master blender that does that? Is it a little old man and a cap or a little older? Is it is it a very historic traditional or is there like a set recipe that a technician has to? Actually, every every, like, different producer of, is is on formula. At Koki, we have two different botanist, my uncles, actually Paulo and Julia. So now, you know, all the all the family. How old are Paulo and Julia? They they their brothers, are they? Yeah. Yes. The the tripad brothers. Roberto and Julia. So they're your your two they're your two uncles. You're your father, Roberto, two brothers. Yes. Exactly. And one is taking care of the vineyards and of the botanicals. So most specifically on the Vermont side. And, Julia is, most focusing on the, sparkling wine making. So the botanicals, I mean, are you growing any of them yourself? Or do you harvest them wild? Are you allowed to harvest them wild or not? How does it work? We don't grow the botanicus, but, we did some project on the on the farming of some of the botallicas, especially the Tunisia, the the wormwood, which is really the the most important one. And we've been doing, like, a project, for example, in the Venaria Ali Castle, which is a very, like, older and the historical castle in the surrounding of turin. And we have been, growing the wormwood in the gardens on the custard. Was it a did the monks used to grow artemisia there, wormwood, or wormwood there? No. The monks, but the the kings, he had, like, a big garden with all the le botanicals and then a green garden as well. So it would have been a French king at the time? Savoya. Savoya family. Yes. And they were the first one using the the wormwood. At the time, for, like, aromatizing water for the soldiers, wormwood has some, like, healing properties as well for the lever and so on. Later on, the Savoya family were also one of the most important promoter for the Vermont category. So what's your main market for your Vermouth? It used to be Italy, the beginning of their hockey history. Now it's more, USA, UK. We export mainly our wormhole. So what changed initially? Was it was it seen as an old man's drink? Not anymore, I would say. Do you think the younger generation will be interested in these these wormwood flavors? Yes. Artamusea flavors? And, and it is. Have you had to check, is it a little bit sweet? It is sweet and it is be bitter as well. So both bitter and sweet, and probably this is why it's, so widely used both needs and in cocktails. So you drink it as an imperative? Yes. Operative or digestive as well. And can you have it with food? Yes. Why not? Actually, we did, like, a tour of a wine dinner, vermouth dinner. We call them using, spices of the vermouth as ingredients. So spices in the food and in the in the vermouth. Does it work? Yes. Yeah. Very interesting. There you go. Big smile on your face. Yeah. Yeah. Food of course is one of the passion of my family. But your friends think, I mean, obviously, that it's in your region, but do your friends, you know, you're you're fairly young. Do they see you as a bit old fashioned so that you're selling this sort of historic drink that old, generally old men would drink? I know famous artists did as well like Van Gough, for example, but said to be drinking Bermouth when he, when he passed away. But, do they find it a little bit odd? Probably, they used to to find it older, like, until five years or so ago, we may say, but now it's getting really popular. Fashionable. Yeah. So is the packaging really important? It is, but this is not the the essential. I think, like, people is getting really, like, interested in the ingredients, in the way we make it, so it's not an out to have a nice package So when you go into the mountains to harvest the plant, who who's looking after the the plants there? Are they wild? Are you allowed to harvest the wild aura or are there vermouth quotes plantations where where wormwood or artemis farmers actually grow this plant specifically for the vermouth industry? Yes. Vermont industries getting, like, bigger and bigger every year. So, like, there is a wide need of the of wormwood for the for the production. And when do you pick the wormwood for the, when is it most flavorful? At flowering just before flowering? It's a like, after flowering, but in the summer. Then it depends on the decision of the specific producer. Okay. Chislosse, thanks to Franchesquepaba from the cokie winery in Coconutordasti in Cimonte. Thanks for telling us about your sparkling wine. And thanks in particular for telling us about your vermouth. I know your father who we've referred to who we interviewed in a separate podcast, is a big fan of the vermouth, and you would wanted to explain that to us. But it was nice that you explained that to us because a younger member of the family only, because it is seen as an old fashioned historically, it's an old fashioned drink, but it's also an thanks to Franchesca Obama, from the cocky wine, it's about her family's sparkling wine and her family's vermouth. I love to come and see the actual vermouth where the vermouth is grown. Hope'd be fantastic to see that everybody just migrates to the vineyards in Piamonte, sort of, you know, I mean, I'm in a famous Ferillo single vineyard. I'd much rather be up in that in the hills looking at some of these herbs. It'd be fantastic. Yes. The Vermont production. Great. Thanks a lot, Franchesca. Thanks for coming. Follow Italian Line Podcast on Facebook and Instagram.