Ep. 68 Monty Waldin interviews Ermanno Murari (VCR Vivai Cooperativi Rauscedo) | Italian Wine Coops

Italian wine podcast. Chinching with Italian wine people. This podcast has been recorded during Vivite an event organized by the the alliance of Italian corps. Hello. This is the Italian wine podcast with me, Monte Wallin today. I'm with Armano Muradi. Armano is an agronomist from the Viva corporativi Raucedo in the Frulli region of Northeast Italy. And Maro welcome. Thank you. Welcome to you. Now, before we start on what you're doing now, how did you begin your career in wine? And how did you become a researcher and a scientist. So I'm an agronomist, and I study in agriculture. So researcher is very important for me because, it's a soil of, our field. Okay. I work with Viva, and it's particular because Viva Viva is a nursery. We produce plants, and the So when you say plant, you mean vines grafted onto rootstock? Yeah. So we produce plants for all over the world. We produce the variety of grease, like Ague or Gittico, and we produce the variety in more pain, lies in Pranilla. But, it's not enough. It's not enough because, we see that, the weather is changed. The climate is changed. We see that, all people that drink wine are changed So, for example, a few years ago, in Italy, we say, you know, biologic, organic wine, was not a lot. Now in Italy, in Italy, organic wine and organic grape is, about fifteen percent. So our research now is, in this direction. Now we have, ten varieties that, we have obtain in easy methods, sir, with a marriage. We have a marriage with a variety international, like, Vernese O'vignon, like, sovignon Black. And, other varieties from, from, the caucasus. Yes. From, America. And, the variety from America are strong, disease resistant. So this is this is the American vine species, everybody. And the European vine species is VITis vinifera. Yes. And American vine's the species. I think the marriage. Okay. Across. Yeah. So sir. He's a The marriage is okay. We do it. It's very romantic. Yes. I prefer to use the words, that everybody can understand because if I say a marriage, people understand that is normal. If I say the technical, word. People thinks that maybe there are o g m. Maybe there are, the genetic, technique inside DNA. No. So o g O g m is, is just the Italian way of saying genetic modification. It's forbidden in Italy. To use, OGM. So it is a normal marriage. We have made this marriage. We have controlled very well, and now we have ten varieties that, are very strong with, against all the disease of the gray So normally, we use, fifteen, sixteen spray in, the grape, and, now you can use two or three. So two or three sprays instead of instead of fifteen. Isn't that So what are the names of some of these, married, marriages that you've created? What are what are the husbands of the wise? What are they called now? We call this variety. Do you know the name of the variety? Well, some of the what are some of these names? If I go into a wine shop and I, when I wanna buy some of these, okay? What are they called? For example, if you go now, now, if you go in Trent, you go in Trent, you know, I is it? It's normal. You can go to Cantina Demori, and there is a wine that is named Victoria, and you look in the bottle. There is a solaris, there is a romero. In the future, the solaris is a red or white grape. Why? For example, there is a wine. The name is Devento. Devento in Italian, it means I became. Devento is of wine. And the minto is made with this variety. It is, a wine producer with cabernet, cabernet Edos, Cabernet Volos, Merlo Colos, and this variety t are strong. But, we want to say with this wine that, the grape have a lot of respect of the field, of the climate, of the weather, and, if you buy this wine, you we give the money to people that, need help. So we help the weather and we help people. New line now. Okay. So when you say only a couple of sprays, these disease resistant varieties, how much if I have, say, a plot of, for example, merlot, one hectare of merlot, and then I have one hectare of, say, cabinados, which is a a disease resistant red grape. How many sprays would I normally make on the on the on the on the on the cavonados compared to say the metal or the metal or seventy? Meron, for example, I come from Benetor region. No. Fifteen sprays. Six in. So how that's a huge saving in terms of tractors, in terms of compaction, labor, everything. Yeah, I save money, and, the the climates. I save soil. Because, I use less of the tractor. Do these wines taste the same as normal wine? So it was, oh, I don't wanna some people call these grape varieties hybrids, and they think more sounds a bit scary. Sometimes I like to play with the wine. And, I use example, two bottles, one bottles of, normal blood, and one bottle of, murder collars, and you taste. You don't know what is one and what is the other. And then I ask you, usually, I make with the France with, an ologist also too. And they say, now you have to say to me, what is the resistance, what is the new variety, and what is the original merlot? It's impossible. The percent is a fifty fifty. Fifty percent says, okay, if for me, the number one is the original merlot, and for me, the the other. So it's impossible now to recognize the original variety from the new variety resistant. What about in terms of the media consumers, would they be if they walk into one shop and they see Merlo, they know what they're going to get. If they walk in and they see Merlo isos. Now we are starting. So it's very difficult to find this grape. Because, in Italy, you can, in the inventory region, for example, you can use this variety from October two thousand fifteen. So the first vineyards we have made in, April of two thousand fifteen. The first grape is this year. Maybe in the future, it will be very easy to find this wine. Now, it's very easy to find, in trying to add this because trying to add just started six, seven years ago. So in that region, it's easy to find. Inventitore, John, you will find this wine in about, three, four years. Okay. You probably don't know this, but I've been writing about organic for quite time, organic wine for quite a long time about twenty years. And I do think between that if there's a choice between, say, genetically modifying a cabernet sauvignon or creating, what is called a hybrid, it's not a very nice word, but creating a marriage between two different varieties that convey resistance to that variety. It really makes so much sense. You're burning, as you said, less tractor fuel. There's less compaction, less pollution. Yes. Labor, you know, there's still work to do in the vineyard. And you make a really good quality wine. I can't see why people can't accept that that really is a such a great way forward. No. People will accept it. You think people will? Yes. You're optimistic? I really. What what is the reason for your optimism? Because, people, for example, when I started to work, more than twenty years ago. People don't want the organic wine. I don't know what is inside. I don't know. Maybe the wine is not good. I don't know. But people are not stupid. So now people understand that organic wine is, very good with the taste and very good for us, for, the planet, for, the respect of the nature. People will understand that these variety are not, OGM, are not, most are, and will understand that, that wine will be more natural. There will be less, spry. The pollution. Yes. I'm sure that people are not stupid. So if I if I walk into a vineyard, if you take me to your vineyards, and half of the vineyard is, say, Merlo, and half of the vineyard is Merlo Edos, will I see a difference in the color of the leaves or in autumn, maybe? No. It's particular. It's a very good answer. Questions, sir. Question, excuse me. You're gonna give me the very good answer. Yeah. That is good question because I saw this. If I make, the color of the leaves, the same, the design of the leaves, is the same. But I saw this. If, normally, I use, fifteen times, of spray. This spray goes into the leaves, and the plant are not very happy. It's easy to find the plants that after the spray grow up as lower. It's a little bit weaker. Because, a spray like copper go inside in the deeper part of the leaves, and the plant, so grow up, yes, grow up, not very fast. I saw that this plants looks more happy. Because, with, two or three spray, they can grow up with, no problems. The plants seems more, green. So what you're saying is every time we spray a vineyard, it takes normally takes the vine a couple of days to recover from the the shock. So if you're spraying them fifteen times a year, that's maybe forty five days when they're not really working as hard as they could be working, whereas in the It's normal, dormant. So it's normal with usual copper to reduce the energy of the plants. I say, if you have too much energy, maybe you have, put too much food to the plants. Too much fertilizer. It's not good. So you have to use the copper to reduce the energy. That's a waste of the you're you're creating a problem and then have to deal with the problem that you've created yourself. I spent money two times the first times because, you have, give too much, food to the plants, nutrients. And the second time, so you see that the plants is too big and, you have to use copper to reduce the vigorous of plants. So if you use this variety, be careful. Don't give too much nutrients to the plants. And then you will see that the energy is enough to grow up the plants and the grape. And then you happen to use too much copper to reduce the variety. Do you grow your own vegetables? Have a a vineyard. A vineyard? Yes. Have a vineyard. So you work in Vai. You come home at the weekend and, like, you're not gonna go and play golf. You're not gonna go watch the football. You you produce Swave. You make Swave it. Yes. Okay. Hope that you come to find me. And you and you under under your own name as well, or do you send you don't send me a group? I produced to have it for me and for my friends. And So we have Garnika. Garnika and chardonnay. And, I give my my grape to continue to try this one. Which is a monster. Huge. Great. It's very great. Emoth. If you come, you will face my wine that I produce just for the plants. Okay. I've got one final question for you. When you were small, were you always fascinated by plants and by agriculture? What did you think? What did you think you're gonna be an astronaut or a football player? Or how did you how did you get into this field of of work? My my father was a doctor of the man. A general practitioner, medical doctor. My mother was a painter. You have a a No. I understood everything. You got the artistic side and you got the scientific side. And I'm an agronomist. So I when I was very young, I like mountains. Nature very wild. I have to say that in Italy, it's very difficult to work in a mountain in forest, works. But, my, my family had these vineyards, since I was young, and, I like, to stay in the fields, to stay in the nature. And so I decided to work in agriculture and the vineyards. So which which villa which village of vineyards in and soave? Two kilometers from soave. It's called. I call it. It's a very nice terroir. Yes. Very nice. Nice. So, Abi, it's very nice because, you can see the volcanic soil. And, near the volcanic soil, you can see the soil that come from the sea. I know. There is basaltic, but, in the middle of, basaltic soil, there is a museum. And in this museum, there is a one hundred and fifty kilometers from the sea. In this museum, as I told you, for. You can see a fish, a big fish. The bones of this big fish that, remember us that a lot of time ago, that was the sea. Here, you can find the soil that come from the sea and the that come from the vodka together. Yeah. Nice nice little blend. Adnan Morani, thank you very much for talking to us today about your projects with these disease resistant grape varieties. And I do hope to taste two bottles of wine with you at some time in the future. One, a disease resistant variety, and won a bottle of Yoswara. Nice to meet you. Thank you. I hope to to see you, Yoswara. You will. Thanks a lot. Thanks for coming in. Bye. This episode has been brought to you by Vin Italy twenty eighteen. Taking place in verona from April fifteenth to eighteenth. 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