Ep. 1348 Elisabetta Gnudi Angelini | On The Road Edition With Stevie Kim

By now, you've all heard of Italian wine unplugged two point o. The latest book published by Mamma jumbo shrimp. It's more than just another wine book. The fully updated second edition was inspired by students of the Vinitally International Academy and painstakingly reviewed and revised by an expert panel of certified Italian wine ambassadors from across the globe. The book also includes an addition by professor to Yoshenza. Italy's leading vine geneticist. The benchmark producers feature is a particularly important aspect of this revised edition. The selection makes it easier for our readers to get their hands on a bottle of wine that truly represents a particular grape or region to pick up a copy, just head to amazon dot com, or visit us at mama jumbo shrimp dot com. Welcome to another episode of On the Road Edition, hosted by Stevie Kim. Each week, she travels to incredible wine destinations, interviewing some of the Italian wine scene's most interesting personalities, talking about wines, the foods, as well as the incredible travel destinations. Welcome to the Italian wine podcast on the road edition, and this is a very special episode because I saw Elizabeth Nudi and Jolini has three names. In New York, just a couple of weeks ago, maybe ten days ago at wine experience, Elizabeth. You were our very first guest on Italian wine podcast five years ago. It's through And now fast forward to now, we are nearing, twelve hundred episodes. So, one thousand two hundred episodes. So I said, we have to do an anniversary episode. So we are here in Artesina with Elizabeta knew the Angelini, our first guest on Italian wine podcast. Charlie Zaveda. So what we're going to do today is maybe taste a few wines few of her signature wines and then talk about what's happened the past five years. But for the audience who are unfamiliar with your wineries because she's got full and, yourself Let's just do a brief overview of who you are and your wineries, the famous a, b, c, d. My background is not a wine background, and especially my family is not, it was not in the wine business, like many producers now. I start everything over twenty five years ago. But before that, I was working in movie productions, and, in a pharmaceutical business because your family used to own. Yeah. Angelini is the Angelini pharmaceutical company. And, but I decide when I was a grown up, I decided to do about eating and drinking to do my future. But you were, in the pharmaceutical business, right? And then why did you I mean, everybody loves to drink and, eat. But why? Why would I make the my life in drinking and, and eating because I decided to become a wine producer But of course, once you get in the country, you are not only a wine producer, you are a oil producer, you are a grain producer, we are a honey producers, and, I get food and wine, but especially wine, of course. Wine is the thing that, make me excite. Even after so many years, every year, you look for the harvest. Every year, you are with the heart. Up to here to see what's going on. And, and, now I can talk because the grape is all in the winery, all in the cellar. We won't try the eighteen today because we still have the seventeen we can't. You will try it at the fair. Okay. You will try it at the end in the Benvenuto. In the Benvenuto. But, it's very interesting. Eighteen is a beauty. I would say it's a beautiful vintage. Okay. Maybe it's not a vintage that will last forever. The that will age forever like, fifteen, sixteen, or two zero four, or ninety seven, or those beautiful, beautiful vintages. But it's a it it is a vintage. A lot of a legacy, a lot of it's very fashionable. Maybe it won't take long. Maybe twenty years, twenty five years. I decided to move in the country was a big change. I was almost forty. I was thirty eight, thirty nine when I decide that. In the meantime, my great love story was, accomplished because I went back with my former fiance. Okay. My poor husband died. When the children were very young, especially, it was very, very young. And, but before my husband, I was engaged with Roberto. Roberto is my is my my husband now. And, he show up again and, and we moved in the country. He loves he loves to live in the country. So it's kind of your second honeymoon. Yep. Absolutely. A second life because I was just going to ask you, you know, going from Rome to the countryside. I mean, it's not it's it's not very far from Montana, but it's still, it's it's isolated. Right? And Montalcino is very My gosh. Proven provincial compared to Rome. Right? Compared to Rome. So Rome is very international. Rome and Milan are the most international city You don't even have wifi or connectivity most of the time? No. No. We get why. Horrible wifi is still in a place where everything's slowed down. And coming from a big city, you don't understand. And sometimes you push the people to to be more fast and more to become quicker. But, then you understand the beauty of slowing down. But now where do you live? I live here in Artese, you know, in much children have ever house in Caparts. Yeah. Which is just one kilometers less than a kilometer away. So that's a good segue to kind of remind our audience the four wineries. So let's ace for Altizina. At the scene of it is the baby of the it's completely a coincidence. Because a for Artesino, b, Bogos copeto, which is in the county classical is where the the letter of Juliet is, was suited. Yeah. Was created. Right? Yes. Yes. The location for that movie is. It started in verona, of course, but then they moved to Tuscany because they had to look for. So for all the trivia fans out there. Yeah. Okay. Let there's to Juliet. There's a cute the name is Borgos Copeto because Borgos in Italian means little town. And, originary was a little town. Like Volthaya for instance. And now that the town became, a resort, a hotel, is a five stars hotel, and, and, of course, they shoot the movie in there. And close by, there is the winery. Borgosco Peto is a is my big, big property because it's over five hundred hectares altogether. It's huge. It's the only property altogether. Now, together with La Marima, then, a, Altezino, b, Boroscoppetto, c Capartso, which is just down the road. Just down the road, brunello de Montalcino again, and La doga, doga de la Clavalier in Marima, where I do morellino and Vermentino, a which is a smaller winery, smaller winery, smaller winery, and where I do a simple wine, like the one we are drinking now. Okay. So let's start drinking a little bit of the wine. Okay. So the first one we're drinking is it's a chardonnay riesling from Artesino. Okay. So it's chardonnay briesling blend. What's the blend? Yeah. Chardonnay. Yeah. And was this wine from, prior to your purchase, or it's something you've No. No. Something we started. Okay. So when did when was your first harvest? My first harvest was of this wine was I purchase in two thousand and two, this one came up in two thousand and eight because I planted in two thousand and five. It's a very fresh wine. This wine again doesn't go in wood. It's very fresh and very, very pleasant as a furon appetitivo. It's very good. And, And what is the production volume? How many bottles do you produce? No. Just twelve thousand. So you drink it at your home. Yeah. And we give it to few customers as an entry. You know, sometimes, especially we use it when, when we do wine dinners or for enough for events, and, to start the dinner is always very nice to start with a white wine. Okay. So let's start with the first. We're going to go with the I'll go with it. Let me see. Probably this one. No. Maybe that is this one. Yes. Okay. So you know, you purchased, you purchased, you purchased the winery twenty years ago in the twentieth anniversary this year. This year. Yes. Great big celebration. So I have a question for you. So you purchased this winery, twenty years ago. See. Right. Has the style changed within the past years? How has it evolved? I think I didn't change much because I loved what they were doing in Artesino. And we taste, taste every single step, every single step. Of, the fermentation. Sometimes even before our best, we test the the grape to see if it's ripe enough. And, and we try to don't make mistakes because the chemistry is good to fix mistakes. But, technology is good to prevent mistakes and to make a perfect wine. What do you think is more important in making your wine? Is it the vineyard management or is it the winemaking? Oh, yes. The vineyard. Everything starts in the air. But which is more important because the way you're speaking to me, it's very much the winemaking side. Right? Yeah. The techniques, the the vessels, the technology. But the winemaking is all around the vineyard, what the vineyard produce, because I want to save the fruit. This is what I want to do. The fruit that comes out from my vineyards, as as to be, the way it is in the wine. I don't want to change it because if nature decide to do the fruit in that way, I have to keep it and preserve it and to make the people taste what nature can do without the people changing what nature decide to do, especially with Roso de Montalcino. I love Versa because And, but it's there. The tannins, you have all the flavors, especially a lot of fruit, and you can drink it every day. Yeah. Yeah. You can drink it every every day because it's absolutely the ball, even economic. And how many, bottles are you producing of this? I'm a big producer of Rosody Montalcino. Tazino makes about eighteen thousand. Eighty. Eighty. Eighty. So is doing one hundred and ten thousand. Okay. So let's start drinking brunello. Yeah. Okay. This is brunello. How much is china for a retail price in Italy. Altacino is about nineteen twenty euro. Apart, so is less, is about fifteen. Okay. So here, we have the first Bernala, and it's And this is the Bernelo two thousand seventeen seventeen. You see how fruity is, even the Bernelo, but it's big. The tannins are there and there is not too much interfering with the wood because we are using only big barrels for the brunello, for every brunello, even for the rosso de Montalcino, only big barrels. We don't use, barbecue or tuna for these sort of wines because we love to show what the vineyard give to us. And the thing is that. Is a beautiful result. I'm very happy. I I think you are a marketing genius, to be quite honest because because you you use this huge Right? See. And then every winery has a different color associated with it. I've never seen anything like that. Alright. So, Artizino is golden yellow. Gold yellow because the label, of course, is gold and white. And, that's the color of Artesino. And then we went to Capartia and everything is green. Green. Capartia is green because the label is green. The label of Capartia is green. We don't have the bottom here. And at the big, big potty, they're they're that all the trimmings are also in green. It's very easily, recognizable. See, and also you can and a very good aided recall. And then you have which is blue. Blue navy blue of the both are blue. So I'm surprised not to see, like, you know, organic You know, you're so green in a way. Right? Yeah. That your wines aren't like organic. We are in conversion and we decide to start the conversion in organic. Artsina or both Copartisino? Okay. Copartisino. Virgo is almost organic. Next year would be organic. It's already three years because you need the three years Yes. For the conversion. And, it's done. Next year, we will come out with the organic wine. We start the conversion this year. We tried last year, but was impossible. And we said, okay. We start next year. But, this year, it's okay. Let's see what's going on next year. And, but we'd announce that we start the call. You know, you can say, okay, I'm starting to be green. But, if one terrible year while it's raining and, and a lot of humidity, You have to go back on your steps and then other ways you lose your production or your production will be a disaster. Okay. Let's go to the next Bernal and then you'll tell us the difference between this Bernalo and the next one. Okay. This is montessori two seventeen. And this is our popular wine. Yeah. This is your kind of a signature line. Signature. Right. Absolutely. This is montousley. Montousley is a heel facing our winery. It's a special heel. This is a strange vineyard. It's the top part of montousley. And, is completely on the north side of the hill. The south part is Caparto with La Casa. But you were the first to do Montosso. The first to did Montossoly. And no, Caparto never called, is is, single vineyard, montessori, always La Casa, because it was the name of the property. La Casa, we left the same name of the property. Mhmm. And, Coparta is called La Casa. But the south part is the tip of the hill, the south part is caparzo, the north part is Altacino, in here there is Barriq on the top part like us, and the rest is underneath us. And Montoso is really a special place. We we don't do anything. Even when we have to put some new vineyards, we pick the same old. We don't know which kind of clone is made montessori because we found it over there. It's an old. It was a very old vineyard and are the vines old as well. And the vines are very were very old. How old are they? Oh, they were old when the former owner bought Altacino. Mhmm. But they decide that they those wines were so good. Those those vines were so good that they decided to cut pieces and prepare the new Barbatelli out of the that that clone because it wasn't a strange clone of sangiovese that was not in the market, and we still do that. Anytime, plan to die or we have to substitute we make a clone out of our plant. And, I think it's a special creature. This this montessori. It's so recon it's the only wine I can recognize when we do our tasting with many, many wines. Sometimes I mix up La Casa, and I should not say so. But more I think you're being honest. People Yeah. Yeah. Cannot always tell you what. That's right. Yeah. But one totally is so You can recognize it. Yeah. I can recognize it. I can recognize it. I'm only twenty one twenty Brunelo. How do you recognize it? What are the characteristics of Montezil? Okay. First of all, this man this smell is so pure. Are you enjoying this podcast? There's so much more high quality wine content available from mama jumbo shrimp. Check out our new wine study maps. Our books on Italian wine including Italian wine unplugged, the jumbo shrimp guide to Italian wine, Sanjay Vazzy Lambrusco, and other stories, and much much more. On our website, mama jumbo shrimp dot com. Now back to the show. To me, when you say pure, what does it mean? Red red fruit. Mhmm. So these are red fruit. They were supposed to smell every every brunello. And then it's a little bit dusty. The sangiovese dust. I call because I love this little dust in the Bruno probably is more more present. What about in terms of Tannen? Oh, it's so cute. When you drink it, it's silky. And seems seems like a very light wine, but in your mouth explode and last long, long time. Yeah. The the length. The length is very, very long. It's a but especially when you're eating, because drinking it is almost sweet. Mhmm. But when you put this wine against it, you know, prosciutto salami or a big piece of meat or a big roast, this wine wins on everything. You feel it. So you're talking about meat salami, you know, kind of the local food. If you were to, pair it with, let's say, quote unquote international food. Right? What would you I would say steak meat every kind of meat. Steak all the way. Steak all the way, meat every every kind of roast. That's Italian. Again, is not international, but pasta with meat sauce or or a big pasta even carbonara with eggs and, pancetta. Or talking about, I was drinking this wine in China, eating dim sum. Yeah. And it was perfect the the basic dim sum made out of meat. Yeah. Like pork and pork and they were perfect. Perfect. Of course in America with ribs, in America, it's very easy to pair this wine. And, I think it's a wine that can go with, with big food, big tasty food. This wine seems so so underground, so overpowering, but this one will come out. This I love this one. How long how long can this wine age at when will it not how long can it age because we know that Bernelo's can age for a very long time. When will it be at its best showing? I think seven eight years. Yeah. For sure. At least and then it will stay for ten years. It will stay. So we're talking about we're talking about twelve to thirteen years from the vent from the vintage from the This is the most aged wine in the world that the Bernardo de Montalcina is the most aged wine in the world as, by rules or by regulation Of course, many, many people like to come out with certain reserva after seven, eight years or whatever. But, by rules, the brunello de Montalcino is the most aged wine in the world. No wine in France, in Spain as a rule to come out after five years or worse after six years, the reserva. And, but really, really, this wine can be can be ruled out. Even after the eight years, it's impossible to keep a wine eight years in a cellar because we will go all bankruptcy because we'll be a big, big effort, but really the is an unbelievable, unbelievable clone. And now we are going to two sixteen. That is up to me. One more year. It's a very good vintage. And this reserve is a baby comparing to what what wine can do. So for everyone out there, it is that it needs one more age, years of aging. So Yes. This is why we're drinking all seventeen, and then the year before sixteen. And the alcohol on all of this is fourteen point point five. About. Yes. Fourteen. But some of them released fourteen, thirteen, fourteen, we put, you know, fifty or, fourteen. Yeah. Because this is the Italian rule just to be sure that is fourteen. Right. And the brunellas are fourteen. So give us in terms of the the volume of production so that our audience can kind of contextualize the production volume for the three bonellas that we were tasting. Okay. The brunello, the the vintage brunello is one hundred and twenty thousand bottles. That means a thousand cases. Cases. He's I'm horrible in cases. But I'm very good in bottles. Montousil is about twelve thousand, fourteen thousand. Bottles, and they serve at the same twelve thousand. And what are the price points, retail price points for these in Italy? In Italy is about the brunello's around forty, between forty and forty five euro. Montosedly is between sixty and seventy euros, and the result, but the same. I have a question for you. You have Caparto. See, you're competing with yourself, right? Like you're right next door. See. How do how do you manage that? You have two different companies, two different staff. So you're producing Yeah. Same wine, especially the brunello. Right? Yeah. So how do you what is the strategy in terms of communication? Like, it's too confusing to yourself that to somebody else. So, but that's a beautiful competition for the people that is working in here. It's a there is a beautiful competition, even with my employees. Artesinos to be better than Capardson Caparsos to be better than Altesino. But that's a very good push for all of them. It's beautiful. When you're representing the wines, right? Like the your family, you, yourself, your daughter, you're still representing both companies. Right? Yes. Yes. How do how do you you have to like change and it depends. If I'm doing a dinner for Artesino, of course, I'm telling it's not my only winery. I have other winery, one in Montalcino, And sometimes it's very good because maybe I'm doing a dinner for a casino. Somebody already knows caparzo. And they say, you're the caparzo lady. Oh, good. In that way. Actually. It's easy because they call me like that. They don't know my last name sometimes. And then you have a winery in County classic or winery Marima, maybe one day they will if they want to they I hope they will stay together. Right. Because it's nice to have a big group, but I always left Altezino as his own seller, his own vineyards, his own everything and capacity. They both go on their legs. And but then I said, I have two children. It's good to have two brunellos. And Altezino is part of the family. And then, especially, I was missing the a. And Artazine is the a, a, b, c, d. What about e? E is calving. I'm pregnant. You're in gestation of e? I'm in gestation of e. It's listen. It's not done yet. I don't like to talk I'm a superstitious person. I know you are you have your earrings with your elephants. You have the elephant out there directional to the gate. The the behind and the the the the trunk of the trunk. So you are superstitious. Yeah. I I am. I am. Like every Italian that sometimes Italian say, no, no, we are not superstitious, but, they don't like black cats, and they don't pass under the bridge. A ladder. Letter. That's that's very bad luck to pass. They never break a mirror, and I don't like number thirteen about that. That's me. That's me. Number thirteen. So this is a bit I was listen listening to the very first podcast this morning before I came here, and you were telling Monty that you wanted to buy this castle. Close by. They don't sell it. So so that that's like five years ago. Yeah. I know. We wanted to buy. It's the castle close by here. Yeah. Just right. Yeah. Okay. Because in this way, the road was all mine and, was the castle and then Altaisino, and then Carparza was me. And, I was able to make My kingdom, but it's okay. It's enough. It's enough. It's okay. But I have a nice project for the future. I will let you know as soon as it's done. Listen, so on a closing note, what would your what would you like your legacy to be? Do you know? Like, you know, you have now. I mean, you had grandchildren during earlier. Your daughter is now a full time on board for the wine. Yes. But what would you like, you know, when you die, okay? When you die, what would you like your legacy to be? Okay. The, they're starting to learn how beautiful is. I can understand they're young and they want to live in the seat. The seat is more exciting than being the country. But I think sooner or later, they will understand the important that, the country and this job and the richmond that was giving to me we'll give to them, having four wineries and being alone, managing everything. And, and plus I had a family to, to take care, was not easy. But, what the wine gave to me and the wine word, everything is around the wine. Like, you bruise all the people. And, because I'm learning every day from all the people around the wine, And it's such a challenge. This life in here is still, like I used to say, clean life, is a clean word made of, big values. It's not only money, the big matter, but it's to make out the perfect wine to be the one who is able to do the best out of what god gave to us, the dirt, the the the the ground, the the climate, the, in this special clone, sangiovese, that god bless him is the number one in the world. It's so faithful. Nobody is able to do such a big wine like we do in here. And that's unbelievable. They try in California. They try in France. They try everywhere. And, because I was able to change many jobs and to grow in my life. And, and now I'm able to make my children, involving the in this, and I hope my grandchildren and I open my legacy in understanding and appreciate such a magical word, such a clean, clean way to think, way to organize your days, that will go to them and and will touch them. And when I was working in the movie business, after a while, I was losing my enthusiasm. When I was working in pharmaceutical, This industrial is a word made of sharks, money, money, money is underneath everything. Of course, you need the money. In other ways, you don't survive. You go bankruptcy, you close everything, but but it's not the main aim. It's not it can't be the main focus. Not the focus. It's, the dream in my soul in my heart is to make the perfect what I consider course. What's for me is the perfect wine? On that note, thank you for hosting us. Thank you. Thank you. Congratulations. You are already a let No. I'm not so in incredible woman and wine. Very generous. And, you know, I love Elizabeth because she's always anytime you say sunny. She always has a sudden disposition and I think that is a very good positive note and energy to inject in everything that we do. So she's working on plan e So we will have to come back and find out what that is. So that's a wrap from Altazino Prunello de Montalcino here with Elizabeth Nudi Angelini Angelini. Thank you. Thank you for joining us on another installment of On The Road Edition, hosted by Stevie Kim. Join her again next week for more interesting content in the Italian wine scene. You can also find us at Italian wine podcast dot com or wherever you get your pods. You can also check out our YouTube channel. Mama jumbo shrimp to watch these interviews and the footage captured of each location.