Ep. 2200 Giampiero Cordero at Ristorante Il Centro di Priocca | On The Road With Stevie Kim

And normally where when they ask me, where is Priyoke? I always say it's easy to to say because it's twenty minutes far for everywhere. It's twenty minutes to Barolo. It's twenty minutes from, Barbara. It's twenty minutes from, old import more important village in, in the language region. Welcome to another episode of On The Road Edition, hosted by Stevie Kim. Each week, Stevie travels to incredible wine destination interviewing some of the Italian Weinstein's most interesting personalities, talking about wines, the foods, as well as the incredible travel destinations. Okay. So for those who are less familiar, where is Priyanka? Okay. Where is Prial? Yeah. We are just in the, in in Piamonte, and we are in the center of the Royal region that we are is very close to the to the Lananga region. The the part more more important, more famous in Piamonte for the the wine for making Barolo, barbaresco, and obviously rare. We are just in a small vintage because we are two thousand people in Priyoca. Priyoca? Tell me, like, what is it near? Priyoca is near Okay. You know, but all it's like ten minutes away from Okay. Whatever. And normally, well, when they ask me, where is Priyoke, I always say it's easy to to say because it's twenty minutes far for everywhere. It's twenty minutes to Barolo. It's twenty minutes from, barbaresco is twenty minutes from, old import more important village in, in the language region. So, you know, your restaurant is called El centro. Right? Why is it called centro? And I hear, it says since nineteen fifty six. That sounds pretty. Yeah. We are getting a bit old. Yes. Yeah. But, my the restaurant was, opened my by my grandfather, my grandmother, in So this is that you're the third generation. I I supposed to be the third generation because now I always say that I I help my father and my mother. They have still, you know, the more important person in the in the restaurant and was opened by my grandfather and my grandmother in April nineteen fifty six. In that moment, my my father will used to be the chef, but just after a few few years that, my they opened the restaurant, my grandfather dead. So my grandmother start to be the the chef of the restaurant. Since nineteen eighty three, my mother, she's the the chef, and my father is always the I don't want to say that he is the boss because the real boss in a Italian family is always the the lady, the mom, but she is the the general manager of the restaurant. The smile of the restaurant is always taking care of the customer. And, since let me say two thousand thirteen for fourteen. I help him, both, my father and my mother, but they're more focusing the, in the seller, to making the wine list and to take care also the customer. Okay. So before we get into the seller, because you have an amazing I've been to a lot of as an amazing seller. But before we get to that, tell me a little bit about restaurant. What is your first of all, is this it's a Michelin Star restaurant. Is that correct? Yeah. It's, it's a Missionstone restaurant since, I think, two thousand ten. But it's still a very, very traditional restaurant. My grandmother, my mother, they always used to make traditional recipe from Kemonte, and I want also for the future of the restaurant, that the idea, and then, the style of the restaurant not change. Obviously, we try to do year after year that things better and better, try to be more fine, more elegant, but always respecting what is the traditional food of the mountain. So give me give me some examples of the traditional dishes which are more like your signature dishes from from your restaurant. Sure. Well, let me say that all the the homemade pasta are for sure a senior tour from this restaurant, but also, very old recipe or the menu called Fritomisto, that we prepared just in the winter season from January to March, and, that is made with all the interior part of beef pork, like, the food of the pig, the brain, the liver, the sweet bread, all these kind of things that can sound strange, but, they are amazing, and also they are talking about the history of our area. So Frrito. Yeah. It's not fish. It's not fish. Absolutely. It's just. Many cats told me, but it's made with fish. No. Because it's not common in in piemonta with fish apart, obviously, a anchovy and other fish. Right. Right. So it's frito mister, but with meat. Yeah. Meat. And All types of meat. Yeah. But meat and vegetable because of vegetables. Yeah. Vegetables. There are more or less twenty six pieces, between meat and vegetable. So normally we start from the foot of the pig, and in the brain of the beef. Okay. It sounds almost trainee. It's not for our for our tasting menu. So you have to be ready to do that. Psychologically also. Yeah. Absolutely. Every single parts of the of the meat. Yeah. Both pork and cow. Yeah. Okay. Twenty six pieces. Alrighty. Then that was frito mister. Okay. But do you have it all year round? No. Just January, February, March. Okay. So Also, because we we can also have have a free tomato in, in August, but, you know, everything fried in August is maybe it's a bit hard to do. Alright. Okay. Yeah. So what are some other dishes? So you have. Well, all the, obviously, the plain, the plain. Okay. Also the the tayat. Is it something different? Like, it it's your recipe because, of course, everybody makes ravioli and your lot of red plain. Right? Let me say the we are our style to make the the ravioli plain that it was, right from my grandmother recipe, but it's a really, really traditional. So with, rabbit, pork, and veal, And, but also the pork and veal. And also the the tayarine that we to make it, we they are, first of all, cut by hand, but they are made with for one kilo of flour, thirty four eggs. So again, it's a really, really strong recipe. And, Wait. So so tell me that a tayat tayatine, right, with the j. Yeah. Right? So give me a little background for those who are less familiar. Yeah. What is tayatine? Tayatine. The smaller, let me say, define tayat tayat. And in our dialect, it is also reminded that we also call it Capeli de Angeli. I don't know in English. Andrea was right. Capeli de Angeli because they are they must be very fine And the only way to do it is by hand. Okay. So at the beginning, when you work, when you start working in Chantra, it could be dangerous because you start to cut the tire in, but my mother asked to cut very fine. So sometime you you have a problem with with the fingers. Okay. Yeah. Yes. It's one of the more traditional things, and we are just a few restaurants that continue to cut by hand, this this pasta because it's not easy to do it. Yeah. Yeah. We went to Antica Dorreza. They are one of the best Iara in that Iara. They are really, really good, really, really nice. But you know the good place with others. I could just go with the locals. Yeah. You know, I go where the locals are. Yeah. Okay. And what about something else besides Tairin? And I'm newly and then we have the the real cheek caramelized with fix. My mother used to prepare all the marmalade, all the the things prepared in a small container, the the, and we call, that is the small container in, in glass, and they used to make us the figs. And, in November, we used to, to make these dishes and we caramelize the meat with the sauce of the fix that my mother prepared in the summer. So we do many things like the Fruta Sherapata, so the fruit under syrup that we serve, in the winter, but the is not nothing new. It's very old, old recipe that my mother used to my grandmother used to do it. So we are continuing just to tell the story of the customer, the story about our region. The So your your grandma mom was a chef. Yeah. Your mom's a chef. Do you know how to to be honest, I'm not the chef. I I don't want to be a chef, but, when I was younger, I was working in a different restaurant, like in Spain, in France. Uh-huh. What are you doing? In the kitchen. I was working in the kitchen. Okay. Not because I was thinking in the future, my future, I will become a chef, but because, I knew that in the future, I will be probably alone. So I want to be able to talk with my future chef. Uh-huh. So this is just the the the reason why I was working in the But you never had the, this, like, you know, ambition to become a showcase. As you know, my patient and my ambition is to work in the wine. Okay. In the next month, in in other Alright. So let's talk about the wine. What is going on in the cellar downstairs? Well, when I start to work here, let me say twelve years ago more or less. My father told me from the first day, So, and to today, I was in care I was taking care of the seller. Now it's your turn. And from one side, I was very happy. Mhmm. The other side, I was afraid because I said I don't want to do stupid things. So my first year, I just take the past invoice and I copy me exactly what my father did last year. Right. And then later by little, I tried to do what I was thinking was right. So to I tried to I start buying, different, different producer and keeping back in the seller. So for this reason, now we have the forty percent of the wine that we have in the seller. They are still not on the list, because the idea was doing like my father did in the past. So buying, keeping the seller to give the opportunity of the customer in the future to have the to have the old vintage barolo barbaresco and also burgundy because it's my second patient after, obviously, longer region. I know you're a burgundy expert. Aldo said you're a burgundy expert. I it's not true. I'm burgundy lover. Okay. I always afraid to say expert because there is also always something new to to learn. And we I think there is also something more to improve, especially the knowledge. So I never say expert. I always say lover. So I, of course, I'm looking at your wine list It's I mean, there's wine list of patega del vino, and then there's the wine list of El centro, which is pretty impressive in itself. How many wines do you have on the list? First of all. On the list, I think around, we have more than one thousand labeled, but in fact in the seller, we have more than one thousand six hundred the different label. And the idea was, when I started to That's crazy. Gonna start to to make the wine list and to take care of the seller was to start buying and wait until, the the seventy anniversary of the restaurant that will be in two years. Mhmm. And in two years, the idea is putting all the wine that we have in the cellar in the wine list. Uh-huh. No. But with without any So it's going to be like it's like this big now. It's going to be like this. More or less the double. Yeah. But not not because I think that the old wine are better than the the young, but is, for me, it's always more emotional and interesting to to drink a whole bottle, for example, of barolo, bar barresco, but also roero, because, you have the story to tell. It's that he tell the story about the vintage about, you know, maybe the father of the the the the producer is something really that make me really emotional. I don't know if the the right the the right word. So when, would describe to me your typical day. Okay. Because you are working a lot. Right? Many hours, waking hours. Well, now, to be honest, I I start start not very early, but around seven thirty. In the morning because, I Did you hear that, David Day? He starts half past seven. Be because, I have another project that was born just, let me say eleven months ago Mhmm. That, is not a second job, but is my really patient that is all about wine. I started my one import company. I imported wine from, especially France for the moment. Burgundy. Burgundy. Yeah. And, so I started with the team of the import company. And normally we start in the morning around eight o'clock in the office. Mhmm. Then I go ahead normally until, twelve o'clock, and then I move to the restaurant. So I do the shift, with the all the team of the restaurant. Finish the shift. I come back to the office. At the at the restaurant, what is your role, What are you doing? I can say many, many nice things. Sign the general manager. I'm the Sommelier. I'm a no. I do what is necessary. So if, we need the one chef Durange, I will be the chef Durange. If I need to work as a Sommelier, I do the Sommelier. If I have to clean because it's, it's, old restaurant, but it's still a familiar restaurant. So we still want to keep it keep it like this. So, and normally, I'm in charge of the on the service and on the wine cellar, But during the service, I want that the people doing the things. So I we have a, we have the chef, the rank, and I want to support them where they need. So I know I I don't want to say I, the boss, I have I just have to say what is necessary to to do it. Your what do you have to do? Whatever it takes. Yeah. So Whatever you need to do. Yeah. So What are what are the the main challenges now running a restaurant? How many how many seats do you have? Now, well, after COVID, the things are changed a lot. So before COVID, we used to do until maybe sixty, seventy customer. It depends about, the number of the every single table because after six per person, more than six person we ask for tasting menu, so it's more easy to to manage. Now we are doing like thirty five to thirty, customer maximum. So it's different, but now the the big challenge, why is it so much less less customer. It's more difficult to to find employed. So my idea was to reduce to be we are less, but doing fifty percent less customer Wow. It means that we are at the same, at the same, level. And, You mean, in terms of the quality of the service. You want to give the same high level service, but you don't have staff. Yeah. I don't have staff. So Is it waitstaff mostly? In this moment, yes, because luckily in the kitchen, we are, we are an office And then I always say my my mother worked for five people, like, five, five cook. So we are, we are a lot, but I think you have kind of cycle things a little by little. This year is is more is better than last year. So the things little by little, I I think they are coming back to the normal, going back to normal. So, yes, but the more important things in our restaurants to to build a good stuff So this is the the big challenge. And obviously, we try to increase the quality every year, both in the in the kitchen side, but also in the in the front style in every part of the restaurant. So So you're open every day? No. Right now, we are I choose to be closed more, so we close Monday, Tuesday, all day. And, Wednesday, we are open just for dinner. And then the rest of the day, we are open lunch and dinner. But to my focus in the in future is to give out all the employed, all the people working with us, not for us, but with us, to have more time, more free time to enjoy the the life is not easy. Is not financially easy. Mhmm. But this is my my goal for the futures to to Yeah. I mean, I don't know how it sounds very romantic, to be quite honest. Right? Because in the at the same time, you have less business Yeah. Yeah. Fifty percent less business, but you want to give more benefit to your employees. It's very noble, but I I don't know. I can't really understand how that works in business sense. I don't know also. Because it just means you will work a lot. Yeah. But, yeah, but you will know because if in two years, I will ask you for a job. Yeah. I did something wrong. But, yeah, this is the focus that I want maybe little by little increase the quality and reduce the number of the gas because it's the only way to to go ahead with the with the quality. And, but always doing with the same patient and to keep the patient for me we are also to really take care of the people working with us. So next door Yeah. Also you opened a hospitality. Yeah. It's it's like a COVID baby. You opened it, you closed it. And so tell us a little bit about the structure. Yeah. The idea was to open a small, let me say, Bouticotel or resort. I don't know exactly the name. In Priyoca. In Priyoca, the center of the word. And, and we try to really to do our our best to make a very nice place because we want to keep the people, also in our our part of the region, so in the Royal region. So the idea was to build a very special place, where the people, they aren't they they're not coming here in Priyanka just to Italy gentle or drink, the rare of from, a producer from Priyoca. Mhmm. But also because maybe they want to spend tonight at the Demora Corder. So it it take for us three years and a half to build this as more resort. And, I, we call it, COVID resort because opened just in two thousand twenty. So we opened and then we closed. Right. Right. So it was not, so easy, but now we are the things are going back to the normals. So we are happy and it's working well. Everything's going for the moment, well. Okay. So let's drink some wine. What do you what did you prepare for us today? Well, we are in the rare. So I think we the idea is to drink something local. So here, we have a two great expression of rare. One is, from Almundo, a very, very well known and famous, producer from, Montea. I have a big connection with them because I was studyingology with, one of the sun, federic Almundo. And the other one is something also important for me is Aruero, but made here in Priyoca. So it's made the winery is, let me say, a three hundred meter from the restaurant. So it's something really, really local. And, it's made by the corduro family, not our family, but another. Oh, another cordy. Another cordy. But in Priyoca is easy because the fifty percent of the family, the name is Cordero. Oh, okay. And they're not all your relatives? No. No. Absolutely. And this was this is a twenty twenty euro and was the first vintage of this winery honored by Jefranco, Serena, and Gabriela Cordero. The owner is also very famous because this is a very famous analogist. It's making wine with for many, many winery in all over Italy. Super analogist. Yeah. And, it was nice to to talk about this wine. Also because as as as I said, that is made in Priyaka, the vineyard is in Priyaka, the winery is in Priyaka, and he's the first vintage of this winery. So just give us a little just a little bit of a background there for our audience. Who are less familiar because everybody, I reckon Longgate is much more famous. Yeah. For for us, for what we Can you give them a little bit of, like, you know, a little, the differences and similarities? Yeah. So when we talk about, Abiola, we have many different expression of nebbiolo. One could be, for example, barolo. And when we are talking about barolo, there are inside of the barolo area. There are many different, village many different land where you can produce Barolo. But then there is Barbaresco, and then there is always made with one hundred percent of biola. What changed in in some way, I love to say that, If you compare Rioo to Barbarresco Barolo, the people that are always saying, well, Royro is less, less thanic. Royro is less, you have less structure. Is that sure of that? Yeah. But the point is that, how we can, talk about, that. So less, less, less, for me is a plus. So when we say, yeah, it's less tonic, where you can find less structure, but this is the plus of the the rare. I mean, it's more for sure it's less static, but it's more fine, more elegant. It's something more soft because we are more sandy soil. So it's normal that, you know, the structure is not like a sierra lunga is is normal. But for me, I always want to try to explain what is rare of for Miro is not the less, a barolo with less or barbaresco with less, but is, talking about also my second patient, Bergen, is the burgundy part of the language region. You heard it here first. So of of the language region. So it's not less. It's just different. And it's important to explain that to the people because many times when we talk about, for example, burgundy, we we talk about Shasamua Rache or Shabali, if if I ask you, which is the different and ninety percent of the people, they are saying, this is just different, you cannot compare. And this is the same things between, many, for many, many, many, many different producer between Rueiro and Barolo. Both are great. Both are good. Just are different because the soil is different now. Less well known. Of course. But it it takes times, but in our region, in our part, so in rare, like, also in the in the language, there are many young, producers that are working very well. So I'm sure that in the future, many people, they will start to drink also Royal. And So let's let's I I don't want you to put you on a spot, but can you give some recommendations of the Royalero produces? Well, the other Because, I mean, I know. I know. So many great ones, but because people are not familiar with Ruedo Cruisers. It is is I I always, for me, it's always difficult to say some name because when I say one name, it means that I not saying many different names. So it's I know. It's not easy, but for example, we are drinking these two. We are testing these two. So, this one And this one Tell us about, these two producers. So, again, this one, the first one, the Royalero twenty twenty, from Gabrielle Cordero is a really new project, but the end of this year. It's not your relative, not your cousin. No. It's a it's a long cousin. This this this is a long cousin, but it's not, we are not really the same family. But, so it is a young story, but very interesting. And also if he's a young producer because Gabriela, the son is very young with, his sister, but they have the background because they have the knowledge to make wine. So he's new, but with old, old, with with the well known, knowledge. The second one, Almundo from Monta, of course, old, old winery, let me say, old winery from, from Monta, but, now, there are Stefón, and federico, they are the two sons of the winery. They are extremely, extremely great and smart guy. Federico is one of the more for me, well known analogist in our region, not just in the Royal also in the Barbarresca Barolo, everyone in Puerto Rico, and we studied together and all of the schools. So I am very, very friend with him, and I yeah. So there are diff two different expression because one is made in Monta, one is Priyaka, but they they have in common the finest of and the elegance of our special land. So what what about in terms of value? What are, like, the price points? Let's say, let's leave out, what about, are they similar in terms of the price points. To be honest, no, if you would think about a medium, medium price, the average. Yeah. Average price, could be the thirty percent, forty percent of a pro, bottle of, Barbaresco Barolo. So a little by little, they are increasing because, also the people, they are more and more understand the quality and the value of this this wine, but there is still a gap price talking between, very good values. Absolutely. Yes. Absolutely. Yes. Okay. So let's drink this. For me, is, as I said before, is a kind of, is is not easy to to compare and to to understand in, blind tasting. This is, I was just going to ask you that because it's a bit of a cheeky question. Yeah. But how in a blind tasting, how can you tell the difference between barbaresco. It's not easy because, because now all the, also, the quality of the white making is going very high. But normally, what I try to find to to understand in a black tasting, if it's rare, if it's barbaresco barolo, is, for sure, the quantity of fruit at the noise and the quality of toning and the quantity of the toning. So if I feel, you know, very soft soft toning and a lot more fluid at the noise, I am more in the in the railroad region, but it's not always true because also there are main great expression in Barolo. Yeah. When the tannin where the tanya are extremely soft, it's like Seta. So it's not so easy, but the this is the you know, the things that I try to to understand and to check when I taste in a blind tasting. Yeah. I mean, it's a gross generalization. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah, I think we can wrap this up for today. Thank you for having us. What about the food pairing? Just one last question. I always have one last question. David, it's that video's gonna kill me, but We were talking about Irene. So for me, a glass of nebbiolo could be and dish of, tiring if it's possible with white truffle is the heaven. Yeah. White truffle in the autumn. In in autumn, now with the with the sausage ragu, with the beer ragu, with, you know, also just with plate this of cheese, a local cheese. What about Frritomisto? We're free to mister everybody asking me which is the best pairing. But for me, with Frritomisto is something with great acidity, something young, because Frito Misto is the star. So I don't want to try to find a a big pairing with the wine because the focus is Frito Mist. Alrighty. And thank you so much for having us today. And It's a pleasure. Thank you very much. With Italian Mind people. And if you come to Priyoca, you will not miss and we call him, because there's nothing else. Shanna Gatsy. Thank you for joining us on another episode of On The Road Edition, hosted by Stevie Kim. Join her again next week for more interesting content on the Italian wine scene. You can also find us at Italian wine podcast dot com or wherever you get your pods. You can check out our YouTube channel, mama jumbo shrimp, to watch these interviews, and the footage captured at each location. Changing.