Ep. 1981 McKenna Cassidy interviews Lorenzo Fornaini | The Next Generation

The Italian wine podcast is the community driven platform for Italian winegeeks around the world. Support the show by donating at italian wine podcast dot com. Donate five or more Euros, and we'll send you a copy of our latest book, my Italian GrapeGeek journal. Absolutely free. To get your free copy of my Italian GreatGeek journal, click support us at italian wine podcast dot com, or wherever you get your pots. Welcome to the Italian wine podcast. This is the next generation with me, your host, Mckenna Cassidy. For the next thirty minutes, I invite you to explore with me what young adults are up to in the Italian wine scene. Today, let's feast on our discussion of Italian wine, travel, food, and culture. Thank you for being here. Grab a glass with us. Chinching. Hello, everyone. Welcome. I am Makenna, and I'm here with Lorenzo, the winemaker for Paso Picciado, and tenuto, and we're so so excited today to chat with him. He is a young person in the industry. I'll let him introduce himself, but can't wait to dive into these iconic Tuskin and Cecilian wines. Welcome, Lorenzo. Hi, Mackin. Thanks for the invitation. Absolutely. It's a pleasure to meet you. Cheers. Same to you. So I understand that you were born in Pisa in nineteen ninety five. Yeah. And you grew up there, and then you studied Viticulture and inology at the University of Pisa before you, worked to your first harvest at tenuta di Prinoro. Could you talk to us just introduce yourself to Tate how old you are and describe how you got started in the wine industry. On my path in the worth of wine, I studied physical terminology in pizza, and I experienced with a few vintages in the Pisan Hills area, you know, Colina Pizane, and, yeah, my home, just three vintages. In two thousand and seventeen, I pasted my first service at the notetrinau in Tuscany. It was supposed to be just an experience, to then decide whether to continue my studies or leave Italy. But at the end of the two thousand seventeen harvest, Andrea Franketti asked me if I would like to start something, together and stay at Triinaro. So the decision was already made per pay. So gravely, I grew with his vision and my approach. Now after Trinora, I started going down to Aetna and discovering the fantastic world as well. Okay. And now I really enjoy working with both wineries. Yeah. So you met Andrea almost twenty years after he basically had found Grubbie little corner of Veltelcha, and he was planting there to the confusion of every one bordeaux varieties in those, like, heavy clay soils with lots of rain and heat. And by the time you met him, he had clearly been successful, and he had moved to Sicily in two thousand and six. So you met him in the Tuscany area, but then when did he introduce you to Sicily after your tuscan internship? My first, approach on Motneta was in, two thousand nineteen. So two years later than, Trinorro. Okay. I started in Trinorro. And for the Shardony Harvest, so in augusta, we moved together, me and Andrea, to pick it to Harvista, the Shardony, or choose the right moment. It was my first approach on Aetna word. I owe my rapid growth to Andrea Frank Katie was a white man who who managed to leave a strong mark on the white word just a few years. Yeah. Let's talk about him. What was kind of his influence on you or his approach to analogy and winemaking that was so meaningful to you? Really in everything because it, for me, was also, yeah, my bosses, but also a friend, but a mentor. He started when he was over forty years old, make wine, managed to create an icon like, the denoteds, you know, ring too skinny, and to start an incredible territory like Aetna. So I've always been impressed by his vision. Andreas stories incredible, bring, from Rome in search of peace and tranquility he found this robot place in Tuscany that had the potential to do something, unique for him. So make a great wine. Grand Vanuto, in a corner of Tuscany in Portcha Valle, Valdorcha. Is on the border withumbria Elacio. He has chosen a unique, called, really wide the territory with altitudes for Tuscany because, it's from four hundred meters to seven hundred fifty. With the you're talking about clay. Yeah. It's a with a lot of clay, blue clay. To create what perimeter is a great wine. So, burdo style, all, without compromise only for quality. So he started the intenotate honor and planted the merlot, carbonate Frank, carbonate, always the incredible choices. To choosing a forgotten territory and planting, for example, a lot of governor Frank. At time when our producer in Tuscany at the end of eighty, Kianti, or especially on the coast, the producers planted a lot of coverness ofignon. And Andrea planted a lot of cover in Frank, different. I don't know about America, but in Italy, everyone is talking about cover in Frank. Many want to produce it, then everyone's really wants to taste it. It's a trend. I don't know in America. As wine nerds in America, we love cabernet franc, and we don't have enough of it locally. I mean, I think I've had several California, Cabernet francs or Napa Valley, Cabernet francs, and they're so delicious, but it's just not really a focus, except for a few other discreet areas. So it's a grape that's deeply adored and whenever especially single varietal bottlings of cabernet franc, which are truly expressive of their place, and and usually just have very detailed personalities as wines. It's really cool to hear that it's a trend in this area. That's amazing. I also wanted to say congratulations. I noticed the twenty nineteen vintage of Tenunita Ditha in order was a hundred points Robert Parker. You know, we don't live for the scores, but we appreciate when they recognize our work. It was a very good village. What are you seeing with the back to the cavity front point? Like, why is it a trend right now? I think it's, can temporary taste. We are lucky because of those choices of Andrea are incredible, and now we are lucky to have a heritage of over eleven actors of Cabernet Frank over thirty years old. We won't make, a win win structure concentration, but also with the energy. And, Cabernet Frank had passed in this way. So the elegance and the Hennerge of Cabernet Frank. It's incredible. So now we are lucky to have a heritage these actors. Yeah. That's outstanding. What is the verification process like how the cabernet franc is growing on these clay soils? Like, are there uniquenesses to VINification here versus, clearly other parts of the world where cabernet franc is grown? We have twenty five hectares, and we made in every vintage forty, fifty different plots. So for find the perfect ripeness of each plots. And, we have the alcoholic fermentation in the steel tank. And, every plots at the history So a lot of more above, it's a tailor work for each plots. But the most important choice is the moment of the harvest, the day when we pick the grape we want, especially for covering up rank, pass on the varietal flavors and pick up before the over ripeness. In these, short windows in this, few moments, we can take the grape with a right ripeness, and we can find the the terroir and the vintage in the glass. It's important for us, the moment. Would you say are you picking at a moment of just ripe? Like, obviously avoiding over ripeness, but are you almost bordering on under ripe? Or are you really waiting for a balance? Like, where's your threshold to maintain, like, the balance of acidity and expression. We taste every morning. The grape of different plots. So the work is taste and taste. We have a an incredible laboratory, but the final decision is after taste the grape. What chemical analysis are you using? Are you using a certain bricks level? Are you referencing other metrics to make your choice? We looked at the sugar level, the c d t, but it's, important about the final decision is the taste. That's awesome. We don't have to dwell on the numbers, but we're looking for a taste. And clearly that paid off in your excellent vintage release. That's so that's so special. Thanks for sharing that. Are you enjoying this podcast? Don't forget to visit our YouTube channel, mama jumbo shrimp for fascinating videos covering Stevie Kim and her travels across Italy and beyond. Meeting winemakers, eating local food, and taking in the scenery. Now, back to the show. I know that we're talking about cabernet franc, but sadly, cabernet franc is not an indigenous Italian grape variety, and our audience loves indigenous Italian grape varieties. So we'll have to switch over to a different part of Italy. I noticed that in two thousand and six, andrea Fagan Kathy or mentor and original boss. He purchased vineyards on Mount Aetna on Sicily, and he was really going with the intention of producing wine to rival the top bordeaux estates. Frankly planting those types of grapes there. But then working with local grape growers and winemakers, he really discovered the potential of Nodala Moskalese. And now he produced several contrade that are all hallmarks of their discreet, areas. Would you explain that a little bit to us? Really Andrea discovered at nine ninety eight. And, the first vintage was at two thousand and one of Baso Pesharo. Another incredible project, Andrea, another incredible vision. In his constant search for altitudes and call temperature to rediscover Aetna, and finding, unscent vineyards of Nerelomaskaleza. So we decided to invest, and understand the potential of this territory. The first, you both rampante Rampante is, our highest, contract at, one thousand meters. But the wonderful things for me is that you wanted to make Aetna known to the world. And so they haven't control that Aetna was born, where he brought together other producers, and journalists to taste together. So it was incredible. It's so special. So I noticed so Contrada P is grown on lava rock. For Korea. That's, like, crumbly lava rock. And then. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. The name, are crazy also for us. It's Italian people. It's difficult as for us. That's why I can go by contradece. But if you can say see the right way. So that's like lower in elevation, so like a rounder, softer wine, which is usually shown in the lowest elevations of Aetna. And then Shada Nwova is new lava flow. So it's, like, very bright and herbaceous. I wanna give a shout out to a wine list in Chicago that really does a nice feature of your wines. Acipia is a Michelin Star restaurant in the area that has, like, a full page. It's a really great reference. And just for someone in America trying to dive in. And I know several other restaurants, this is where I'm calling in from today, but like Italian Village or RPM or Next or Purple Pig. Like, you were talking about your recent visit. It's cool because your wines are so they're kind of part of a collection. Like, they're all different and seeing something unique, but they're all passively show. Like, they're all going to represent the same philosophy and intention while also displaying these discreet differences in the contrarade. So I I just think that's so special. Yeah. The differences between the contrade are incredible. The contrade are like a crew. So all lava flows, from different areas at various altitudes and under different climate condition because we started the lowest at five hundred meters and the high goes. It's one thousand meters. It's the wrong panther. So we have five hundred meters of difference. It's incredible. And also, the soil change change a lot. For example, CapI imagine is the only soil where we don't have a one hundred percent of volcanic soil. It's, yeah, volcanic soil, but this, meet the limestone from the Messina area. So we have a a little bit different talent structure. Different to, for example, for Kalia, it's, a little part inside the FELO Demedo Demedo Demedo is the largest contrada, omo, Aetna, Aetna Nord. Another part, the difference is a Sharranwaba. So you say, right. So the new lava flow, Sharonwaba. The name is the new lava flow. And, another altitude the first love of Andrea was Ramante, for example, the first, contrada. It's incredible. And the results of today for me, it's, everyone is talking about Aetna. You're talking about Aetna from Chicago. And you taste, in a lot of restaurant, two weeks ago, I was in America. I was in a wine bar when an American guy asked, can I have an at Madoc? For me, it was amazing. The residents of, Andrea work and, the Aetna dot org is incredible. Do you feel like he really helped to give international identity to the wine region of Sicily to the point where it was it almost became organized in a way where people could latch on to, like, an understanding of what this terroir was offering. What do you feel like was this global impact? Why it's Aetna so popular? Probably the same reason of a cabernet franc. It's a contemporary taste. So, especially for Nerellamaskaleza for this indigenous grape, it's more easy, keep it freshness and the drinkability. And now the customer want this drinkability with the, all temperature of the summer. So normally increase in the Italian market, the white wine, and, the wine like, or other grape with a more freshness. Probably it's this. It's this. How old was the gentleman who asked for Anetna doc at the wine bar. Was he a young person? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Young person. Oh, he was young. He was young. Young person. So do you feel you and I are considered part of the next generation do you feel that Aetna will help wine survive is everyone's concern? Yeah. I think it's approachable in that drinkability. Meanwhile, like, I can't wait to taste these contrade in a long time from now. Like, I'm really excited to taste these Glentrade once they have aged, especially the highest altitude ones. I just think it'll be magnificent and being able to enjoy now. And in the future, it's just this timeless and very welcoming, like drinkability, like you were talking about. It's, what we want to do really. It was the Android vision and also mine the approach of the verification and make wine that you recognize is a great wine now, and you finish the bottle, obviously. But you can have deposits to enjoy it again after ten years. That's right. And I know that you're currently spearheading all the winemaking. How do you feel like you're continuing the legacy, but also innovating vintage to vintage. First of all, having the vision and knowledge of a territories fundamental to understand what you want to do and what you can. So also understand the vintage and the vintage will change, especially for the climate change. I believe it's important for such iconic wines, to maintain a style and philosophy, but we work for the Nutatranaro and Paso fish are in the same direction to find the best from each territory. Today, more than ever, with the right attention of alcohol, obviously, we often end up drinking very ripe wines normally, unfortunately, where the varietal character is so strong that it makes the wines very similar. Our goal is, to make wines that express a lot of territory in the glass and that are clean, ripe, energetic, vibrant, and fresh. So it's important to keep this style for us and for me, obviously. Yeah. I'm with you. That's so cool. I brought a quote to our meeting today. It is from Andrea. He's describing Aetna, and I wanted to offer it. It's pretty poetic, so read it for us. I just think it really creates the sense of exactly what you're describing. So Andrea said, there is no mold, no moss, the ground sparkles black like the night. The wine slowly becomes very elegant and strange. During the day, a soft delight penetrates everything, and then there are starry nights. Aetna has enormous poetry, making wine you have access to it. There isn't mother nature here. You are conducting your Viticulture on stuff that comes out of the Terrible below. And this made me think of you as the winemaker now conducting your Viticulture on the stuff from the terrible below with these soil. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It makes sense. Yeah. It makes sense. Absolutely. Absolutely. Yes. Could you have envisioned yourself as a young student? Now making wine in different regions of Italy. Where are you dreaming to make next? Probably the first, important goal is to keep the quality of this such iconic wines for a long time. And, also, we have a a lot of new project. So with, my vision, find the right way of this new project. I can spoil something. I trust you. It's okay. We'll just have the shadow of it here. No spoiler, but I hate that there might be a spoiler. So there you go. No spoiler. I'm sorry. But, yeah, the approach is only for the quality. Absolutely. Because, it's important for me work in a wineries and seller in the state where you can talk about only quality and not the number. Change everything really. If you work for the quality, change your approach of everything. It's outstanding. I'm just like tasting the grapes off the vines instead of getting lost in the weeds of the numbers. You maintained the artistry of it from the inspiration. It's incredible move from Tuscany, the solitude, the, in Orchavale, to a very different lifestyle in Sicily. It's incredible, yeah, very interesting. That's outstanding. Well, thank you so much. I know I've run out of time, but Lauren, so it's such a treat to get to know you and congratulations again on the praise. That you're receiving for your wines. It's definitely well earned. And I can't wait till you come back to the States and we will all cheers again. Yeah. Absolutely. Or I hope to see you in Tuscany or Sesame when you want. I have Absolutely. Maybe that would be better. I'll just come there. That's a great idea. Thank you for the opportunity, Mackenzie. It was a a pleasure, really. Thank you. Tante grazier for joining me today. Remember catch our episodes weekly on the Italian wine podcast. Available everywhere you get your pods. Salute.