Ep. 160 Monty Waldin interviews Viviana Malafarina (Basilisco Winery) | Discover Italian Regions: Basilicata

Italian wine podcast. Chinching with Italian wine people. Hello. This is the Italian wine podcast. My name is Monty Walden. My guest today is Viviana Malafarina. It's great. Yes. My name Malafarina. From the basilisko winery, where was the basilisko winery? Vasidisco is in basilicata on a beautiful volcano six hundred meters above sea level. And the volcano's name is. Voltore. The Vulture. Yes. So Alianico del Voltore Exactly. Is a red wine. And who is the owner of Vasidisco? The owner is Antonio Capalda, which is the same owner of Saudi de Sandrigario. And how long have you worked there? Sixty voted. So I've started two thousand and ten, and, my first introduced two thousand eleven. Okay. So how just tell us a little bit about the the size of the estate. How many hectares of vineyard do you have a Basidiscan? We have to total vineyard, our twenty five vector, the properties fifty hectares. Everything is organic, and, the winery produce around fifty five to sixty five thousand bottle. Okay. And on the other land that you have, do you have olives? Or was it just spare land or alcohol? No. They're mostly olives or fruit. And what kind of fruit lemons oranges? Everything. No. No. Like, we hear of, I don't know, all the name in English. Beaches, albicakes. So apricots, figs. Cherries, like, bit of cherries. Pears and apples. Yes. That's a nice mix. Yeah. So who was who was the previous owner? Was it some old Contadino? Some old. Yeah. Exactly. Yes. Yeah. And, he sold because he retired? Well, mostly the the the old people from Residicata, they kept the vineyards until they couldn't, then the new generation preferred to try to work in a big cities. Yes. Like in Portenza, which is the main, which is the capital city of the basilicata region. Okay. So tell me about the wines that you make. How many different, allianic or wines do you make? We make one white wine, which is a fiano. Okay. Only about five to six thousand bottle per All the rest is Eljanico, and I make, mostly two labels, which are the selection wine, basilisko, and the entrance wine, which is Tiodosio, hundred percent Eljanic, all of them, and then three cruise, which are, just a single vineyards. One is called the fontanelle, which is a young wine, and one is a croix, which is a piano decrocher. They all the the different contrade in in Barile. So the contrade is like the local, the how the areas were divided up locally with with names relevant to that local area. So people knew whose land was whose forms. Yeah. And then the the third one is, Storico, which is a vineyard, which is over eighty years old. Storico means historical. Yeah. Yeah. And it actually is, it's like the old to eighty years old. More than eighty five. We don't know exactly how long ago it's been planted, but it's like a prephy loxera, Pio de Franco, and it's, the the growing is, a cappano, which is like the old tomato style with canes. We have about, a reduction, which is in a good vintage. It's about, twelve to fifteen quintals per hectare, which is not not a lot. Yeah. No. So when you say plant, we mean ungrafted. Yeah. Ungrafted. And you can do that because the soil is. It's volcanic. It's like sense. Yeah. Yeah. So you're basically on a volcano, aren't you? Or an extinct volcano? Yes. The volcano is thirteen hundred meters. We are about six twenty meters above sea level. And, all the soils are, like, I would say, ninety five percent. Just the pure levee, volcanic soil, more or less, irony. And then there is a a small quantity of, soil, which are like marna, clay, arenaria. And clay. Yeah. Mhmm. And arenaria, I don't know which is, sandstone. Okay. So that gave a very beautiful, possibility of, have a different Aljanico in a very small area. Everything is in the council of Barile, twenty five actor, and I would say probably at least fifteen big difference between them. When you say a fifteen days difference of right now? No. No. No. Different in taste. You you can have it on the table and you would say it's you wouldn't say it's one wine. You can actually say they're all very different between themselves. So what are the different just go through the wines, the three red wines, and just go through how you ferment them. Do you ferment them differently? And then if you do what the main flavors are as an ageability and shape of these wines is. The vinification is per vineyard. So that we would the the all winery is in caves. So the container. I use it quite small, normally fifty hectoliters. So every vineyard is one or more of this, vats. So fifty eight liters is about six thousand bottles worth for that. And, so every vineyard has a different, VINification system, but just basically because I started, when I started, like, almost eight years ago, I started just to work with, a torch on my forehead and to see what was going on where I do the pipe pump up in there. Because you're in a cave, right? Yeah. Yeah. So I just found out that there is one vineyard that needs less time of this pump pump over. Do you call it? Something over? Yeah. And, some other one, which need longer time before to to move up the the head of, skins. So the unification is really tailored on my observation. Averagely, the the wine stay the wine stays with the skins, like, between twenty two, twenty four to maximum thirty two days. And, again, after that, the second part of the work is in wood, and, also depending on what is the characteristic of the vineyard, the ability of the support. The potential. Yeah. Yeah. The way that we're gonna work with the border, the it changes a lot. Like, to give you an example, out of the two crews, the main cruise. The fifteen years old has a two percent on your wood, who is the thirty years old, I did it. The in two thousand and thirteen, and never again, because it's been, the wood has been overwhelming on the on the on the characteristic of the vineyard. What about, food matching, what what does Alianiko from the Volterre Mhmm. Go well with. Alianiko has, has two main character is three way, actually. The the two, like, I would say the the notes. He goes first of all, famous for our tenants and CD and then depending on, how do you work with it, it can be more and less or less, powerful. But basically it works very well with all the food, which are very greasy because Very fatty. Because of the excitity. And also really work very well with normally tangentially, culturally, the the user to grill meats, or aged cheese, or very rich sauce for, for pasta. Okay. It's mostly that is a So what about, age ability Alianico. Hey, that's just a nice story because of the we don't have actually much of, history about it. So the potential is huge, but we don't know actually how long it can last because we don't have a a deep culture of good winemaking since a long time. So, like, I I would say that what we taste now has a easily twenty, twenty five years of history. But I've been trying a janikou, not from our area because we didn't have the story yet, but from the late fifties, which are amazing. So it's just a matter of build up this new story. Okay. So one question is people think, obviously, you're in the far south of Italy, not that far from North Africa, effectively, Pacific Carter. So moving right, you're gonna be picking these, you wanna, you wanna volcano, pretty dry soil, not much organic matter. You're gonna be picking these allianica grapes in August. Right? No way. No. Obviously, allianica is very, like, late ripening, and plus we are six twenty meters above sea level. So we normally start harvest between the ten and fifteen of October, and we end by by the end of October, beginning of November. So this is one of the last wines to be picked in Italy apart from, say, sweet wines like, yeah, with with Petritis We normally do quite a competition with friends from Valtellina. Oh, Valentina is a sort of alpine, wine grapes. It's amazing that you've got at one end of Italy, you got the Alps, you know, go skiing. And, actually, you have a lot of snow around pretense as well. You have snow in, in winter. It's one of the coldest areas, in Italy, even though it is one of the closest regions to Africa. It's amazing you've got that that, so how easy is it to find pickers that are willing to go out and pick? Yes. By hand, you mentioned the pruning system that you have, which we're will investigate. But that has to be hand picked. So is there a ready supply of people that wanna go and climb up a a volcano in the middle of, late October early November to go and pick Aleonica grapes? Unfortunately, yes. Because, yeah, in basilicata is quite a poor region, and a lot of people need work, and they are locals. They we don't need to have a immigration for work because, people doesn't find a work. Yes. Probably it's the second or third poorest region economically. I see. So, yeah. So just tell me a little bit. You mentioned some of the older vines. A lot of the vines are ungrub because you're on this volcanic soil. And you mentioned a particular way of training the grapes to individual canes. Just what was that? What was that called? And how does it work? It's called a a capano. A capano. And it's the traditional way, and they are a can just put on a cane. And, actually, the old vineyards, they all have, a small, the lower part, near the the water, which, like, I don't know, sorry, fossil. The, drainage stitches or streams. Yeah. And, they they have these canes that grows spontaneously, and they are part of the heritage with Venus. It's kinda like a bamboo. It's, I don't know if it's, but it's, a reed, a strong reed that you can then cut, rush that you can cut, and then you could use it when it dries, it it makes a strong cane. And you're using that to support the device. And they are using in a, like, a tripod shape to sustain the the vines, and actually is that is the very, very old, style of Viticulture. That's why the region is called also Inotria because ofenos and trios, which were the the canes, and the idea is that the the divines are basically made to grow wild, not to be tamed by the humans. So, actually, what's happening in that kind of culture is that they can express their energy if they have or don if they don't, but they are not sort of under constriction in, in growing. And for a very old vineyard, it's very important because it can, just really steam out what is idle. I wouldn't know how to express, but it's like, what is, too much expressed by the leaves and the branches, and there is a lot of space to do it because it's like a a bush, basically. So what you're saying is the vine can really express itself in the way that it wants. So it just gets a bit of support from these canes, but it's not growing in a, like a hedge, like a straight road. And they are not tree. Yeah. They're not trimmed. They're not blocked in the in the way they want to grow. They just grow up, like, all the plants if they can. They just grow up into the, sky woods. Yeah. And, and that's just the nature there. So they are more happy. What about picking? And that must be, you know, if if they grow a little bit hickledy, bigger, you must slow picking down, but you're saying that you're actually getting better quality fruit? Yes, sir. But like, like, all the others, actually, what's happened is that, the fruit you wanna pick is the one more close to the, to the soil. To the vine itself. Yeah. So, basically, you always have still they are hanging like socks around, like, like, in the in a normal vineyard. So it's very easy to do the picking, and we don't pick what is on top, what is called the feminella. So that's the, on secondary shoots. Yeah. Because they they are less full of polyphenoliant taste. They're more acidic and more diluted, so they use less to make a good wine. So the vine's being clever. It's it knows that the warmth because it's getting some reflected heat from the sunless trice. Also, the the lower grapes are the ones that's what it's trying to do is make babies. Right? Make it. It's seeds. Yeah. They should. So that those bunches will have the will have the sugar and, the ripeness to attract birds traditionally. That's what we And they actually also have the protection of the the the leaves. They get some shade. Yeah. So do you are they easier to ferment these these ones from the Very easy. Yeah. Yeah. Well, they they do have a, like, a stress moment when they are around three bubble in sugar, let's say, like, almost at the end of the fermentation because they there is a lot of sugar and of alcohol. So sometime the east can be, stressed. Stressed by the alcohol presence, but the the start, the beginning of the fermentation is very immediate, and, also the process is a quite faster. So the only fragile moment is when there is too much alcohol already. Do you try and slow the fermentation down initially when it gets a bit too fast? I do. Yeah. I do. We'll use the temperature control. Yeah. Do you use any nutrients? I do, but I use yeast. Yeah. Okay. So it's like a neutral Easter, but I don't need to do any nutrition despite the fact that the volcanic soils are very poor in nitrogen. So that is another factor of stress for the fermentation. So why is nitrogen important to have in a fermentation? Because it's what you'd like to eat. Right. It's food for them. It's their breakfast lunch and dinner. Right? Exactly. Yeah. Okay. What about the main markets for the for the wine? Does it mainly sold in Italy, the allianaca? Is it sold in export markets. I know that, like, if you talk about Alyanico in general, mostly, I what I can hear in in the area is that the the majority of producers sell more at the abroad that in Italy. For me, the market is fifty fifty. And, what is abroad is more Swiss Germany in, states. Okay. Cool. I just wanna say thanks to my guest today, Viviana Malafarina. Thank you. Tending us about basilisko. Thanks. Basilisco and basilicata on the Volterre, the Vulture, the volcanic mountain, where Al Janigore finds its favorite home. Yes, it is. Yeah. Thanks. Thank you very much. Thanks. Follow Italian wine podcast on Facebook and Instagram.