Ep. 11 Monty Waldin interviews Lamberto Frescobaldi of the Frescobaldi Wineries | Discover Italian Regions: Tuscany / Toscana

Italian wine podcast. Chinching with Italian wine people. Hello. My name is Jonti Walden. I'm with Lambert Frescobaldi, one of the themo from one of the most famous families in Italy. How far does your wine making family go back to? Oh my god. It goes back to thirteen hundred. The story of my family begins around the year one thousand, and then in in the eleven hundred. They bought, the land where our home is in Florence and, became traders, bankers, and then they started to buy land in the thirteen hundred and started to produce And, initially, it was, south of Florence in the area of called Valipiza. So really rolling hills. And, and then over over time, being, they've been to Bordeaux and to England, and then back in Italy. So it's we have an amazing archivina family with letters, for example, every date, wrote a letter ordering wines to the to the first casualties. And then So you're basically responsible. Your wine was responsible for us to grow up with the reformation when Henry Henry the eighth left the church of the Catholic church. It's called to enter your wine. I guess so. Too much fun with, with his So tell me, well, I mean, one of your famous estates is Castelludini Potsano. Tell us a little bit about that. Cassello Potsano is, it's very unique, and especially for me because every estate we own, they have something unique. I grew up there. So, I have to remember the first, time there was, stealing bikes and motorbikes from workers and driving around in Pocano. We are East of Florence. Only twenty miles east of Florence. In a fairly hilly area, it's as to be quite hilly. And, the home where I I grew up and lived, we had the cellar. So, I remember crashing time, and then, going in the cellar and and tasting the wine and and unfortunately, getting to know quite early. I was, I think, I was six years old. I understood that wine had to be drank in moderation because I remember they came in and picked a a friend of mine and myself, we were totally trashed. At the age of six? At the age of six. So hang on. You were you you you were drinking illegally. You were you were stealing bikes. I mean, how did you end up in jail? Oh, almost almost. But, I drank because, you know, don't do that in in in the month of June, when there was the wheat, harvest. It was always a big feast because wheat means bread. And, and so this was this big event, and the workers, they always had a big lunch. And I remember I remember. I can't remember, but I was told going there. And with, with these people, they gave me they gave me to me and my friend, wine. And then the manager came and and found me and my friend that we were almost knocked, knocked off. By all this wine and and they went up to these people and said, why the hell you gave wine to these kids? And this is the guy that looked at him and said, I couldn't give water to the son of my boss. So that was the beginning. That's a great line. That's a great excuse, but it's a great line. What about, I mean, what about animals there? Did you do you have any animals? It was a very poly cultural? Of course, we had we had horses. We had cows. I remember going and and the evening, collecting in the fresh, fresh milk. It was a little bit like living in medieval times. These these homes were they really had, you know, we had, congee, rabbits, we had dogs and cats, and and it was quite special, I must say, do you miss that a little bit of this kind of like this kind of preet technology era? You know, like you probably had a bath. You probably had a bath in a tin a tin bath. You're on the floor. Is that right? He's by the fire. Was that right? Exactly. Definitely. But I think that when you have a good time, you always miss what is in the past, especially because you always remember the good things and, but I also remember that my home in the winter, it was damn cold. But we we actually survived, very nicely and And, those things, they actually the things that they you you grew up with them, you you you changed with them, and you actually become even more respectful of what you have these days. So you went off to, to study wine. And where did you go? Did you study in Italy? Or When I was in, in high school, I knew I already knew I wanted to study agriculture because I had the idea of, the weld that, you actually don't only produce wine, but you also have olive trees, and you have wheat, and you have, a real farm, a mixed farm. Yeah. And, I remember going, and joining the Cultural University of Florence. And, that was in the mid eighties. At that time, there was not really a wine program. There was a grape transformation class that was not even a a real exam. When you say Grove Charles, you mean basically crushing the grapes and converting them into wine. Exactly. Okay. So I think that we were in the cradle. We are in Florence in the cradle of of Canty, and in mid eighties, there was already a new analogies analogical school. So at that point, you know, my father gave me this opportunity to go to California, very far away, from Florence, a different world. My English was, okay, not terrific, but okay. And, it's something that really changed, my, my whole perspective. I started to see the world of wine because when you are raised in a wine family, often you only see what you produce. Instead, when you step out, you actually see a lot of, the, the, the people that they're producing something that is actually very good. And actually, sometimes you actually like it more than what you were producing. And then I had another great opportunity. When I was in Davis, I looked for in June, it's my birthday. I was looking for San Francisco Baldi wine, so I I started to search them, and I bumped him into a gentleman called Darrecorti. And that he had an amazing shop in Sacramento. And I went up to him in the cellar of this big shop. I saw cases and cases of Frisco Baldi. So, I was twenty three years old or twenty two, something like that. And I went up to him, and I said, oh, I a lot of Fiscobaldi wine. Why do you have so many cases of you? And he looks at me and says, do you think it's easy to sell that wine? And I said, oh my god, I don't know. Hello, I'm, mister Fiscobaldi, and we started chatting. And after he said, would you like to work for me? And, I said, look, I'm studying. Yeah. Okay. I'm I'm I'm happy enough to have you on Saturday. So I started working on Saturday from morning from nine AM to nine PM. And also Darro gave me, with us together with all the staff. Gave me the opportunity, it was every Thursday evening to taste when the shop was closing. I was driving from Davis there, and he gave me the opportunity to taste amazing things. He looked at me and said, have you ever tasted a Chateau? I don't think I had no idea Chateau, when you are twenty? You know, you don't have the budget and you have the idea. He was opening these bottles for me and the staff for me, for the staff, and also myself, I was there. And I started to taste wine from France, from South America. I remember from Georgia, Russia, from Spain, from various places of Italy. And I said, my god, how many good things are around the world? Now I'm starting to understand why there is such a great excitement with wine because wine, when it's, is a good wine, is able to tell you the story from where it comes from. And that's all about, I think wine. And, and, of course, it's like, it's lovely to be up there, to be the number one wine of the world. But there are, I think, a number of number one wines of the world because all of those wines that they are able to capture the spirit of the soil, of the place of the people, and put them in a glass, those, all of them are number ones. Funny, when you talk about spiritual disorder, when you are now or you are the largest castor giocondo or castor giocondo estate in Montecino is the largest organic estate in Montecino. I mean, how many hectares have you got there? Now, in Vineyard, we are over two seventy four to be precise. Right. So that's about, in acres, that's about six hundred acres. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Seven six now seven hundred, almost seven the spirit of the sword. I mean, do you think there is a a trend now to be much more attentive about, about the farming side of one? We we began the the organic, path in two thousand and six. I remember we started with five actors. So ten acres. And then after a couple of years, we we went up to forty acres, then one hundred acres, then, and then at the moment, we decided to go the whole estate. The reason was that the wines that we were able to produce, it felt it had a little bit something something beyond, something extra, not extra layer of power, not extra layer of of muscles, but the complex city. And also a little bit more, respectful of the vintage. When you go up to to your wine lovers that they spend, a certain amount of money for your bottle, you have to make them really part of your effort and see the differences that there is from one vintage to another. And said this, every vintage has to be good. If not, you have to be strong enough to not to bottle the wine. But when you go to the wine, that you have to really perceive the nuances. There's really the differences that they are. There is from one vintage to another. And this, it's not a weakness. Is actually a strength. And this makes it so more amusing and so more interesting to your, love consumers. So when did you first get I mean, you obviously grew up in Nepal Putsano. When did you first arrive at Castel Gio Conte? I was nineteen seventy four. I was, eleven years old. To be very honest, I used to go there with my father. For another reason, rather than Venus, the place was, was was large. And the the manager there had a Volkswagen the beetle. I remember it was a beetle, a one point three liter, a white ish Like herbie, basically. Yeah. Herbie. And, and so I was, grabbing this car and driving all day long and having a great time. Actually, my my first car ever I it was a beetle. I started to It was a friend of mine that, few months before with his grandfather in Ontario, Canada told me how to drive car, and again, it was a beetle. So you're only thirteen when you learn how to drive. Learned, you learned to drink at the age of six. You learned to drive at the age of, eleven. Yes. Mikhail. And Oscar's an obvious next question, which we're really not gonna go into here folks. So what was Castoggio condo like at that time of them? Now we said it's it's beautifully restored and it's sort of pristine. What was it like then? I was in the middle of nowhere. When in in that time my father started to to do all the renovation and and transform land into Vineyard, there was not really a place where to stay. So the the tractor drivers that needed a place. All the houses were totally ruined. So he went to a to a, how do you say, and he bought a trailer, and he transformed that trailer, half in house, and the other house for, do the maintenance of the tractors. And that trailer, we yet have it. We keep it in Pompino. And that was the house of those people. Initially, we had, tractor drivers from Florence, but then after a few weeks, they went up to my father and they said, you know, Mr. Fracobaldi, payment is good, but unfortunately, we feel unsafe. We're scared. We're in the middle of nowhere, and we don't want to work here any longer. So you have to go and hire people from Emilia Romania. He took these people from Emilia Romania, and to keep on going there. So Castedrico in nineteen seventy four up to nineteen eighty, he was in the middle of nowhere. You felt uncomfortable at night. You felt really, really felt that until it was abandoned territory? Yes, indeed. And wasn't one of the reasons why when they were discussing building a main road from the north to the south. It could have gone via Montecian, which would have brought obviously lots of traffic, but also lots of changes were jobs, but they built it along the coast in this. That's why it's remained incredibly isolated. They remained incredibly isolated. And then things happened. Thanks to also people like Mr. Beyond DeSanti. And, but I remember in the 70s, we were something like eighteen wineries. Now the two fifty? Yeah. Two hundred. Yeah. But, I mean, when you say it was unsafe, you do know how to shoot a rifle, tell me about how you learned to do that. But that was, After my studies, I flew back to Italy. My my grandmother was a real boss, and she she said to me and to her nephews, guys, when you get at the right age, you have to join the army because every good Italian has to work for his country, voice country, and and do the service and give back to your country. And, so I, I did the the request to join the Caribbeani, the Caribbeani in Italy's the military police, And I did all the I was happily accepted for the fact that I spoke to English and some French, and I was stationed in the international airport of Fiumicino together with with other Caribbeani. We it was the group was eighteen people. We had to do anti terrorism against terrorism. I remember we were doing special service for Elal TWA in Panam, and it was an amazing experience. They had the airport because we had to be careful. Alal especially was a target those days, and my guess also now. So those fifteen months, they really flew away very quickly. I was very tempted to remain in the army. Do you think your dad would have been disappointed? Absolutely. My girlfriend, She actually went up to my father, and she said, look, Lamberto, he's thinking of, of joining the army. And, so my father said, you know, after all those studies, you did, we'd like you to come over and, and look at the veneas, we had we need to do a renovation and, and I said, Yeah. That, you know, but, you know, I'm I'm I'm happy with what I'm doing. And and actually, to be very honest, also, I'm I'm paying very well. And joining family business. And so he said, look, I can't give you a good wage per month because a family business, family business is something where he can never be generous, but I'm gonna give it out from my pocket a little bit more. And, that was this what I was the deal. And, and I'm very thankful to him because then, had the opportunity to renovate the vignettes of Frisco Baldin. You know, when you're in the army and, and you have, to be carabinelli, you were very powerful those days. Right. Because of the political situation, the time is very dangerous, wasn't It was dangerous, but at the same time, you he was somebody already. It was a good feeling. You are twenty I was twenty four years old and but then I had this great opportunity, initially with that. And then what really like, for me winning a lottery was, the joint venture with, the Mondavies. That was nineteen seventy five, conveying the joint venture, with the Vignas in Montalcino, with Tim Mondavi, So I was the county, county part of of the Friscoobal, the in Italy, and so dealing with with Tim and really, they really, that changed the, the whole perspective. And also gave me the opportunity to become a little bit more known in my family. And so after, at the end of the, of the 90s, the supervisor that was in charge of Friscobaldi, of the production Friscobaldi retired. And so they, yeah, well, I was appointed to that. And, so thanks to, again, to my English, to the the Mondavies, and to the quality that lucha delivered, I was then appointed to Fiscobal. Then Fiscobal was a little bit more of a task and to change it around. I'm still working on it. I mean, the fact that you'd worked in America gives you enormous credibility, doesn't it? And the fact you've gone there, lived there, studied there, dealt with the culture and accepted the culture, and they've accepted you. I mean, that was quite rare at the time because I think Italy sometimes accused of or was in those days of being a little bit inward looking. Absolutely. You know, also economically Italy was was always very, quite, I would say, successful on exporting, but because we were, every now and then, we had inflation. And so the leader I was very weak. And so we were, we could export very efficiently. But to send kids abroad was actually very expensive. And I must say I have to thank again to my parents, my father, and my mother that they were able to to send me abroad. I mean, I've just worked out. You are, you're, you are an analogist your army police experience. You were a lieutenant. And you're also a Marququist on you? I didn't do anything special to be very honest, Monty. But when you get there, you have to I think the most important thing is to, work hard every day to have a healthy company, to have a good amount of employees, hopefully to make them to be responsible and happy of what they're doing. Then you have to be responsible also for them and for their family. Think that this is, the most important thing. What what's your next challenge? The next challenge, it's, it's, it's always around the corner. I think that, over the last few years, one great challenge for me, was to do the wine in a in a jail, in an island off the coast of Tuscany. It's a small, jail island and to have these people work. The project is called Gorgona, it's the name of the island. So it's a prison on the island of Gorgona. Yeah. It's a prison on the island of Gorgona since in two thousand twelve, been working there. And, last year, planted an extra, acre and a half of vineyard, and overrode now, they're almost four acres. So it's a tiny project, but the white wine we produced there, its MSA is It's very special. It's very unique. What's the great variety? The grape varieties are too. It's ansonica that is planted from Sicily up to the coast of Tuscany and Vermentino. The seller is there. It's in the island. And the inmates are are so responsible of this project. They, we've hired them, they get a wage. I think it's, it's giving them an opportunity to learn something, but to even more than learn something to be, again, passion about work. Because to work, when you start working for a number of years, then you don't have, it's quite difficult to start again. And that's a an opportunity. These people that are working there, we are giving them an opportunity for the future and to go on someplace else and work are also for us. When you go there, I mean, obviously, you, obviously, you don't call yourself a market, but obviously, you're, I mean, we're very well educated, very well traveled man. Do they do they respect you for what you're doing just on a human level, or do they still kind of maybe slightly suspect you that, you know, well, he's a, he's, Arris decrat. What do they just accept you as one of them? Well, look, I I tell you a story. When I went there, it was the first time was, August the third two thousand twelve. I started going there pretty off to get there, you have to go with the bull police, leaves at nine eight o'clock in the morning sharp from Livorno. Now we're in twenty minutes to go there, and I was going in and out, in and out, almost once every twenty days. And once, in May, there were day inmates, A couple of them came up to me and they looked at me and they said, but are you mister Fris Cobaldi? And I said, oh yeah, I guess so. Somebody said that, you know, yes. And because I never said to them, hello, I'm listening to myself. It was hello, and that was it. And so they looked at me and said, we thought it was much an older person than you. And I said, you know, it will happen. Don't worry. It will happen one day. I'm gonna get there. And so they, I was never stompish about it, or that's a quite a very wrong approach with life. And they they felt that that was part of them. And, almost what was last two years ago. I presented the wine in, was June twenty seven. It's my birthday, and I decided to go there present that. I took my family, my my wife, my kids, and, also the director of the of the jail, mister Marzierbo. His birthday was also June twenty seven. We know we opened a few bottles of Gorgona, and we shared them with all the inmates. We we said, you know, very soon, some of you are gonna be out. You have to you have to go on and and do what it has to be done right. There is so much satisfaction in life when you're able to put your your foot in the right direction. And sometimes it's difficult, but the difficult things to give you much more satisfaction than the easy way. And, Paul, it's absolutely fantastic talking to you very, very interesting on many, many levels And, I hope we can have another conversation at some stage in the future. Thank you very much. I look forward to having you in Mipotsano or Pumino or all the other beautiful states. Thanks, Lambelle. You can share me how to milk cows. Absolutely. Okay. Thanks very much. 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