Ep. 128 Monty Waldin interviews Peter Heilbron (Tenuta Bellafonte) | Discover Italian Regions: Umbria

Italian wine podcast. Chinching with Italian wine people. Hello. This is the Italian wine podcast. My name is Monte Wardin. My guest today is Peter Halbron. Peter's winery is called Tenuta Belafonte, and it's in the Montefalco region of Umbria in Central Italy. Welcome Peter, Thank you. I'll come, to you. Obvious question. Hyelbron is the name of a town in Germany. Are you from Germany? Well, this is a good question because, my family has German region. They do not belong from the city of Hybron. But, from another city that is called Falsheim. But, I grew up in, in Italy, not in umbria, but in North and Italy, Milano. Okay. How did you end up in Umbria with a winery? Well, after a long career in the food and beverage, in the street. I decided to set up my own business. I was, a wine lover, but, at a certain point, I decided to jump on the other side of the glass and to start producing wine. The reason why I choose Uzumbria I knew, I knew Seguarantino, and I strongly believed that, we could do something more elegant, refine out of this fantastic grape. So when you said you had experience of Seguarantino before, but just on business trips, you would order a bottle of Seguarantino, how how how did you get to know the wine before you became a wine grower here? I've been working in Homeripe, because it wasn't the chocolate business, and I've been in charge of Pegugina. You probably know the Bachi. And It's a very famous, brand of, chocolate. And for that reason, I lived in Numbre for a couple of, years and being a good wine drinker. I had the occasion to drink, some or more bottle of segment dinner. So when you were doing that, drinking the wines, would are the wines start? Were they modernist then, or were they very traditional, very, very dry, very tough? What I point out, compared with my, my preferred wine. I don't say an absolute term, but for my taste, I find them too traditional to, concentrated far from what they really, for the kind of wine that they really love. So a little bit heavy, a bit over extracted. Too heavy to to over extracted. That's a bit too much food, too much everything. So when you came here, what, how did you choose the vineyard you ended buying. I had the occasion to visit different areas here in the in the in the region, and it ended up that I find a quite isolated place with some vineyards in place, in the hill with very good, exposition and everything. And this was a starting point, but from this, the start, then we develop other vineyards and we would build up our winery completely on the soil and, at a very low energy consumption that could self sustain from an energetic point of view with all these kind of things that I believe were important. Were you one of the first to do that in this region, energy efficient winery? Probably not, one of the first, for sure, one of the first that, make all the winery out of this, concept in terms of, efficiency and self, sustained energy, winery. Are you getting any geothermal energy on orders of just underground gravity? No. Thermic here is not a good choice because, you don't have water. You just have, very thick soil, so it doesn't work very well. So we choose biomass heaters. So we burn, the the part of the wood that we produce. And, solar energy. We are in center, Iitari. So sun is quite good that we have many days of sun. So with those two power supplier, we build up our winery and, the fact that, all the production areas and the soil means also that we need very little energy coming from the outside. First air conditioning and cooling and We don't have air conditioning because the the winery is under soil and has a continuous exchange with external soil because, there is no separation. So it's ready to the winery and there is, the the climate is is done naturally so we don't need any air conditioning. Have other people copied you here then having seen your success with your winery in terms of energy efficiency? Because there has been a bit of a boom here with people coming into the region and taking over vineyards and maybe not always having their own winery. Probably the more recent, yes, what is interesting is, and I don't know if it's only due to my activity and my choices, but, it's that all the segmentinos, most of the segmentino are moving to a more, let's say, modern style and, and this is important to make this wine a little more popular on the word. So when you say modern style, you mean starting of the wine? I mean, the wine. Yes. Yeah. So what do you mean by that? I mean that moving from, over extracted, very pretty additional wine to something that is more, more approachable with more, parfums, a better balance of, acidity. The ten is better handled. We do that in a very simple way because we, we just, use our grapes and, and no other help. Let's say that. We ferment entire berries so we don't press the berries. It's a whole whole berries. All berries. Yes. So we don't press it. So we don't distract from the seats that contain a lot of green tennis. We don't extract mechanically from the skin. We have a carbonic maceration. And It's a beaujolais style. You could say whole but whole very fermentation, intracellular fermentation. And, then we use only large cask for a period that is a year longer than what is the minimum required by the consortium because in large cask, you need more time. But at the end, you have a wine that has less, tannins from the wood and just, apart from, from the grapes. So when you say large wood, are you talking about, large oak vats? Or large barrels, body, five hundred liters. A large, oak vats. We are talking about, fifty hectoliters vats. So there's six thousand bottles worth. Six thousand bottle. Exactly. So they are very larger. By they are very, very good for the kind of wine that, we, we look for. It's quite burgundy and quite like bowing it with whole berries and minimizing. I think it's essentially what you're saying about minimizing extraction from the pips because that seems to be a bit of a no brainer for me, and I'm priced, I haven't heard more people talking about that. And then with the larger oak, there's no real risk that you're gonna make the wine that's too oaky. There's less risk of oxidation losing the fruit. You've got a real logic, a real plan, to what you've been doing. Right? Let's right. I've been planning it for many years, drinking a lot of different bottles, making my own idea, visiting different wineries. So when I came here, I had all the projects in my mind. So I had a very little help from, professional and so on. I had my idea of winery how he wanted it. Isn't that often the best thing that you've somebody has their rather than relying on a consultant that somebody has their own plan? Otherwise, everything just becomes derivative, doesn't it? It's the same That's that's exactly the problem. Today, I think that there are a lot of good wines, but what is important from my point of view is to to have some wines that express a specific personality. And this may come only from, the mind of a single person, then it's right or wrong. This has to be judged from, people that buy the bottles. But I also didn't visit many winery here in the area because I just don't want it to be too much influence by that. I want to follow my plan I had the help of an anologist because, even if I have an agriculture degree and I studied a lot, I couldn't know everything. So I have a good friend that is bepecadiola, that is a good technologist from Pimonte, that, follow me in this, project and help me in, in, setting it in the right way. Making, reducing the mistakes. Interesting that you're talking about Pierre Monte, because you think about Nebula, which is can be an ethereal wine, and it can be the toughest, hardest most bitter red wine that you can possibly find on the planet virtually. And with Sacramento, it's a very tenant, great variety. So it's interesting that you've got that sort of influence from Piamonte to try and soften and brighten if you'd like, the the Sacramento. Yes. Piamonte has a very long experience in handling a very botanic, grape. As you said, also handling a nebulae is very difficult, but they are able. They have they has been able to make, fantastic wine, a very elegant, and very refined. So I thought that was, from there that, we had to pick the, the right points to set my business in Columbia right. What makes you happiest? Are you happiest when you're in the winery and in the vineyard or you're happiest doing what your previous career was selling. The answer is easy selling. I like very much being in, in my winery and in the vineyards, but I also find very interesting and very pleasant to be with the people that then, drink the wine, has to sell it because it give me a lot of feedback on how the wine is, and how the is a perception. And, it's very nice to talk about something that you just don't have to say, but, that is part of yourself. What's the nicest thing? If you're outselling and somebody tastes your wine for the first time, is it? Oh, that's what's the nicest thing they can say? Two things first, is different from my idea of Sanarantino and say second, I like the the perfume because for me, the nose is one of the most important part of the drinking wine. So what aromas do we normally get from Second and Tina? A lot of fruit, a lot of, nice, and richness. Sometimes you have also some herbs. And, if you get used to to to drink and to, and to taste the Sacramento, you will find, most of, other grapes, less rich and less interesting than Sacramento. So it's, very, very nice grapes. Traditionally, if we think of a traditional segmentino saying, oh, it's not the old fashioned one, a little bit tannic, obviously a lot of fruit as well. The perception is you do have a big steak with that. What wines with a wine from your winery? What are we gonna what what would we have with that? Would we have a little piece of lettuce? Or something like that because they're so delicate, or would we actually have a proper piece of food? No. Is is it is it still a Sacramento, but, I may say that you don't have to, to, heavy meat, to, have pleasure drinking my wine. You mo you also may have a nice pasta with her or lasagna because it it has enough acidity to support also tomato based, dishes. And the cheese as well. Cheese for sure. Okay. So let's go through some of your wines. Let's start with the white ones first. You make a wine called Arneto, which is a Yes. Trebiano Sporitino. Is that right? That's right. By the way, we make only two wines, a red and a white us. So That's easy. That's easy. Alright. We got him. Ernesto is as polite, you know. Trebiano is a misleading word because it's a family that is not a family that put together grapes that has nothing to do one with the other. Do you think they'll change the name? Has it been changed or is it be called Spolatino. It makes life a lot easier. I would I would, I would fight for that. It's not easy because there is a lot of rules for changing, the name of a grape, but honestly, it would be much more clear. Trebiano was the generic name for the white wine of the country So it put together grapes that has nothing to do one with the other. Our umbrin, is a fantastic grape with a great, potential in term of flavors in terms of longevity is is really fantastic. And that's the reason why I decided to make a white wine that was not in my initial plan. Anita means in the local dialect reborn, and the reason of this name is that fifteen years ago, this variety was nearly disappeared. Only few plants left. And then due to some producer, it come back and today we are rediscovering this, this variety. To that just made in stainless steel? No. It's made only in my large cask, fifty hectoliters. How did I guess? And, so the the the the wood is just a a container. The actual It's not the adding adding match. It's just a way to ferment it naturally in the in the wood to have malolactic done because we do not filter our wines at all. So malolactic is, is done. And then we leave on the lisa for another free four months before they can't think it and bottling it. How does the taste of the Arneto, the spolatino wine change over time? When it's just bottled, how does it taste, the textures of flavor, and after say five or six or seven years? Well, the this just bottled neither at the starting four or five months before having it ready for drinking. And, is a good balance of persistency of, freshness and some fresh flavors. And after some years, you have an evolution that moves to some more minerality and, very interesting and very refined taste. Flav fruit, white fruit. Yes. Okay. You like me. You're not great on giving fruits to to names too. I'm terrible at that. People say, oh, that's right. That's why I'm is, is, what I like in in our methods that you have a very easy and creamy starting. That's savory. And then it open up at a very, with a lot of persistency and very nice and rich flavors. So it's, it's a complete wine and what we try we try to avoid is to have a heavy white because I think that white in any case has to maintain a certain interesting lightness even if you want to have a real white. See that your honor just sounds like a wine where you have a glass or half a glass of it. It's like a meal in itself. Actually need any food with that. Oh, the food is always very good. Here with white meat, with, light cheese, is with, cooked, fish is very good. Now tell me about your multifalco, Sanrentino, is called Colenoto. Yes. Colenoto is the name of the hill where we are. And, due to the fact that the the vineyards are around the winery, the, the name make a lot of, sense because it represent where we are is a seventeen or hundred percent. And, as we were talking before, is done with a very simple procedures hand picked. This time, but, not pressed. Spontaneous fermentation with the the east of our grape. And after that, we just decant it. And, for a couple of months, and then we put in the large cask at least for three years before bottling it without filtering. So that's it with other without any addition or filtering or whatever may alterate the the essence of the wine and the vitality of the wine. So when you started your winery and you had to get staff to work in the vineyard and in the winery, did you choose young people that had no preconception because you have some quite different ideas to the norm, or did you hire old, wizard, bearded men? I am. I'm stuck in them, stuck in the fifties. I take your point. I take young people without any precision on on, how things has to be done. And, I've been working now a little less because I'm moving a little more on the commercial side. But at the beginning, I was really involved in every single step in the winery. Today, I have, Luca that is a fantastic, guy. Young that had me and know perfectly how things has to be done and how we decide to do that. So I may trust a lot. What what are your most important export markets? We have, let's say, two biggest in export market. One is United States, and the other is Swiss both like, our wines, the red and also the the white. That is more recent. So it's still in development because it's only free us that we're producing. A young guy like you, what does the future hold? Any more any more developments can we see in your winery? Well, every year, we tend to make some trials, something different trying to improve because even if our wine has a very good rating and get very good reviews, your have to think to improve. What is sure even if I don't have, a new wine in, in, in portfolio is that it would be a a wine with, a reason to exist. So it must have a project behind and not just to make a range of products. Do you think you'd you'd plant another native grape variety? You wouldn't plant an international one, though, would you? No. For sure there will be no international variety in, in our plants. It will be, other native, IT like San Jose or other. You got you got to write to you haven't you already. You got to find other words. White. No. I don't like very much, but it's my my point. So for the white, I think that, Spolitino is, the based on the red, there are some interesting local grapes, that, may give interesting wines. Great. Okay. Alright. We'll have to get you back when you planted them. Sure. I would be. So I say thanks very much Peter Harbron coming in today talking about denude belafonte. It's always good to talk to someone that has got a winery, but had a real plan before doing anything. And it makes such a difference. I think it takes makes a difference environmentally. It makes a difference economically a difference in terms of wine quality. It probably makes a difference to to your blood pressure as well. Absolutely. And quality of life. And Yeah. And you can and it's also easier for the staff when you go away. It's like you've created a system. It's really easy to work in. Yes. For sure. You want me if you wanna harm me as PR guy. I'm I'm great. Good. I am waiting for you. Thank you very much. It's been a real pleasure to meet you, and I look forward to coming and seeing your winery. A meeting Sabrina, who is your your wife. Good. Thank you very much. We're waiting for you. Very fine. Thanks for coming in. And everybody that would like to come to visit our winery. It looks beautiful on the on the little dip beyond that you've given me. Good. Very smart. I also see the solar panels. A nice landscape around. So it's it's very nice. And we tasted the wine from, from the barrel, and it's very interesting. I mean, to come and visit us. Love to try some of the wine from, from wooden fat, actually, to see how the whole, you know, the fact that you're not extracting anything from the pits. No. And also the fact that we don't make any blend or whatever, this is exactly the wine that a couple of years later you will have in the bottle. So it's interesting to see evolution of the wine in the cast. Yeah. CG, when you do vertical tastings as well, because everything is the same. This is always the same grape, one grape in this one, one grape in the red wine, one grape in the wine, one. Really easy and easy to see. Exactly. I just wanna say thanks very much to my guest today. Peter Harbron of Tinouta Verafonte in Montevanko. Thank you to you. Follow Italian wine podcast on Facebook and Instagram.