Ep. 869 Gabriella Di Clemente | Get US Market Ready With Italian Wine People

This episode is brought to you by the Italy International Academy, the toughest Italian wine program. One thousand candidates have produced two hundred and sixty two Italian wine ambassadors to date. Next courses in Hong Kong Russia, New York, and Verona. Think you make the cut. Apply now at vin Italy international dot com. Thanks for tuning into my new show. Get US market ready with Italian wine people. I'm Steve Ray, author of the book how to get US market ready. And in my previous podcast, I shared some of the lessons I've learned from thirty years in the wine and spirits business helping brands enter and grow in the US market. This series will be dedicated to the personalities who have been working in the Italian wine sector in the US. Their experiences, challenges, and personal stories. I'll uncover the roads that they walked shedding light on current trends, business strategies, and their unique brands. So thanks for listening in, and let's get to the interview. Hi, and welcome to this week's edition of Italian wine podcast, Get US Market Ready with Italian wine people. I'm Steve Ray, and my guest this week is Gabriela Di Clemente. Gabriela, welcome to the show. Hi, Steve. Thank you so much for having me. Nice to reconnect again. Yeah. So for our listeners, I've known Gabriela in a couple of, manifestations, but I'll let her tell her short biography and, and, and then we'll continue the interview. Great. Yes. So thank you so much. I, let's say, in these past six years since I moved to Italy, have created a a Korean internationalization of the promotion of made in Italy, specifically it's know how and let's say it's made in Italy excellence and its pillars when it comes to sectorial knowhow. So I started off within the Food and Bear Ridge wine industry, and I worked together with Stevie Kim at Venetley International for for for quite a while. And then I moved from Venetley International to a a media group in Parma where I did the promotion of Italian food companies mainly in that regard. And then following that, I have recently been offered a position as the head of the global MBA at the Belania Business School, which you will know. And there again, it's about promoting the mainly Italy Excellence. And so it's been an interesting interesting ride, but really trying to create a career in project management. So So and there's there's another connection with, Belonia Business School, yours student there. Correct. Yes. Exactly. So I actually graduated from the from the Belonia business school. I was part of the academic year of two thousand fourteen fifteen, where I did the global MBA and I did the course you know, food and wine, the the track specific course, which the Blonia Business School is very well known for having a global MBA, but then specifying, you know, into different tracks of made in Italy excellence. And then following that experience. That's when I first got the opportunity to then work with Stevie and then move on to the other opportunities that I've had in my project management career. And there's a another connection with Belonia Business School. I do a lecture there every year in the food and wine track, and I started actually the year after, Gabriella left. But, it's been a real fun, experience in getting to know the business school and, seeing the students learn and grow. And Gabrielle is one of the the successful case histories of that. So let's go back and and talk a little bit about BBS first and what the mission is of of BBS and your perspective on how that may be changing or adapting to life in the COVID era? Well, yeah, that's actually very interesting because I think definitely the the Belonia Business School It's a relatively new business school. It's only that of twenty years old, although it is connected to the University of Bylonia, which as you know, the University of Bylonia is the oldest university in the world. So we all we all we all very proud of that. Now the Bylonia business school is as a relatively new business school has grown within these twenty years. And I think what I've seen, you know, that's very that's been quite an amazing, an amazing experience that I've I specifically and personally have had, said when I did the course in two thousand fourteen in fifteen. It was a, you know, it was a relatively small sort of group of of of students that I would, you know, I would see. And since then, it's grown into into a business school that is recognized all over the world. And, obviously, with regards to the pandemic, there has been some obviously struggles with regards to ensuring that students can come still and have an on presence experience because we believe, obviously, within the education that on presence experience is very, very important. So I think COVID has kind of made us adapt into hybrid learning environment, which perhaps is, I think different. It's a different learning experience to what, perhaps I had when I was, you know, on campus twenty four seven. Having said this though, we are now moving back towards on presence, and we're doing everything in presence again. So we're really, we're we're really moving towards back to having everything everything again in person. So it's last the last two years, I think have been difficult in that sense, but the schools have adapted amazingly. Most of the students are international, unless you can tell from Gabriella's accent, she is not Italian. Yes. Yes. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. That's good. Yes. Exactly. So what what prompted you to move to Italy in the first place? Well, actually, I in when I was in South Africa, I have a best achelors of Arts, and I'm majored in Italian and international relations, because I'm actually of Italian heritage. And then I did a postgraduate diploma in business management at the Vitz business school. So I come from Johannesburg. So I studied at the University of Atvastatrans, and then I moved on to the Vitz business school. Which is the business school associated to the University of Address. Right? And then I worked for a company where I did front of house sort of catering events, private events where I would bring chefs to chefs to people's homes. And it was an Italian South African company very well known in the restaurant industry back at home. And I worked a lot with Italian Food and wine and was very passionate with regards to sort of creating a career in terms of what this meant, what what what was Italian food and wine, what, you know, where did it come from, etcetera. So I had a look. I always wanted to do an MBA and I had a look and I Google search. So I found the the the the global MBA in Food and wine at the Belania Business School. So that made me then, you know, moved to Italy in September of twenty fourteen and pursue the the NBA. Pursue the course. And then from there, pursue my my my career. Cool. Okay. So now you're at BBS, what are your goals there both at the school and and and your involvement in, the Italian wine industry? And I I make a point that it's the food and wine track. So it's not exclusively unwind thing. Obviously, Italy's big in food, everything from parma ham to, you know, baloney, baloney. So what what what are you trying to do at at PBS? Well, as I mentioned earlier, I have seen exceptional growth, at BBS. And I feel that, obviously, the track specialization courses that the global MBA offers, because it doesn't only offer food and wine. It offers also other courses. To name design fashion and luxury goods, super cars, super bikes, and motor sports, green energy and sustainable businesses, as well as automation and robotics. So it's all your Italian pillar know how, sectorial specific know how, that Italy is very, very well known for. And I haven't seen other business schools that offer something similar. So my goal really is to increase the visibility of the course offerings and increase the visibility of these course offerings worldwide. And obviously then hopefully leading to ensuring that the master becomes, you know, much more well known than it already is. Cool. Okay. One of the points you made was you've seen, a growth in, Italy in terms of the internationalization of the wine industry, certainly always been a large part of the the US market, but still in all, I think the the the appointed departure for you and and, I suspect, but certainly me is working with Stevie Kim, who's kind of been the visionary innovator creator of a lot of these things in Italy international academy, which they're bringing to, Moscow again in live this year, which is is kind of interesting. So you worked for Stevie, and then then you're here at at BBS. You have a very different perspective, from from it as a student and then having the influence of Steve applied to what you're doing. Now, for our listeners, Stevie is the, really creator of the concept of the Italian wine podcast. So that's why we're spending so much time thinking about her. But tell me about what her influence was on you. Well, I think Kevin my opportunity start off my internship because I did my actual BBS global MBA in Food and wine internship with Stevie. And then I moved from the internship, and I I pursued, pursued a couple of years with her. And I've I really found that her outtake on promoting Italian wine abroad, was just different to what I had ever seen. And I think how she is able to ensure that, you know, the Italian wine industry is world renowned is is is very impressive because she took a, she's taken an international outlook, I I think, on on what the Italian wine industry means, and also aiding these, you know, the the vineyards in understanding what it means to export and aid in the vineyards, not only, you know, in promotion and storytelling, but sort of giving an idea of what it actually means to to be able to sell wines abroad. So I think that I I saw a lot of I saw a lot of effort that we had put into obviously creating that that opportunity for for Italian wine brands and had fantastic opportunities where I did a lot of, exhibitions where I did Italian. I did, Vineeti Hong Kong. I was the project manager from Italy Hong Kong, so I saw a lot of interest in different markets, Canada, as well in the excellent sort of, markets where a lot of where a lot of Italian wine consumers, you know, are appreciating more what it actually what Italian wine actually means. And then it's not just a wine from Tuscany or a wine from Pemonte, that there's actually stories behind the vineyards. Well, okay. So take take that point, further, and I'll ask a broad question then. I'll dig a little bit deeper into to, what is your perspective on how Italians and the wine is industry are viewed in the United States. I know you haven't spent a whole lot of time here, but you have the perspective from being over there. I have some comments on it, but I wanna hear what you have to say before I influence that. Well, I don't think it's changed. I don't think it's, you know, Italian wine industry from a US market perspective is very much different to to anywhere else where I've seen, because I really do think that, Italian wine consumers or Italian wine is see the brands are seen as, let's say, a region instead of the actual vineyard or the actual story, as I said earlier, of the actual of the actual company itself. So, for example, I mean Italian wine, there are over how however many varieties, there are over three hundred even more, four hundred varieties, from when it comes to Italian wine grapes, in Italy. So I think it's more about how one needs to educate the markets abroad, and I do feel that the the markets in general are not only the US see Italian wine as regions. And I think I think Stevie does an excellent job in trying to in trying to, you know, make it more about the vineyard. Okay. So the the the flip side of that is and I've had a lot of experience working, and talking with individual Italian wineries. For the most part, they're farmers, you know, except for the may the big, either the co ops or which are basically, farmers, but, you know, and their differences in some of the bigger, export brands, like Bamphey and some others. But for the most part, they're farmers. And even if they have traveled to the US, it's still very much a foreign country. And what I find is a real lack of understanding of the the the realities of how the US market works. And so there's a tendency for them to say, no, I I wanna sell my brand in the US. And their world view is I will sell it to an importer, and the importer will take on the responsibility. As you know, and I certainly know and deal with every day, that's not the case. And that's involved or devolved, I suppose, down to is the burden of marketing and promoting your brand is on the supplier. How to educate Italian producers on how to, you know, participate in the US market from a perspective of growing up on a farm. Look, I I don't have a lot of expertise in that regard, but I mean, because it I just I think that it's very much based on helping Italian wine, vineyards understanding that, it's more about them that they need to speak about and not only, and about their story and why, you know, the the grapes were, you know, grown a specific way or in which mountain, what what are the weather conditions that that inter, you know, influence influence their wine. And I think wine consumers in general now are more looking towards an Italian brand as to why it is that Italian brand and why is that Italian brand so well known? So I think it's more about you know, aiding and and bridging the the gap between what they experience on a daily basis and being able to actually take that abroad perhaps with international know how or with with somebody that's able to, perhaps, give them guidance in in in how to market their, market their brands accordingly. Okay. So, recently, one one of the the students from the first year I taught was Akantola Temitop. I don't know if you know him Yes. I do. Yes. Yes. Yes. He's from Zulu. Yeah. He works with Zulu. Yep. And, he he just did a clubhouse interview with Stevie, which I thought was really interesting. But to look at the world of wine from the perspective of a very progressive African country. Exactly. It it's an entirely different world than the one I come from, and certainly the one you come from, because, obviously, South Africa has a there's a long wine history on its own. To me, it was interesting listening to Demi, and and the perspective on the Italian wine industry from a country where there's a lot more wine growth to happen. You're from Africa. Can you comment on that? You know, I you can't just say one country in Nigeria or Kenya or South Africa is definitive of a whole continent, but give us an African perspective if you are. I think, you know, I'm very passionate about the African continent, and I think the African continent is is growing. I think a lot of, specific, you know, certain countries are also growing within their GDP and just to name a few. I mean, Nigeria, Ghana, Kenya, South Africa are all very much, you know, countries that have the capability of spending. And a lot of people, I think, are now also wanting you know, it's the those luxury brands. And I do feel that perhaps an Italian wine is seen as a luxury sort of element, but, the Africans are now sort of also as a market. I feel that is is is not yet is not yet ready, but I feel that within the next couple of years, it's definitely to something to keep an eye on because there there is there is the spending power, there. And I do feel that a lot of people are now also wanting to get into sort of that that same sort of, you know, element of buying of buying luxury Italian brands and not only wine, but, you know, design luxury when it when it comes to clothes as well. So it's it's it's looking it's looking good for the African market. I really do think that it's something to attempting to keep an eye out for. One of the differences, I see. Well, obviously, in the home country of Italy, Italian wine and food naturally go together in the US, the most popular type of restaurant is Italian food, and obviously Italian wine is natural fit there. The food in in Africa and each of those countries that you just mentioned is is very different. And within within any given country is very different. Where is the popularity of Italian food and how does Italian wine fit into the food scene in some of these countries? Well, I think at the popularity at the moment is is definitely with South Africa. I can I can say that, obviously, as a as a as a child of an Italian immigrant, because my father came out to South Africa in the seventies, but before that even my grandfather on my mother's side, came out in the early twenties? So there was a lot of Italian immigration to South Africa, not as much as the United States or Canada or even Australia, but there is a certain amount of Italian in Italian community back at home. And, there is a understanding, and there's a it is a fantastic restaurant scene specifically within Cape Town as well. And there is the understanding that of Italian food and wine, even though South Africa itself has a very strong wine industry. So I do think that South Africa is there's a lot of space there. Obviously, it's different in terms of how one would react to import an exploitation from the u the US because obviously everybody in each country has their own regulations, but I do think that there is definitely space to grow. And in the other African countries, I do feel are following on that and following on that trend that they see in South Africa. Okay. So back to BBS, is the focus on BBS, on Western, you know, European and and United States in terms of, you know, the the where the business is going to grow, where the students are gonna go to work for companies and so forth. Or is it more international than that? No. No. It's definitely more international. We do obviously also have a a big African intake speaking of Africa. BBS has, is is also growing within an international sort of outlook, not only from a US perspective, but also in Europe. Italy itself, a lot of Italian candidates are now looking at doing the global MBA because a lot of our companies that we work with are obviously companies that are based in the in the in the national valley. So with all the Italian pillars that I had mentioned earlier about the Italian excellence, a lot of the companies that we work with are Italian. So our program advisory committees for each concentration are Italian companies that may have international brands. So you might have an Italian company that then has a a branch in Dubai, but, it is very much working towards more of an international outlook and our students that do the global MBA because as we said earlier, it is a a full time English taught, taught course, whereas obviously other courses at the Bellania business school are also in Italian because we offer we offer different mass So we only don't we only don't offer just the global MBA. There's the executive masters. We have the full time masters, as well as also open and customized programs, which are also taught in Italian. So, having said that we we are now seeing at the global NBA a huge intake from international companies. And a trend this year I saw was also from South America, which is also very interesting. So a lot of com you know, Argentina Chile, Chile, all of those all of those candidates are coming through Italy. One of the things I noticed when I've had the, privilege of lecturing there is the the business school itself. Well, while the university is old and and, historically has been in call it Downtown bologna, old old bologna, The business school is at a palazzo that some cardinal, I believe, had in the fifteen hundreds. And the contrast of speaking in a room or giving a class in a room when you look up at the ceiling and there's frescoes on the ceiling and timbers from the fifteen hundreds. And coming down from that is a projector, onto a screen that's capturing my PowerPoint where I'm looking at the students and there's this old giant fireplace and all that. This contrast of, of old and new as kind of interesting. And what I found particularly, exciting was the quality level of the students, the engagement with the subject, you know, and and as much as I would like to think that it's my presentation. I think is more the the subject area than it is me. But I thought the students were really engaged in the perspective of having worked in the world and then coming back. So most of them were like, you know, in their late twenties, generated some really, really good conversations that I really haven't seen in a lot of places. And in fact, when I was at wine to wine in October, a bunch of the students that we the the students that we work with virtually were there, and it was really exciting to see them and hear some of the programs they're they've got going. Do you stay in touch with any of the students that you were peers with and and where have they gone? Yes. I absolutely do. A couple of, people have actually stayed in in Italy. Actually, a friend of mine, a colleague, she did the design fashion and luxury goods track, and now she's in Dubai. So she's working for bulgari in Dubai. So she did very well. Was that bulgari the Jeweler or bulgari? The winery? No. I believe the the jeweler. It's literally the design fashion. It actually goes track. Yeah. You know, neither girl went through to through to back to New York. She was American and now she's working for Coca Chanel from the design fashion and actually a good side of things. A lot of the food and wine kids, we kind of either went on to the entrepreneurial side because a lot of a lot of guys that from Food and Wine went back home, couple of South African girls, she went back home and she she carried on with her with her own with her own company within the Food and Wine industry. So I think what the Bologna business school also tends to allow you to understand is how to create your own career and being able to network according the NT order to ensure that you enjoy and and and pursue what you love. And I think that's I specifically learned. You know, I took I took the knowledge. I took the knowledge half from the from the NBA general management and management skill courses. So you're an integrated normal general MBA courses, And I took the knowledge of the Food and Wine, industry track specific sort of concentrations as well as the networking that we got to do with the leaders because we got a lot of leadership talks and interaction with practitioners because we interact with the with the University of Belonia's faculty, but not only with the university of Belongia's faculty, also practitioners within the industry as well as visiting professors from all over the world. So it really does give such an open, such an an amazing opportunity to sort of launch your career in the direction that you wanna take it. Okay. Let's turn the question into one of practicality. There's a lot of, you know, the US market, it dates back to the, you know, the end of prohibition in nineteen thirty three and a lot of antiquated and archaic rules regulations and kind of structures that have evolved because of that. How do you find the idea of a business school education is perceived in the Italian wine industry? And I wanna focus on the wine side as it is now. I'm sure you've talked with a lot of the graduates. You know, Temi works for, Zonin, and there's others who have gone to work for other, companies. So what's your point of view on that? Well, I think it's very much based on the the reality of the Italian winery. And how they are approaching sort of international objectives and internationalization in general because, obviously, you have your your bigger wineries that aren't as, you know, sort of stuck in an Italian mindset perhaps that's that's that's what we're looking at, whereas where you have maybe your small to medium sized wineries that are still very much, you know, within a national, a national basis. And I think in in the objective for smaller to medium sized wineries to grow on an international, on an international scale, they need perhaps more understanding of what's the markets are, and perhaps it's perhaps a lack of understanding. And I don't think it's a don't think it's an educational thing at all. No. It's just perhaps just a lack of understanding as to what is expected in other markets. And I feel that when when the Italian minorities are trying to trying to sort of embrace new markets, one needs to perhaps actually understand the the the US market or the the African continent continental market or or the or the Chinese market in in very much detail in order to then have a successful exporting strategy. Okay. So that's where Via comes in, Van Italy International Academy, Steve's thing. And, she's taken upon her herself and her organization to promote Italian wines internationally. The the people who participate in and attend that though are what I would call wine geeks, you know, cork dork people who are really super into that who who, you know, would know what Valentina and and Grego De Tufo is where most Americans would would not know that. So are we, are is is the Italian wine industry as a whole and then add BBS and, those DB's organization in Verona, being practical in exporting the wine industry to just the, you know, the wine Geeks? Well, no. I think what BBS specifically, I was obviously aiding, I think, international talent to understand the market. And then for those that obviously have the passion for the sector already, are being able to understand the market specifically and then take that knowledge and and as I said earlier, make make make a career out of out of what they learned from BBA. So I think the Bellologia Business School is very much aiding talents to in interact with these with these companies. If, obviously, then, students are wanting to stay. So I think definitely from that from that perspective, there is there is a great sort of, opportunity opportunity for for for students to really gain more knowledge. Okay. One of the my yeah. That that's fine. One of my objectives in doing this interview is is to help recruit students to attend. So publicity about, BBS is is is kind of important. I also wanted to to give a shout out to Luto Vica Leon and Barbara Beyonde who are on the staff there and have helped shaped a lot of what this what this is. So thank you to Gabriela. We'll be able to say goodbye in a moment, but here's kind of the the the final question I ask all my interviewees. What's the big takeaway from this conversation? What's the one practical thing somebody who is listening to this can either put to use immediately or factor into their, world or business life? Well, that I've honestly think that the Italian wine industry is a a very, very complex and an amazing industry to to to get into. And I think people that are wanting to pursue that, can use the Belonia Business Schools Global NBA and Food and Wine to help them get Great. And if you do, there's a good chance I'll see you there. So, so I wanna do a big shout out. Thank you to Gabriella for, participating in this week's edition of the Italian wine podcast. So if people wanna get in touch with you, Gabriella, can you give us your email and your social handles? Yes. Absolutely. Sure. So I'm on LinkedIn as Gabriela de Clemente. So that's, you know, people can search me on LinkedIn. And my email address is gabriela dot de clemente at b b s dot unibo dot r t. Thank you so much for sharing your time with me. I've known you in a couple of different points in your life, and it's it's really interesting to to see where you are now. BBS has become kind of an important part of my life too, which is kinda cool. So it's been an evolution. Thank you for sharing your time. Pleasure. Thank you, Steve. It's been lovely being here. Thank you very much. This is Steve Ray. Thanks again for listening on behalf of the Italian wine podcast. Hi, guys. I'm Joy Livingston, and I am the producer of the Italian wine podcast. Thank you for listening. We are the only wine podcast that has been doing a daily show since the pandemic began. This is a labor of love and we are committed to bringing you free content every day. Of course, this takes time and effort not to mention the cost of equipment, production, and editing. We would be grateful for your donations, suggestions quests and ideas. For more information on how to get in touch, go to Italian wine podcast dot com.