Ep. 1487 What Sommeliers Want Now | wine2wine Business Forum 2022

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Don't forget to tune in every Thursday at two PM central European time or visit point to wine dot net for more information. It's a real pleasure to be here today opening this session, featuring three wonderful sommeliers who will be introduced in a little while, and the publisher and Italian editor of wine and spirits magazine. Wine and spirits is one of the not only is it one of the top wine publications in the US, But what is special about it, and I think what you'll see here today and what differentiates it from other publications is the fact that it is read and highly respected and highly utilized by the wine trade in the US and in particular by so millais like the ones who are here with us today. Not only do they read this publication, but they're also very close collaborators of the publication. In fact, the tasting panels that the magazine organizes as they evaluate wines throughout the year always include sommeliers. And so not only are they readers and followers of the magazine, but they are really very close collaborators as well. And that is something that is hugely important also for wineries who want to get their wines in front of the people who are making the decisions and actually purchasing the wines and selling them to consumers. We are going to, in fact, kind of see what these, tasting panels are like, Dalvivo because After a brief introduction on the publication itself, we're going to go into a tasting panel that Stephanie Johnson is going to lead. And then after that, each of the three so many days joining us will speak a little bit about their restaurants, their markets, and their experiences with Italian wine. So I am going to turn it over immediately to Josh Green, the publisher of wine and spirits magazine, who will take it from here. Thank you so much, Claire. It's an honor for us to be here today, and thank you for joining us. I'm gonna talk a little bit about why we're here with three sommeliers, why we involve the trade in our tasting process. And then Stephanie Johnson will describe that process and take you through the tasting. So you're welcome to taste the wines now if you want while while I'm talking and Stephanie is talking. But please do keep enough in your glass so that you can taste and listen to what the sommeliers are saying and what Stephanie is saying as we're as we're tasting them along the way. Okay. So, I'll also mention that the big glass is wine number one. The little glass is wine number two. At our tastings, we would have the same glass sizes and numbered glasses, in front of their tasters. But in this case, logistically, this was the simplest way for you to know which is wine number one and wine number two. First I'd like to introduce the panel, John Paulo, good friend manages the wine program at his family's restaurant, Aquarello in San Francisco. He also runs a second restaurant, Cerrello, Cerrella, and was a frequent taster on our panels when our office was in San Francisco. So, we got to know Ocurello very well because of that. And it's got this amazing list of, not only Piedmont wines, but Champagne and California wines. June Roto, she's managing the wine programs at Goodnite botality in Houston based restaurant group. She's a partner there and a CEO, and she's a master of Sommelier. So she has several diverse lists that she manages, and they include, some Italian wines, but they're not as focused on Italian wine specifically. As either John Paulo's or Robbins. She manages March, Rosie Kennenball, as well as June's all day in Austin. So she's in Houston as well as where she was before in Austin. Robin Wright developed a one program for Chisiamo, union square hospitality groups, new restaurant in Manhattan West. And she developed an interest in restaurants when she moved to New York in two thousand thirteen. By two thousand eighteen, she was a Salmier and the team at the Nomette Hotel. Is right around the corner from her office in New York, and I got to know Robin a little bit there. And then later, she was at restaurant Danielle before she launched this new restaurant for Union Square Hospitality Group. So Stephanie Johnson, on my right, Stephanie was working in book publishing before she got into into wine as a career. And she was managing the wine programs for Michael Dorff's programs at City winery, which is this kind of unusual restaurant winery music venue that he started downtown Manhattan and now has thirteen different venues around the country. She joined wine and spirits in two thousand thirteen as our tasting director. And then by two thousand sixteen, she became our Italian wine editor she does all of the reviews of all the Italian wines. So just to give you a little history on why we're doing this, why we taste this way. Forty years ago, when I got involved with the magazine, our goal was to build a magazine online. And at the time, that meant as part of being a magazine, you took advertising. And so we were looking to figure out how to create a barrier between church and state and the magazine business we call church and state. So between the editorial and the business side of the magazine. Our question that we were asking was how do we provide unbiased and useful product reviews? So we developed this tasting process And it took really two decades to develop it. We went through a lot of different permutations. And then in the last two decades, we've really fine tuned it. Our goals were to develop an open situation with transparency. And so that built into a two step process, a two step tastings process. It's run by the tasting department is run by a tastings editor, and he has tasting coordinators that work for him. And then we have a team of critics. I'm one of them. Stephanie is one of them. We have two others. They're each responsible for particular regions around the world. The first step is for the critic to lead a tasting panel. Which is what you're going to see us do here today. And it usually has two members of the trade, sometimes more. Today, we have three members of the trade. It's the panel's role to decide whether we're going to recommend a wine or not. So it takes it out of our choice as a magazine editorial staff. We don't have that choice. We leave it up to the panel. We have one person on that panel, and then we have outside people on the panel. The rating itself is based on the subjective experience of the critic, and it's often influenced by some degree by the subjective experience of the panelists themselves. So the critic will listen to what the panelists have to say when they're recommending the wine. And will determine sort of how enthusiastic he or she wants to be about the scoring. So the score is really just a signal about that enthusiasm. It's about our reaction to the quality and the character of the wine. When we set out to train our critics, we set we try to teach them to train them to taste without prejudice. So the whole goal of our tasting process is to taste without prejudice. And that's why we bring in outside people and a rotating group of outside people all the time. What we tell our critics when we're training them is to just experience the wine, just taste it and experience the wine, and then after you've tasted it, consider what just happened. So it's sort of like allowing yourself to dream and then analyzing the dream. It's sort of like knowing, in this case, we're tasting Cianti classico, just to taste it and let your mind wander and then analyze where your mind wandered. The question we ask ourselves is how did we react to the wine? How does it fit within what we know about county classical in twenty twenty? So this is not in any way an objective or scientific approach to tasting. And in fact, we ask our sommeliers and our retailers and other people who are coming to taste with us, not to use a tasting grid, not to think about this as a court of master sommelier tasting or a W SCT tasting but to just react to the wine. We asked them, would you recommend this wine to a friend? Would you wanna drink it with them? And if so, why? So while we have a lot of talented retailers who taste with us, We find that most of our tasters are sommeliers, and they work with wine and food together in their job so that they can put wine in context with a meal. And it it gives them a reason to recommend the wine. It works much more with our question. Why would you recommend this wine? Because we're not giving them price. We're not giving them brand. And without a price, a retailer is often at a loss as to why they would not why they would recommend a wine or not. And Sommeliz can often find a reason to recommend it. We also find that the results of our approach are useful to Sommelier's because our recommendations and tasting notes involve how to use the wine. So with that background, Stephanie's now going to take on take you through the tasting and give you this brief tasting of these two wines, as to how we would actually how it actually work in our offices. Thank you. They say that when you whisper, people pay closer attention, and I'm not doing this as a strategy. I I actually lost my voice a couple days ago. So apologies. I hope you can hear me. When we do tastings in in our office, we have these tasting coordinators who enter all the wines into a database. They construct a panel of like wines. Basically, we have pores who come in and pour all the wines before we sit down in numbered glasses. So when we sit down at the table, all we see are numbered glasses and a blind sheet with the appalachian and the vintage and maybe a reserva or some kind of classification like that and we taste in flights in this case. Obviously, it's just two wines but normally we'd taste four or five wines in a flight. We'd go through the flight. I would ask them, would you recommend or not? Straight up yes or no and we go around that and then and then the wines that are but definitely no as we kind of they're they're set aside. The others we discuss and the wines that pass with the majority of yeses I will then retaste blind again the second day or the same day and sometimes a second day and then score them and then I find out after that the identity of the wine before I edit the final tasting note and at the end of the tasting though the psalms get a key sheet. So they end up knowing what the wines are. So if there was something they really liked in the tasting, they have that information to go out and buy it potentially for their list In this case, no one's ever gonna find out the identities. We wanted to make sure that everyone felt comfortable up here describing these wines really brutally honestly because that's the way they they do it in our tastings. And we didn't want you know if one of the producers happens to be here. We didn't want that coming out. So none of us know we did taste the wines before we sat down here just for the sake of time but we didn't discuss them yet. I wanted that to be spontaneous. So why are we doing this here? Because I I thought it would be useful. We get this kind of feedback every day really honest feedback from some a's and I thought it would be valuable for you to hear how Sommelier's talk about the wines when they're in this kind of setting with real honesty and clarity. Okay. So, we have two Kianti classicos Anatta we don't ever know the price either unless it's twenty dollars or less. So we were not told that these were twenty dollars or less so we we consider those value wines but we're we're assuming these are not. So what I will do is go around and just say yes or no on why number one and why number two and then we'll talk about them. Okay. So twenty twenty both twenty twenty. Yeah. Okay. And the big glass is one number one. The smaller glass is number two. Okay. So, John Paulo number one. Yes or no? Yes. K. June. Yes. Okay. Yes. And Josh. Okay. And I said yes. Okay. Number two. June. Yes. Okay? Robin. Leaving yes. Okay. Sorry. June was yes. Robin was sort of a mild yes. Jampala was no. I said no. Okay. So now we have a a tie which is always the hardest part. Okay. So let's talk about because I think we could all agree here that there's two very different styles in front of us. John Paulo, do you wanna talk about what you thought about number one and why you said yes? Sure. Why number one is really bright. It's vibrant. It has a beautiful red fruit, really brisk acidity. The tannins are are sweet and long. I just find it to be very balanced. It's what I expect with a pure sun divay that can't take class echo. Much an agreement with John Paulo. It ends with this wonderful sour fruit that's balanced with the front palette of sweet fruit. It's drinkable presently. So if I were recommending it now, it's something that can be enjoyable in present day. It's definitely a pure, fruited wine. So you can tell what it is, and it's easy to describe as well. It's very classic and style. And it shows the vintage in a really balanced way. Yeah. I agree with all those comments. I think the wine is beautiful and fresh. It's driven by its acidity, really lovely red fruit, you know, and a myriad of spices and really, really lovely flavors. So yeah. And very fresh and floral, and I think it's gonna go on for a long time as well. It's great to drink now, but also later on, I would definitely love to see how this turns out. That plurality was also what drew me and was just really fresh and rose petals and it felt lifted and bright to me. Okay, Josh, the no. The one no vote. Yeah. For me, I really liked the freshness upfront. And I'm sort of sweet and ripe up front. And then for me, it went a little bit short sour and watery in the end. So I I was I was led along to really want it to want to like it, and then I was not so positive in the end and I thought I was disappointed. That's the francophile in you coming out. Okay. On the second wine, June, you said yes. What was that? Well, a completely different style. I said yes due to largely impart of the finish. The acidity and the tannins are quite long. It has a little bit of imbalance to me at present time, but it shows longevity and a great potential to age. Which a lot of American consumers enjoy presently that strong tannin and strong long structured finish. I'm leaning. Yes. Simply because the when I tasted the first one, I was just so blown away. This is totally my style, bright and fresh. And then wine number two in the smaller glass, I feel like the aromatics are trapped, and they're really concentrated, and it seemed kind of obnoxious at first. But I think it's actually showing to be a really beautifully aromatic wine. It's super interesting. I think it's a little bit more driven by the alcohol than you said, which is not really my thing, but I do think that is well enjoyed. So, and I think it's actually kinda tasty. It's opening up in a really interesting way. So that's why I'm leaning yes if not just Yes. I find the nose to be a little bit muddled. I think it lacks purity on the nose. It's a little rustic, aromatically. Find the tannins a little bit bitter. It feels like there's some oak to it that sticks out to me in a way that I find unpleasant, and the tannins on the finish are are pretty coarse. They're just not very pleasant. I don't find myself wanting to drink more of it. Was my also my the the kind of the bitterness to the tannins and the the bruschness of it maybe it will show better in a year or so, but I would not want to drink it today. And and we we will recommend wines. Not every wine has to be drunk today, but this one I just think I I couldn't get to to a yes. Yeah. One thing we do do as a magazine is all of our critics retaste wines several times, not only after the panel breaks, and we taste them and give them a preliminary score But then the wines we really like, we go back and taste them the next day, and sometimes the day after that. And this is a wine that I would wanna taste the next day and see where it went. So I would recommend this wine in part because I'd want to go back and taste it again I think it has a lot of length. I'm troubled a little bit by the hyper ripeness of it, but I also find there's some really intriguing things about it. I find the the scent really earthy and deep, and I find there's a long finish partly driven by wood tannen's but also with fruit tannins. So I I think it's an interesting wine. I'd wanna see it again. I'd wanna look at it and see what it does. And I think there's a generosity to the wine that's really appealing to me. Since that one was three to two, with myself and the minority. I would retaste that wine and it would stay in the it would stay in the mix and it would get scored and it would get a tasty note based on how have the score. So that's kind of our process. And now I think it would be helpful for you to get a little more context from each of the psalms about, you know, what where they are and their restaurants and how they make decisions when they're actually buying the wines for their lists. Sure. So I managed the wine program for two restaurants Aquariello is, Joestar Michelin fine dining, Italian restaurant that's been around since nineteen eighty nine. So we've got, a very deep seller over two thousand selections on the list. Primarily Italian, We represent every region, but we really focus on Piamonte as a primary, primary love. We buy wines really based on, on quality, of course. We, we like wines that lean towards the fresher brighter side of the spectrum. Find those to be a little more food friendly. However, since the list is so large, we we do have plenty of wines from, from, you know, bowl getty from riper warmer areas that feature international arrivals as well. Italian wine podcast brought to you by mama jumbo shrimp. We have very deep verticals as you're seeing on the screen right now. That's an example of, of one producer gets a whole page for a particular wine. Both lists at both restaurants are organized geographically. I think geography is the, the most telling, factor in what a wine tastes like and why. So, not pictured. You'd find another page on the barolo list that is organized, first of all, by, village in Barolo and then broken down into vineyards in Barolo. When I worked at Michael Mina, a very burgundy focused restaurant in San Francisco, that kind of inspired me to do the same thing for Piamonte. So I've done that ever since. And then at Sorella, the list is, very small. It's just fifty wines all Italian. It's, less than a year old and newer restaurant. It's meant to be very approachable and user friendly. There's no so many on the floor there. So we'd list the grape varieties and really try to make it something that, is really approachable to even more novice drinkers. We try to represent the whole country, but, you know, because we don't have so many there, some things that are a little bit less well known, need a hand sell, and we we focus more on things that people are comfortable with over there. Hello. I am in Houston, Texas presently, and my career has mostly been in Texas. I've opened more than sixteen restaurants from very low casual counter dining to fine dining. I presently own a restaurant group, and operate it in Houston with a restaurant in Austin. The Houston market is a little bit different. It's sometimes considered a secondary market in Texas, but I would say that a lot of importers and producers are looking to states like Texas, Florida that are quite large as perhaps the third most important, state market in the United States. So in Texas, you have four of the most populated cities in the United States of America. So they really tend to need to be looked at quite differently. Within our restaurant groups, they are very concept driven. Ninety percent of the restaurants that I have operated or opened have been Eurocentric list. Ninety percent within those Eurocentric lists would be a split between France and Italy. So they're all very broad scope for both European and non European wines with Italy and France being the main focus of those eurocentric wine lists. For the high end Michelin style restaurants, we don't have Michelin in Texas because it sucks. We have a restaurant called March. It's named after, the Marca or Marca styled regions. So it is Mediterranean focused. To eleven hundred SKUs. Two hundred and fifty plus are Italian with a high density in Pemonte to skinny and then the third being Sicily and outlying regions. We do have similar to Jean Paulo singular pages or more of specific producers. The way we reach those producers are truly iconic driven producers, plus things that are meaningful to our wine team. So oftentimes our wine team has visited. There's knowledge or very big, relationships with direct wineries or with the importers thereof because it is difficult to get a broader and deeper deeper seller because of state legalities in a region like Texas. So it's very important to understand how to receive the wines. So that's really the most important issue of being able to get really large lots of one singular producer. The larger the list, the more sommeliers on the floor. So for this list, we have approximately three sommeliers on the floor, on any given day. For a more casual list. This is two hundred and fifty SKUs at our, upscale casual dining restaurant. About twenty five percent of the list is Italian. It is again Eurocentric. And it's more broken down regionally, to be able to say, here are the regions. After the regions, we're looking at styles for particular palettes. So what style are you looking for? Light, crispy, oaked, rounded, something with age, etcetera. So you will see producers often in competition with each other if they're of similar styles and similar regions within one country. Because you'll have a fewer amount of producers within a specific region there. Hello. I'm Robin. I opened up about a year ago Chisiamo it's a new restaurant by Danny Meyer and Union Square Hospitality Group, run by chef Hillary Sterling. It's been an absolute pleasure to open that restaurant and stock the seller from the very start. We started with about four hundred and twenty selections in September of last year, and now I've grown to about a thousand. It is seventy five percent Italian, with twenty five percent other, mostly being French, and with a little bit of around Italy, which is super fun, like, Corsica and Switzerland and Austria. But the Italian side is, definitely driven by indigenous varieties, which is what really drove me to the program in the first place. They told me, you know, when I was, you know, interviewing for the position that I would be able to create a list that really focus on the regions, and the great varieties that are benchmarked in those regions. And if somebody wanted chardonnay or Cabernay, then you can have burgundy, you can have California, you can have Bordeaux, and I was like, I'm on board. And they said you can have champagne too, which I was, yes. Absolutely. So it's a really fun list. It's also, you know, in Danny Meyer style. It's driven by value, which I think is really, really important to me. I want, everyone who comes to Chisiyamo to be able to enjoy a bottle of wine whether it be fifty dollars or three thousand dollars. There's a whole spectrum. We have verticals as well. But we really try to focus on, you know, or what I found in my identity of this restaurant is focusing on newer producers, upcoming producers, you know, maybe someone who took what their father did and they're making something super special of it, you know, maybe converting to organic farming or making a smaller scale, small production focusing more on terroir. Is really important to me as well. And for me, finding like minded distributors and importers who are bringing in wines like that, who are finding these rising stars, who are really doing something different and special, is really important to me. And so I've I found a couple, you know, partner like, you know, distributors like court quarter who's bringing in one of my favorite new, Rosa Dival Delino, which is by, Deslevelli. Stephanie tried it at Chisiano. I am obsessed with that wine. Really tiny production and the wines are absolutely gorgeous and every bottle is unique and different, which I find, really, really fun. So, and as you can see from the buy the glass menu here, you know, I'm trying to focus on producers who are benchmark. In the region, but also maybe some newer lesser known producers and, you know, really regionally focus and indigenous variety as it makes it really, really fun for me for Italy. Thank you, guys. I think we would at this point, liked you. I know we have we're short on time, so we wanted to get through everything in order to turn it over to the audience for questions, if you would like to. I'll start out really fast actually. A lot of you, like, June, you were speaking about the way that you choose the wines on the list. How much would you say is actually the kind of the feedback and the palettes of your consumers versus the palettes of you and your wine team? Because you mentioned saying that the wine team was like a big influence in terms of terms of what you buy. And I actually have that question for all three of you. Kind of consumer influence versus your own and your team's influence. Very large with consumer influence. You know, fortunately, we are very lucky and that our restaurants are full and popular. So if we do not have what they are looking for, they will drink what we recommend. Anyway, they will not leave. But, we do want to make sure that we are egalitarian and hit as many different styles and palettes. As possible. So if there is a consumer that's looking for white Zenfundo from California, there is something of note that can hit that palette, which may not be that actual wine. So we understand the consumer and we can direct them to the most appropriate style. However, it's really important for us for employee retention for our team to have a bit of autonomy as well as influence from the market, which is very important, wineries, importers, and their wine directors, and ultimately the partners of the company. Delegate balance. Yes. So I also have the the same sort of unique situation where luckily we're full, so people come in. But I also think with the selections being indigenous, you know, I think a lot of people are confused about Italy. They're confused about what comes from Tuscany, what comes from Piedmont, they be, they think all super Tuscans are Cabernet with Oak, you know, so it's a lot of up to our staff to study and for us to educate them, which I absolutely love giving. And so I have to say a year in, I'm really proud to see all my servers who came from different backgrounds, you know, now describing all these beautiful indigenous wines of Italy and were selling things that I never thought we would sell and they're describing things I never thought they would describe. It definitely has been a long road, but it's absolutely worth it. So at Aquarillo, we have forty seats only. It's quite a small restaurant, and there are at least two some ways on the floor every night. And we literally pour every single glass of wine ourselves. The servers have no interaction with the guests about wine. So it's very, very hands on. We're always trying to give people what they're looking for. And if people are open minded, then we introduce them to something new. At Sorella, it's quite different being a restaurant with no Sommelier and a small list. So whenever I go over there and chat with the staff, I I always like to tell them that my goal is to make their job easier. So I'm always asking what they're looking for, what guests are asking for. Because we're in Northern California. Of course, we get a lot of drinkers who like napa CAB and Okey Shartenay's. So since we don't have those on the list, I I try to find Italian wines that, can satisfy those sorts of drinkers as well. Because at the end of the day, of course, we're all in the hospitality industry, and our goal is to make everybody happy even if they're not drinking the wines that we personally wanna drink. Thank you. And I think we have a question or yes. Yes. I have a question that is related to the way you taste for the guide. How important is the glass you use during this, negotiation? Do you try also different shapes? How do you consider this, as an element of your billions. It's a very good question. We use INA O glasses, which are fairly standard, as well as fairly they don't break as often. We tried doing our tastings with champagne with proper not champagne flutes, but proper champagne glasses and broke so many of them. It was not really a viable decision to do that. And we've tried other shapes. But we we are really running if we have three or three to five people at a tasting and we're running through thirty to forty wines at that tasting and then doing another one in the afternoon, we would just be smashing glasses constantly no matter what how careful we ever tried to be. So we find that these INA glasses are very useful and very strong. When we break them, we can just get another thirty six pack and keep keep the cycle going. But it would be optimal to be able to taste wine out of much more, you know, much more fragile glass. But it would be, in terms of our tasting process, it would be very difficult. Hey, great talk to you guys. Thank you very much. And a really interesting approach One of my questions would be, who is the main audience looking at? Okay. These are the these are the wines that wine and spirits magazine is recommending. And this is where I need to put them. Is it is it mostly buyers? Is it distributors? Who are the people? What we found is that because of our approach and because of the kinds of wines that we tend to recommend, the people who are most interested in our tasting results are the trade. So in order to create a sustainable model for our business, We, this year, really focused completely on the trade, cut back on our newsstand distribution, cut back on our other kinds of any kind of, pushed to get consumers to read the magazine and really focus on getting the magazine in the hands of Sommeliers and retailers. The website has a lot of consumers, but for, you know, and we have seventy eight or eighty thousand notes on the website now and two hundred and twenty thousand wine tasting wines reported that we tasted. So when we don't recommend a wine, we don't write a note about it. But we do list it on our website so that you can see that we tasted it and that it wasn't recommended by our panel. Hi. For the Salollier's it sounds like you've built up a lot of trust with your consumers. So when you do sell a wine to a table, what is the driving thing that you talk about? Is it style? Is it pairing or is it story or something else? For me, the number one thing is to ask questions. I think as a summary of my job is to translate what guests are trying to say and what they're asking for because wine language is, of course, very ambiguous and difficult to pin down. So for me, it's less about story in selling the wine. Once I've got the guest of wine that they like, then I might elaborate on the story and what's so special or unique about the wine. But to start, it's really just about getting on the same page, speaking the same language and finding something that we can relate to together. Similar to John Paulo. Generally, our first question is what do you like to drink at home? So education, it is extremely important in our group. We have weekly educational classes for our team so that they understand the broad scope of wine from two dollar grocery store wine to high end iconic, very expensive producers. So we tried to pull as many bottles for education as possible. When a consumer does note a wine or noted winery or style they like, we will know how to equate or translate that to what's on our list. So essentially what you're asking, it would be first style, right? Then concept. So it's never priced because our concept is derived by our price or our pricing is derived by the pricing of the concept or the food. And then story because then the story is the connection with the guests. So it goes in that order. Yeah. I feel similarly. It's more about, well, what do you drink? What do you like cabernet? You like pinot noir? You drink Old World. You drink New World, and then recommend from there. And then I also try to get arranged just to make it easier, get it out of the way. So I could recommend them the right thing, not offend them by going too high or too low. And then, yeah, the story depends on them. It, you know, it depends on their situation. Maybe they're enjoying their dinner together. They just want something easy. Maybe they don't wanna talk at all. And other times you can tell they really, really wanna talk and they wanna hear the entire story. So we really just read them and then decide from there and then give them exactly the experience that, you know, they're telling us they want, in other words. Okay. Let's give it up for Robin, June, Jampano, Josh, and Stephanie. And thank you, Claire for organizing this. I think it was an informative and very efficient session. Thank you so much. It was it was wonderful. Thank you. Listen to the Italian wine podcast wherever you get your podcasts. We're on SoundCloud, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, EmLIFM, and more. Don't forget to subscribe and rate the show. If you enjoy listening, please consider donating through Italian wine podcast dot com. Any amount helps cover equipment, production, and publication costs. Until next time, Chitching.