Ep. 147 Monty Waldin interviews Christopher Barnes (Grape Collective) | Italian Wine Personalities

Italian wine podcast. Chinching with Italian wine people. Hello. This is the Italian morning podcast. My guest today is Christopher Barnes. My guest today is Christopher Barnes of Grape Collection, which is in New York. Great name. Thank you, Monty. How did you get the name? How did you come about getting the name? I looked up all kinds of combinations of URLs that were available, and it seemed to kind of talk to what we were doing, which is getting a collective of writers who would be telling narrative stories around wine around the grape. So it kinda makes sense. Okay. Where did you found great collective? We founded grape collective four years ago. And what did you do before then? I was involved in a bunch of what I would call screwball media projects. So we To elaborate. I started a free daily newspaper in New York City called AM New York, which, eventually, we sold to the Tribune company. So free service was just funded by advertising within the within the newspaper. Exactly. So we produced about four hundred thousand copies a day, and people would get their daily news and not have to pay for it. I mean, that must have been a bit stressful. It was actually exhilarating. It was, it was tremendous fun. And you're shaking things up, you're going again against the the big guys and trying to do something new and different and working with people who are very passionate. So it was it was a great time. But did you see it still anybody's market share? Was anybody getting rid of bits of annoyed and grumpy with you and say, Hey, this guy, we don't like this little smart guy coming along and and breaking up kind of monopoly if you like. Of course. Yeah. So how do you handle that kind of pressure? Well, you take it as a compliment that You know, I don't really think of it as pressure. You know, I mean, it's, it's going to work. It's doing business. But if you're not shaking things up. If you're not competing, then if you're in that business, you're probably doing something wrong. So So where does the journalism gene come from in your body? Well, my dad was a foreign correspondent. So I he was with newsweek many, many years. And he worked for the times in London, and he worked for US news and world report, other places too. I think the LA Times. Did you ever think about another career apart from, obviously, your first big, big business was this, journalism new paper. Did you ever think of doing something else before then, or was it always your kind of destiny to get into that field? No. I was in the movie business for a few years. I did a film an English degree at the University of East Anglia in in Norwich in the UK. And I moved to Hollywood and worked behind the scenes on some movies. So So when you say behind the scenes, were you making the tea, or were you doing stuff? I was the assistant location manager on Sketch chart is two with, Jeff Fahey and Courtney Cox, which, if you've never seen it, is, is a cracker. And even better than that was, pumpkin head too, which, included, the former president's brother, Roger, Clint in as the mayor, and he played a song, which was quite terrific. So I was involved in that. I got a distribution credit on that one. But, some people say that it's better than pumpkinhead one. It's disputable. Yeah. I think the the, the film credits will be arguing about that one for many years to come. Many years. So so you sold your newspaper and you found a grape collective? Yeah. Grape collective. I was interested in doing a media project that was digital that didn't rely on subscriptions or advertising. And I thought wine was interesting because you had a media landscape that was sort of dominated by very traditional companies that had paywalls in terms of their their online presence. And I didn't feel we're catering to a younger audience. So they do a great job of focusing on kind of collectors and older wine aficionados, but they weren't focused on the sort of the younger consumer who's developing an interest in wine. And I thought there was a real up opportunity to create something for that audience. And at the same time, there's also a problem with wine journalism in the sense that if you read the New York Times wine column and you want to buy the wines that they write about, it's off and impossible. They're out of vintage or you can't get them or for whatever reason. So I thought it would be interesting to create a narrative focused online wine magazine with really great writers and then make the connection so people can then try the wine. So we're not finding a wine we wanna, we wanna sell and then getting somebody to write about it. But we're finding great writers who were excited about stories, and then we're bringing the wines in and making that connection. So you can you can read about something or watch a short video, and then try the wines. Okay. So when you talk about a narrative, is it just the classic, oh, you know, granddad founded the vineyard and then his son took over, and now his third generation is doing it, and he's gone organic, or whatever? Is it that kind of thing you talk about as a narrative? Was it a little bit more than that? Well, I think there are a lot of great stories in the wine world. And, you know, one of the problems is is when you walk into a wine shop, there is, you know, seven hundred bottles on the wall that have names that most people can't pronounce, and most of them have really compelling stories about them, but you just don't know what they are, and you don't know how to choose, and you don't know what you like. So there are these wonderful journalists who are out there who are constantly encountering interesting people and interesting subjects. And instead of kind of going through through the approach of giving it a numerical score, which I think is is a little bit dated in some respects, telling the story of these wines, and telling the the story of the passion of the winemakers in the area, in the families, and the traditions, and and some of it goes to the level of lee Shay that you talked about, but in many cases, you get really fascinating people that that are doing fascinating things. And we had Eric Texier and who's a a French natural winemaker and recently telling his story. And, you know, he's been doing it for a long time. And I think he took a lot of personal risks to make wine in a specific style that was that doesn't have the coolness that it does now. And that that's interesting. And and I think the wines are very interesting too. So you on your website, great. Dot com, as well as reading being able to read articles. You do like movies as well and and film stuff. Does that that dates obviously from your days in film? But how do you do that? Do you hire a camera crew with like six or seven people, sound engineers? Or what how do you how do you make these films? It's, it's gorilla filmmaking. Gorilla filmmaking. So we have, a couple of people that do video that we work with. I do some of the video as well, and we shoot very quick on a very tight schedule, but, I mean, the beautiful thing is that you have digital cameras right now that produce quality that, you know, you would have, a fifteen man team, you know, fifteen years ago doing that thing. And it's just it it's it's wonderful. Wonderful. Video. And and the thing that we're very excited about now is three sixty video. So you can take, a video of of a winemaker in his location, in his barrel room, in his vineyards, walking around, and cut, you know, a sixty second shot of that, splice it together, put an audio of him talking about it, and then put the goggles on, and you're literally there. You know, no one can replicate the experience of walking through a vineyard with a winemaker on a beautiful day in Tuscany, but how do you get close to that? And I think the three sixty stuff is really interesting right now. And, you know, you can, you put the goggles on, you experience the three sixty, you can feel soil samples, you can taste the wine, wine, and it brings you much closer to the wine and the winery than if you just walk into a shop and pick a bottle off a wall for sure. Yeah. I'd just say that, Chris and I, we did do some filming together, but I was last year in Tuscany, and you had a drone, if I remember. I think it meant a hit a very large Cyprus tree never to return to America again. When you talk about experiential, you have a wine shop in Manhattan. Right? Yes. We kind of call it a a wine studio. A wine studio. Okay. So talk about just give me a bit more about this sort because when when you came walking around Bruno over exam, you kept on stopping and picking up bits of dirt and putting them in a jar, like, what the hell is this guy doing? Why do you do that? Well, I think it's trying to get back to this idea that the wines come from a place. And when somebody's in our wines studio, they're able to look at a photography display around a specific wine. They're able to pick up soil from the wine. They're able to take an interview or an article about the wine and read about it. So we're trying to build a relationship with the person, with the place, with the story, which is, you know, transcends the the the normal experience of of purchasing in a wine store. We feel it's it creates an excitement and enjoyment. It it brings wine to life in people's lives. And, you know, with all the negativity in the world, if if you can create a little bit of joy, I think that's a good thing. Yeah. It's a great idea because, you know, traditionally, why merchants just if you're lucky, they may let you taste the wine, but that's not always a given. And the idea of you actually being able to to hold a piece of tuscany in your hand when you're in the middle of a built up city like New York. Pretty sure. I mean, do people do they actually pick up the jar? They actually wanna touch the sword? They don't say it's dirty or how they can go and wash their hands or they're, or they're actually just kind of pretty relaxed about it. Because we kinda think, you know, some people might be a bit. That's a bit icky. We have we have some pretty interesting soils. We, you know, Kimorigian limestone from, Sancer, and Chablis, and, Ruby, that that have the the fossils sticky out of them, and there's something kind of exciting about picking that up and and understanding that the bottle that you're about to drink comes from there. So, yeah, people love it. So tell us about the American wine market at the moment with particular reference to Italy. That sounds a bit like an exam question. But, in terms of, you know, what what is what are the hot wines among the New York songs from Italy, what's hot in California in terms of, in terms of Italian wine, what's going on? I mean, I think certainly Aetna is, an area that people are focusing on a lot. Volcanic wines was something that's become an area of interest. Barolo is the classic Bernelo is probably kind of second behind Barolo in terms of the classic. And then you have, I think, a lot of people who are super interested in native grapes and exploring, and, you know, like, Pagato from Legoria, which has this sort of very interesting Vermentino like quality, but it has a bit more salinity to it, maybe, and, you know, understanding the native grapes and where they're from. And I think there's definitely a lot more curiosity in wine and in consumers, especially younger consumers. And and if you're able to sell wines in the sort of, you know, call it fifteen to twenty five dollar range, that that are expressive of of native grapes and of different regions. People really embrace that. So if that's price point, is that an is that seen as an everyday wine, or is it a step up step above an everyday wine just for people that don't live, in in America. I would say fifteen to twenty or ten to twenty dollars is an everyday wine. When you go sort of twenty to twenty five, that's a wine that you might have on the weekend or something like that. But it it it's a wine that is in most people's price range when you'd start talking about Barolo or Bernelo. For most people, it becomes a special occasion wine. But, you know, if you're able to get, a pagatto for eighteen, nineteen dollars or something like that, then, you know, most people will take chance on it for sure. Okay. Final question, if you had to leave New York and had to come and live in Italy, which region would you choose and why? Boy, that's a tough one. Finally got him. Yeah. I I would have to, I would have to say probably Tuscany because I've been there the most, but I'm very excited to be traveling to, the Marquay region this summer because one of my very close friends, his family is from there. And, It's a beautiful area, it's unspots. It hasn't really on a main motorway track. So it's, got Italy's best white wine, great, Vadicchio. Fantastic seafood, lovely beaches. It's got every I work for the Vadicchio tourist board, basically, in a fifteen year contract. No, I'm joking. It's great wine. That's really great that you say that. I mean, most people would say they're either gonna say Piamonte or like brunaro Tuscany, that kind of thing, you know, lifestyle, or they're going to say Sisley for the volcanic stuff. It's great that you say Marquay. Fantastic. Oh, I'm a Marquay fan. Good guy. That's the reason I like you. Just just added another reason. Christopher Barnes from Great Collective in New York. Thanks very much for coming in. We're at school together. I know you for a long time. You're a great guy, and you're a super, super, super talented and professional journalist. Amazing. Thank you, Monty. Great to have you in. Thanks. Thank you, Mart. Follow Italian wine podcast on Facebook and Instagram.