Ep. 2244 Juliana Colangelo interviews Eduardo Dingler | Masterclass US Wine Market

Three key takeaways for this episode are number one. What is trending right now in wine in e commerce and Italian wine specifically? Number two, in a time period in this year, twenty twenty four, where we're seeing declines in wine consumption, How are e commerce players like wine access adapting and evolving to the market? And finally, what are some trends that we see on the horizon, and coming up in e commerce and and at wine access in twenty twenty five in Italian wine specifically? Hello. Welcome to Masterclass US wine market with me, your host, Juliana Colangelo. This show has been designed to demystify the US market for Italian wineries through interviews with experts in sales and distribution, social media, communications, and so much more. We will quiz each of our esteemed guests in every episode to solidify the lessons that we've learned from the episode to sharpen your pencils, get out your notebooks and join us this week to learn more about the US market. Hello. Welcome to Masterclass US wine market. Today, I am thrilled to welcome Eduardo Daimler to the Italian wine podcast. Eduardo is the VP of wine and wine acts dot com. Prior to wine access Eduardo was the global beverage director for the Morimoto Group for nearly a decade. He's also worked at some of Napa Valley's most iconic restaurants and as a professional wine, sake, and spirits judge, and journalist. Welcome to the show at Wardo. It's so great to have you here. Thanks, Juules. It's quite a quite a treat. Thanks for having me. Well, Wardo, you're you're a a mainstay at Italy and all the Italian wine events in San Francisco. So I'm sure many of our listeners, have them have had the pleasure, but meeting you. But for those of you who have it, tell us a little bit more about yourself and your journey into wine. Well, I was born and raised in Northern Mexico, in a in a city called Toron, and, and I ended up moving to Napa twenty five years ago. Nineteen ninety nine. One of the curious things that, inevitably and certainly, Brucely, correct, connected me with the wine world is that right outside of my hometown, it's the oldest winery in America in the continent. Called Casa Malero, and it's in this little oasis desert. Now there's about eight wineries there with some quality minded goals. And anyway, that always kind of connected me, with my grandpa making a little wine in the basement, sourcing grapes from there at, like, every other Northern Italian immigrant that moved around the world. They were finding a way to make wine. And, that was that was my intro. It was probably my mom says I was probably six months old when my grandpaster had given me wine with his finger when nobody was looking and that inevitably connected me to the wine world. When I moved to Napa in ninety nine, I started, I I go to school and such and then, started working in hospitality, and some of the the places that, have made a name for Napa like Trevigna, which is, was was a staple in the valley, Bistro and Giovanni and a a few other places before entering the, the world of Japanese culture and, and digging into Japan deeply. But Yeah. I joined wine access, just over six years ago and, had a an amazing time searching wines from all over the globe and a big emphasis on Italy and, telling the story. Amazing. What a great journey, and I love that story about you know, growing up outside of the oldest winery in the world. That's how cool is that. And I actually didn't know that that was in Mexico. So I think that's probably a fun fact for all of our listeners. Totally. Worth worth worth looking for it. Yeah. If you come across it, the wines are pretty confusing. Well, Eduardo, I'd love to talk more about Mexican wine, but today, we are gonna talk more next time, exactly. Today, we're gonna focus on this. We're wrapping up twenty twenty four. What's happening in wine right now and e commerce and what's happening around the holidays when our consumer is really gearing towards, I think the great thing about you and wine access is that you have that direct line to the consumer. So we can get gain some really valuable insights. So our three key takeaways for this episode are number one. What is trending right now in wine in e commerce in Italian wine specifically? Number two, in a time period in this year, twenty twenty four, where we're seeing declines in wine consumption, How are e commerce players like wine access adapting and evolving to the market? And finally, what are some trends that we see on the horizon, and coming up in e commerce and and at wine access in twenty twenty five in Italian wine specifically? So for starters, just and, well, if you can tell our listeners a little bit more about WIN Access, who are they? What do you do? What kind of wines do you sell? Just a little snapshot of what WIN Access is. Absolutely. In a few words, one access started, just over twenty years ago, and it has evolved and grown into, avoid a curated voice if you if you will of sorts, in the world of wine and and beverage overall What we do is, we have a three main, sources or outlets, if you will. We have our our daily offer business in which we take a lot of, we take an allocation of a wine, and we tell the story, with deep content, often, some video content, social media, all those different things, and, really, conveyed to our members, a wine that we're fascinated by and why. And, the other outlet is has grown over the years. It's very strong is the wine clubs. We have, over twelve wine clubs, in which we're able to showcase wines with, a theme, whether it's, from different parts of the world or specific to some areas. We have a Champaign Club. We have, some partnerships with, Mission Star and, fifty best restaurants and with James Beard. We have partnerships with the Cancer Magazine with, sunset magazine with a few different ones. And the clubs have definitely, gained, an an entryway to a lot of our members, to wines that they otherwise wouldn't have come across. We do this with, again, with a video content and a strong narrative. And the other outlet is the online store, which, we're very cognizant of, producers, price ranges, regions, and, we, try to offer a wide range of wines, with a story as well. And that's basically how we, how we operate. We have a a type with very strong team of, of very, enthusiastic wine wine, drinkers and eager to pass the voice around. Amazing. So you're you're doing a lot of different things, and it sounds like the companies evolved quite a lot, in in the twenty years that it's it's been around. And And especially since you joined it between the offers, the wine plugs, and then, you know, the e commerce shop. So it seems like you have a lot of different touch points at which you are getting wines to your consumers. Totally. Yeah. We try to, obviously, we have a big focus and some of our our strongest following is with seasoned wine drinkers, collectors. People have been enjoying wines for decades, but also we are seeing, a great entryway into new newcomers to the wine world, people that are just beginning their journey, and they're fascinated, they're intrigued. And also they don't wanna they don't wanna we don't wanna, like, put a cue to wall against wine and make it, elegantists or or hard to come across. So we try to tell the story, make bring it to a level of understanding, and also just make it fun to be around. Yeah. That's fantastic. So, Eduardo, now that we know a little more about wine access, can you tell us a little bit more about what's trending in Italian wine right now at wine access? Well, as you would imagine, some of the the big, areas and producers are always king, talk about Barolo and Bernelo and such. However, we are seeing an act when we're loved being part of this narrative of of small producers of, indigenous grapes and to different corners of Italy, I mean, as we know, Italy is such a vast country with a lot of, ever growing, excitement to grapes and, and, very proud regions. So Frulli has had a huge impact in the last few months, also Piamonte Campania. We we're seeing a strong following in Lambrusco. Actually, as a matter of fact, today, we're we're launched an offer on Lambrusco, but also Sicily, there's so much, so much, energy going around this regions that Italy has become a huge component of our our platform. That's really exciting to hear. I especially love hearing about the Lambrisco. That that's that's fantastic. Absolutely. We're you and I are big fans, you know. Of course. So, you know, it sits it's really ranging then. It sounds like from more entry level price point wines, like, Aleprosco, Cecilia wines, and then some of some of those classics Are you seeing any differences? Like, are people buying a certain type of wine more through the wine club versus the shop, or is it kinda consistent across the three different channels that you you sell through? You know, it's it's sort of follows an evolution. A lot a good amount of our members sign up for a club and, and they're eager to learn about something they don't usually put their money in and know. So they get introduced to certain wines, let's say, and then, eventually, over a couple of months, we're able to offer a wine like that in our to our main audience, and then we see a response to that. So there is sort of like a graduation between them, also the the store, since we have these ranges of lines and styles with a strong content, people are able to explore that way. And buy one or two bottles and then get really hooked on it and get cases and and keep growing their fascination for for the Italian wine world. Right. That makes sense. And you mentioned, you know, you're looking at both the classics as well as smaller producers emerging regions, but Edwardardo, when, you know, you are looking for wines that you're gonna offer through wine access, especially for Italy, like, what's really top of mind for you as as a buyer of this category? Well, that's that always depends. Obviously, because of our different outlets, we're looking for different things, but we are always, looking for, brunellos from established houses, which, obviously, those are a a sure bet with with our more, seasoned audience. But small, little off the beaten path producers, let's say, Alianiko from, Valtura or something like that. We are fascinated by those wines because they they definitely allow us to keep going as an authority in wine and introducing people to to different areas, and be like, wow. Well, I've never heard of that. Let me give it a try. And once they do, they're like, wow. There is a lot to go a lot going on in the class. Absolutely. So Edward, now that we've spoken a little bit more about Italian wine specifically and what's happening at wine access, let's talk a little bit more generally. You know, we know we've seen declines in consumption overall in wine in twenty twenty four. And for the last few years, How are you all at wine access evolving to this change in consumer preference when it comes to wine? And and what are you seeing as it relates to consumption? You know, the narrative certainly keeps going that way. Luckily, we have seen in spite of, yeah, the the handful of of members that kind of where it lapsed and we reached out and they said, well, unfortunately, I do have too much wine on my salary, or I'm not drinking this much, which just does happen but, notice often as, as you would think. But, we are seeing people still playing, playing, playing the game and, on premure, for instance, for bordeaux, was a huge success for us. And if you think about the narrative of people saying we just we have too much wine and we're drinking less. And then selling a lot of wine on a on a wine from Bordeaux that's not gonna be ready for two, three years. That is a very hopeful kind of insight into it. And then we're doing these campaigns as well of wines that are not read already in the country and people kind of really supporting those offers and wines that are onboarding in two, three, four months per se. So that has been pretty pretty it's a breath of fresh air in many ways, and also a very curious audience, whether it's like, an older season, crowd of drinkers or, a younger generation, just looking for content. And one thing that I think it's very important, in our industry, it's the storytelling. And it's also, we know this next generations, I see it with my my kids and stuff. They're they're more about traveling, and they're about experiences, and really get into no areas. So wine does that in in many ways, as you know, it just really transports you to a a place, whether you visited or want to visit, when you have a glass of wine in front of you and it's unique and different, that's the best way to to showcase rather than just having a general basic any kind of wine that could be red or white from whatever, just those wines that really rock through your your world and and bringing you somewhere. And therefore, when when our members or audience are enjoying that wine with their friends or family, they're able to tell those stories. I think that's super important. It's a social currency that's that's pretty unique to the beverage world. Yeah. Absolutely. I think experience is definitely a buzz word that we hear quite a lot when it comes to the younger consumer and and how we can connect them, you know, to wine in a more engaging way. Considering that wine access is primarily, you know, a digital platform and a website, how are you building experience in how you are offering the wines that you're selling for for consumers? Well, investing heavily into the content, with the team of writers and us putting a lot of, content and and structure and fabric into our offers. Like, a lot of the wines that we come across are based on our experiences. Let's say, visiting, I don't know, Florence and coming across this one wine at, you know, take a pintoria or something like that, that that you've never heard of. Right? And then bringing that story back and collecting, securing an allocation of the wine, and being able to tell stories like that really connects the dot, And also, we do in occasion, in person tastings with, various restaurants across the US, for instance, we did an event with, Thomas Keller, a per se, we did one at the Addison in San Diego and places like that where a small audience gets to come and and visit and hear the stories firsthand and try the wines with with their favorite restaurants dishes and such. I think that's that's the best way for us to connect with, directly and physically with their customers. So also taking the experience offline and bringing it in person through some of these really unique and special events has been a way to connect with the audience. Totally. Totally. Yeah. And super important. And you gain a loyal, long term audience with those things. Very, very cool. Are you doing those in collaboration with Wedneakers and producers ever or typically more with restaurants? Like, what's the format? You know, historically, it does have been more with a restaurant with the chef, with Desomeli. However, we have done some, events more specific with producers like, Saskia, Rochelle, and did an event with us. We invited in a small group twenty or so people between loyal customers and media. We've done some with Margot, mostly, like, on the on the Bordeaux side. But was to say we we can't bring a producer from from Italy and and do a an event like that. We've done them in in New York, LA and San Francisco with great success. Yeah. Absolutely. Very cool. That's that's something very good to think about. And I think for listeners and and any partners, you know, be thinking about your your partners in, in terms of marketing and and events that you can do to get your product closer to the consumer and create some of these experiences. So how about the holidays? You know, it's December thirteenth. So we're just a couple weeks out from Christmas and everyone's doing their holiday shopping. What are you guys seeing at wine access for holiday wines? What are people buying? You're seeing some crazy spikes and what's going on with Italian? We are. We've we've seen a a huge spike as as kind of expected for the season as you know, but we are seeing a huge, movement in the sparkling world, not only Champagne, which is a given, and it's a very, very celebratory thing, but also, as we said, like, Lambrusco, another sparkling wines from around the the world. Prosecco being a big one as well. People are are are are are kind of rushing through those areas, but also, big hard hardy wines, amarone, for instance, and some other, wines from, like, Pemonte, like, we've done some great success campaigns with Pela Verga recently, and also, like, grignolino and things like that that, are not super well known, but once people try them and they're like, whoa, Well, this this dish can go amazing with the ham, with the turkey, with cranberry sauce. And then when you start leaning more into, like, the the Hanukkah and Christmas dishes, these are aces under the sleeve, and also, they're their pieces in in the middle of the table that evoke conversation and and again, they kinda take you to a different place. So you're so you're seeing some some interest in these discovery wines, which is exciting. You're seeing more people leaning towards that for the holidays. Yeah. And quite frankly, I mean, we find that super, engaging for us, and and it's very exciting when people are are willing to venture out, grab a machete and go through the the jungle of the Amazon of wine and and try new things rather than just saying, well, I know the name I'm, I'm, like, Marolo or Sancerre or such. It's like, oh, cool. There's something else over there. Let's see what it is and let's try. Very cool. How about you Eduardo personally? What are some favorite Italian wine holiday holiday wines that you're planning to open this season? Well, where do we begin? I I love Francacorta and Altelaida. I think those wines over deliver for for the price for the the story that are being told. I also love, Campania, some of the the Falangina, Fiano, and Sacele, I always lay my head in Sicily some Aetna, it narrows those some contras, things like that. And actually, a little bit of market too, some ridiculous that are definitely, I mean, great to start a gathering, and in the middle, yeah. Some some of those mines definitely, always living in her in her cellar and always ready to go for the holidays. Nice range there. Very nice. Yes. We try. So moving beyond the holidays and, you know, looking ahead to next year, what are you seeing as some potential new trends at wine access just in general, not just in Italian wine, but overall, like, what are what are some of your expectations for next year in terms of what is gonna be a hot category, a hot wine, just just any any thoughts with your your crystal ball gaze for them a year ahead. That that's a great question. I mean, we continue to, see a trend and and for see a trend in a grower producer champagne. We're definitely very invested in the category. Also, I mean, speaking of of, Italy, some, some areas like Orvieto, places like that. Very hopeful. We'll see a little light light in the sun for the next year. At least we'll do her part in in telling that story. Some of the coastal wines of Sardinia, for instance, I think can definitely, have an impact. And even Corsica, we started to to line up some wines from there for on coming clubs, and, majorca, when you're speaking about, Spanish wines, And, I do think, however, Napacab is still gonna be a huge player. In spite of all the the narrative that keeps going around, I think it's still gonna have a very strong photo on the on the industry. Okay. So some more emerging regions or Vieto, you mentioned, some island wines as it relates to places like majorca, where people might be traveling, and then a a classic napa cap, something that's just, you know, it's like a little black dress doesn't go out of style. So ever reliable. And and just don't forget sake because I think sake's still seeing a huge renaissance. Yeah. You know, I read something a a headline I saw that sake. We'll see more sake kinda going mainstream and outside of Japanese cuisine. What do you think about that? Oh, I I think it's inevitable. It's already happening across the the world. And I think in the US, somebody is and and consumers are starting to see that demand and grabbing it and running with it because it's, I mean, sake belongs in the in the table just like wine does. And I always talk about Italian wine and Sakas as a kind of a thing to learn, because if you think about it in a few decades ago, when Italian restaurants started popping up across the US in the landscape, Italian wine came up with it. Right? There was the Fiasco. There was Cantis, all these wines. And then Italian wine did the leap where it wasn't only served at Italian restaurants, but all of a sudden, steak houses, French restaurants, all these other places, they're like, whoa, well, why wouldn't we have an Italian wine? And now places across the the use the United States with celebrated wine list. They have a strong representation of Italy. So I'm very hopeful that sake will kind of follow that footsteps. Very cool. So just seeing it proliferate you know, across different cuisines. What are some pairings that you think? I mean, I know there's such a range of sake, of course, but maybe some of the more classic sake styles or if you can name some of the more classic sake and some favorite parents that you will, with with a Jun Maginjoganshu, for instance, that's usually a floral, undiluted kind of style of sake, you can do some great, just classic tacos. To street food. You can do Indian food, Thai, puddles. So one of my all time favorite pairings, and actually this happened again three days ago. We went to a pizza. We went to this pretty cool place, and, just it was a larger group. And we just did some classic pizzas. Right? We did, like, the, prosciutto and arugula. We did some, Margarita. We did some, fungi, and I brought a few bottles to sake. And a good amount of this group had never had sake before, which I was baffled to start. But once they tried it with pizza, I mean, those bottles disappeared before any Brunllo on the table did, which is to me pretty cool to see. So pizza had sake, one of my favorite all time pairings, was a, caciopepe with an older age sake, which was just incredibly delicious. So, yeah, I mean, the the possibilities are pretty endless. Very cool. Well, I'm excited to see more sake in menus, and I I wanna try it with pizza now. That sounds delicious. Well, Eduardo, thank you so much for joining us today. As we wind down in today's episode, we'll do our rapid fire quiz that we do at the end of every episode here. Please do your best if you can to answer these questions in just one or two sentences. So number one, what is your number one tip for mastering the US point of view? I would say, don't forget the story. Don't forget the the storytelling, the, the texture in in a wine or or any beverage you're you're excited about or promoting, sometimes it's not just the price. It's not the price. It's not the region. It's actually why is this wine better and why you should be drinking it. Yes. Absolutely. That's a great reminder. What is something you might have told your younger professional self if you've been in this industry quite a while about selling wine in the US? Oh, man. I I think something I well, that's a that's a good question. I would probably say spend more time learning about other regions rather than being focused on some of the major ones. Early on. I mean, this is something that I have found very fascinating the last decade or so, but I think talking about twenty years ago when I was a young server, I would have I would have totally said that. Spend more time going off the beaten path and and just just meeting producers and visiting places that are not your your average mainstream. I like that. That's great advice. And finally, we all travel a lot in this Street, and especially you and Moreno, you're always off to somewhere great. What is one of your favorite travel hacks or travel tips? Oh, man. I I mean, I am a creature of habit. I have my places. I have my favorite Lamperdotto place in in Florence. I have my favorite place in in Paris and all this place, but one of my favorite travel hacks is always spend some time just going into a a different spot. And it doesn't have to be super fancy or or very street foodie. Just go to a place that You haven't read about it. Nobody's told you about. Just go in and step in, random places. Do a walk in, do a, just enjoy it. Life. I mean, at least for me, note everything's always planned. I like to keep some open open windows of time and getting lost and finding new places, whether it's a wine bar or, a little eatery or something like that, you will be so amazed of the things you can learn to people you can meet at this place. Yeah. I love that. Yeah. Leave some time for spontaneity, not everything needs to be, you know, on on the agenda, so to speak. So that's great advice. Well, Eduardo, thank you again so much for being here today. How can our listeners connect with you? You can find me, I mean, one of the the easiest one is social media, Instagram is Edio, d I n g l e r, Edo Dingler, and we can share some some info that way. You can find me a a a the wine access website and Eduardo at wine access dot com. But, yeah, I mean, I mean, I'm always on the road and, hoping to to talk to more people and, spending more time in Italy even more so than than normal and thrilled to be on on your podcast. Very, very cool. Thanks for your time. Absolutely. Thank you again, Eduardo. It was great to have you here. Thank you for joining me today. Stay tuned each week for new episodes of Master Class US wine market with me, Juliana Colangelo. Or remember, if you've enjoyed today's show, hit the like and follow button wherever you get your podcast.