Ep. 614 Melanie Ofenloch | Get US Market Ready With Italian Wine People

Thanks for tuning into my new show, get US market ready with Italian wine people. I'm Steve Ray, author of the book how to get US market ready. And in my previous podcast, I shared some of the lessons I've learned from thirty years in the wine and spirits business helping brands enter and grow in the US market. This series will be dedicated to the personalities who have been working in the Italian wine sector in the US, their experiences, challenges, and personal stories. I'll uncover the roads that they walked shedding light on current trends, business strategies, and their unique brands. So thanks for listening in, and let's get to the interview. Before the show, here's the shout out to our new sponsor, Feroine. Feroine has been the largest wine show in Italy since nineteen twenty. They have generously supplied us with our new t shirt, Would you like one? Just donate fifty euros and it's all yours. Plus, we'll throw in our new book jumbo shrimp guide to international grape varieties in Italy. For more info, go to Italian wine podcast dot com and click donate or check out Italian wine podcast on Instagram. Welcome. This is Steve Ray, and welcome to this week's edition of Get US Market Ready with Italian wine people. Today, I'm pleased to have as a guest Melanie oftenlock who I was surprised to meet on a trip once in Italy to find out that she was the Dallas wine check blogger that I had been reading for a couple of years, and I never put two and two together until we kind of met in person. And it was, oh, you're Dallas wine check. Which was kind of a fun thing. Anyway, Melanie, welcome to the show. And, tell us a little bit about yourself and what you do and why you do what you do. Absolutely. Well, that that's so flattering, Steve. I I was thrilled to meet you too after communicating for so long virtually. My I have been blogging for gosh about twelve years now. I am not a, paid one person in any capacity. I I've been running my own marketing consulting firm, actually working with tech companies, and I'm the acting chief marketing officer for a company by the name of icon science. So wine really has been a passion and a love. And a lot of times, a weekend thing where I actually write the blog and and get it out. And, you know, it's something that I wanna make sure that that I continue to to tell my story of wine, which is as you know, the story of of so many others as as I've learned my way through the process. Twelve years ago, what made you start to write a wine blog and what was your level of wine interest and knowledge? Can't even count back twelve years ago. Was that, like, two thousand and nine? Yes. Two thousand and nine. Well, we're twenty we're twenty twenty one. So, you know, honestly, it was really working for for someone early in my career that that I called sleepy Ed, and sleepy Ed would sit in his corner office and he would read the Wall Street Journal. And none of us who were working with him actually knew what he did I I still don't know what you did to this day. And, you know, all of these social media platforms and and new things were coming down the pike, and here I sat working for a large PR conglomerate and I had a chance of becoming sleepy Ed in my corner office if I didn't learn, you know, Twitter and, you know, to a lesser extent Facebook and all the other things that we're really gonna change the way that we communicate And so I got on Twitter, and I was the generic Melanie zero. I started talking about marketing, and I looked back about forty five days later and the people that followed me was forty something of them. They all reported directly either into me or into one of my direct reports. You know, there was there was nothing social about that. There was nothing that that was, you know, representative of what social media was about. So I I decided it was time to pivot and I started talking about wine. And I told my husband and I have no idea where this number came from. That I I had to hit, I think, it was sixteen hundred followers. And somehow I did. And I found this engaged wine community and decided that I'd started vlog right around. I think it was my very first wine blogger's conference, which was in, Washington back in, gosh, twenty ten. And that's how about how the train got rolling. And what was your level of wine knowledge? At the time. Why why? You know, I was very enthusiastic. We went to a lot of my husband, and I went to a lot of tastings and a lot of, you know, different events to try to learn more. I you know, I'm not an expert. I'm still not an expert. Twelve years later. I I just have developed that passion. Okay. I'm gonna push you on this. Why wine? You can never know enough. And I love the challenge. Every time that that I learn something or I feel like I have accomplished learning of a certain region or a certain variety or, you know, certain terroir. I find out their A hundred more things or a thousand more things that I have to learn, and I know nothing. And I love that. Yeah. And it's all it's all stories. Okay. So you started twelve years ago. Now you're in it three months, six months, nine months, a year, two years. At some point in that time period, you must have thought, wow, how long am I gonna keep this thing up? Yes. You know, there there are times where you wonder, does anybody read it? Does does all of this work? Will it make an impact? Cause you, you know, it takes a lot of work. I know people think it's if they don't know. Oh, she's just running around going on trips, having a fantastic time, and you know, a lot of times you're, you know, you're working harder than you may work because you may have a nineteen hour day where you're expected to figure out time zones and you're figured, you know, expected to figure out how to get back to the hotel and get something posted because that's the expectation of the people that are hosting you. And and then, oh, yeah, you have this job that you have to, check-in on and make sure that everything is still going as well. So you know, there are times where I get off a plane and and my husband just looks to me, he's like, but you're on a fun wine trip. Right. But I don't think we're gonna get any sympathy for working nineteen hours a day on wine trip when we're going to, like, three wineries a day and meeting some of the most interesting people in the world and drinking the most interesting wines, seeing the most interesting and beautiful places and having wonderful food and conversation. Absolutely not. So we're we're not gonna ask for that. But but you kept going. So now it's twelve years later, and the the really very few people who have done what you've done. I mean, I was involved with the blog bloggers conference from the very beginning and am a dog or myself, but not to the extent that you are doing much more of the business of of wine. But you've kept at it for all this time. How do you keep yourself motivated? You know, it's just it's something that I have to do by, Sunday at midnight. And a lot of times, it's a Saturday, Sunday project. Obviously, I I have my interviews and my stories done or at least written down of what I wanna talk about long before that, but it really is a passion. You know, whether I when I used to have my global job before I started my consulting business, and I was on plane for, in some cases, you know, fifteen, sixteen hours trying to get to the the destination and where I needed to be, it it brought me joy to unplug and to write about why. Okay. So how much time do you think you have to spend to do a blog post from the beginning of, you know, focusing on that one? Prepping, outlining, writing, and then posting. Gosh. It takes a lot of time. I I'd say eight to twelve hours at a minimum. If you're really diving in, by the time you do your interview, you taste the wines, you take your notes, you do your research, and I'm probably being conservative. Okay. I I certainly believe that because I know how long it takes to prep and and do this whole podcast. But so you talked about tasting. So is it is is the what what is the focus of the blog. Is it about tasting wines and your discovery of learning, about wines? Or It's really about the story of wine, and the story of the people behind the wine. You know, there's so many places that you can go to get a rating or to get an opinion. You know, I have certainly had my opinion. You've known me for a long time, Steve, but there are some people that that want me to tell them, you know, what what is a good bread. And and I'm happy to do those review columns a couple times a year. But I'm not gonna rate wines. I'm not a wine expert. You know, wine is a lot like art, and you may, you know, love a piece of art on your wall. Some people don't know why they like it. They just know they like it. And, you know, wine for a lot of people is is seen in the same way as hard as a good line is one that you like, a bad one is one that you don't no matter what anybody tells you. Right? Right. I like that because, you know, one of the things that we see on these trips and everything else is this vocabulary that comes with it of, you know, hints of this and, after notes of this, you know, fried gooseberries and chopped walnut shells and smoked pineapple husks and, you know, I never heard of any of those things. And they don't mean anything to me. I mean, am I I've said this before. My philosophy of what people wanna know about wine is what does it taste like in words I understand and will it go with what I'm having for dinner tonight? Those two things. For the most part, now those who wanna go deeper into the story behind the wine may be more interested in maybe just a couple of factoids as opposed to the in-depth lectures that, we get to and I say get to go to have the pleasure of going to where they go deep into soil characteristics and glaciation and prevailing winds and weather patterns and, you know, all that kind of stuff. When you do your notes and when you do your evaluations, what kind of vocabulary do you use? I've tried to keep it, more simplistic than on the upper end. There there are some words that weave your your way into the vocabulary, but I probably use a little more consistently than I should, because it's the first thing that associates when I try it. Right? Which is usually gonna be acid tendons and, you know, fruit on the nose. Right? Yep. Exactly. Exactly. But, you know, I I tried. I, you know, I have I have one of the, the great tasting kits that have all the different vials that you can smell. Cool. And you use that as a as a way to codify what you're, doing? Sometimes. I I'd say I I I would like to be more disciplined about it. But I do try to take that out regularly and and, you know, smell it and and try to reequate my sent my senses with with some new things, especially if I'm drinking a wine, I haven't had in a while. So when you're tasting a wine, what are you looking for? Obviously, do I like it? Do I not like it? You're gonna be writing about it. You're gonna be sharing some information with other people. What are the things that you look for and want to, you know, the categories that you wanna tell people about, well, this one is this, sir? I mean, you're I think you're always looking for balance, right? You're you're always looking for what is this a representation of what this wine is supposed to be based upon the region that it's from? I'm I'm looking a lot of times for regions I don't know much about. Like, I I got to taste, some Armenian wine earlier this year, and that was a really cool discovery for me because I hadn't had it. I really didn't know much about the region, and it's one of the oldest wine regions. And, you know, that was, like, it was one of my a moments. And I really enjoy, you know, the journey of finding finding new things that I know nothing about. So talk about what, places you've been either in in real life that you've actually had the chance to visit and those that you've explored in in your own, pursuit of wine knowledge. Start with the places you've been because that's where we met. Yeah. Let's see. Well, I've been several places in Italy, include including in Italy, which is if if you haven't either seen or experienced in Italy, it is the I think the second largest trade show of wine out there. It's it's No. Actually, I think it's the largest. The largest now. Yeah. Good. Good. Yeah. And you can you can tell just because it takes you about an hour and a half to get from building one to building fifteen. Yes. It it is football fields of wine. You know, I I've obviously been there. I've I've been to Tuscany. I've I've been to, Trento. I've been to four or five different regions in Spain. I've been to oh gosh. Now I'm having a senior moment. To, I think all of the wine regions in the US. Next on my my list, at at the very top is gonna be Croatia. Yeah. That's, kinda sitting out there for me as well. A funny story. Talking about people reading you and and you not knowing that they're reading you or, one day I came home and there was a package, UPS package, and it was a a a whole sampler of rieslings and cabs from Croatia. There was a guy who was thinking about introducing a product to the US. He had heard one of my presentations where I said I really love riesling, and not only does was he doing the Did they make rieslings? And he sent them to me. And I thought, wow. How cool is that? Like, either stalkers or lurkers, which is a nice way, to say about it. But I think back to your point, there's a whole bunch of people who you're making an impact on that, you know, don't get any reaction from. But when it does come up, they'll all often say something and they'll say, yeah, you know, I read I read what you wrote. What? Really? There's somebody out there who's reading it. So you're having an impact. Have you had much feedback from your listeners like that? You know, I have the, I think the funniest moment was, I was in a a whole foods in in Dallas and someone walked up to me and said, are you, wait, are you the Dallas wine chicken? My fourteen year old was like, who is that? I'm like, I don't know. And she's like, how does the person know you, mom? That's so weird. She was not amused. It was funny. What are the areas in Italy? So you've been to a couple. I think we were both on the trip to Trento Doc, which was a sign of change to me because of of the altitude that they grow the grapes at. It's up at about three thousand feet, thousand meters or so. And the aging, for, like, eight, nine years, as opposed to two or three that many other sparkling line regions too. But what other, regions in Italy are you interested in, are discovering? Oh, gosh. You know what? There's been I have gotten this year so many zoom tastings in different regions of of Italy. I I have to say I there there's so many small places. If you give me a minute, I can I can go back to my blog and tell you what I did, but I I am so impressed? You know, lots, lots of places that are near water by the ocean have this interesting terroir, lots of families, that needed to get the the word on the street out about the wineries because they obviously couldn't get it to the US, and they needed us to write about it to make sure that they remained afloat. You know, just really, really cool, you know, places. And and give me a moment, and I'll I'll tell you one of the ones that really stuck out to me that I am I am bound and determined I'm gonna get on a plane and and go to when when we're allowed to roam down the country again because it was just it was such a cool experience or peniel. Let's see. Kapunya in Montatva Cioni? The wines that are down there are, I believe, like Alianico, Taurasi, Cota Duvulpe. Is that is that what you're talking about? Let's see. This was Fino g Avalino, Tarosi, and Grego De Tufo. Grego De Tufo and Fiano Davilino. Yeah. We actually used to import Master Baradino, which I think is imported now by Taub family selections. And have you ever been to Pompe? I have not. It was on my list to go to last year. Yeah. Well, that worked out for you. Yeah. You know, I I I pretty much didn't go, not far beyond the store last year. I mentioned it because the Master Veradino family goes back really all hundreds and hundreds of years and maybe even more than hundreds. But they have planted or replanted a vineyard in the Pompe historical zone of wines that were grown there and are making wines like the Romans and Bob, you know, the Romans in Pompeii drank when they were there, which is totally awesome. And I think you can get some of it here in the US. I'll look into that for you, but What a wonderful story. So not only do you get to see Pompeii. The beauty of that is you get to see it as people, you know, as it was with all the, you know, artwork on the walls, and they have the wine shop on every corner with the holes dug out and the where the amphora would sit and people would walk by and just get a dipper full of of wine. And now Master's making that wine with many of those grapes that you just mentioned, go to Volpe and and so forth. And and laguna is really another another find this year. I was really, really impressed by the the the sparklings and and the stills that that I got to try. I even got to try red, which was pretty amazing. Ligana? Oh, I think I think you said laguna? I thought I thought it might be my southern accent. Yeah. Quickly, to be honest. Yeah. From the other, other side of, Lake Garda from, Nevada. Correct. So one of the other things you had made a point when we were originally having a conversation is, the impact that the Black Lives Matter Movement and the George Floyd case had on you and recognition of, I guess, the keyword these days is equity and diversity and and how that's impacted what you're writing about. Absolutely. Well, when George Floyd happens, I made a personal pledge that I was going to not only write more about black winemakers, but but try to, incorporate them more into my stories, that were more general in nature, whereas, you know, as a journalist, sometimes you just go to your your ongoing sources and, ask the same people because you know they'll respond, you know, it'll be timely. And I have been well rewarded with with branching out and and getting some amazing amazing new people in my contact list. And, you know, it's just it's been something that we as writers have to make sure that we hold ourselves accountable. We hold others accountable. And, you know, there's there's a big movement right now. In in the wine industry with with, you know, giving a voice to people that haven't had it in a long time, whether that be, in diversity, whether that be, the me too movement, And it really is is time for people to be accountable and to step up and to stop hiding, you know, behind this cloak of secrecy and to do the right thing. But the reality of the situation is most of the people in the wine industry are clocation just because of the history of Europe, in in the United States. So it's one thing to recognize that it's another thing I think to advocate for it. One of the things, I was pleased to see the other day Diageo just set up a fund for call them diversity based businesses in the wine and spirits industry. And at the same point you made, which is the recognition, and more than the recognition, is empowering them and funding them, to be able to get in and and participate, which you're right. And I think you know, that applies not just to, color of your skin, but it also happens to sexual orientation. It has to gender alone and, all kinds of other things. You had mentioned one thing I thought was really great. I was probing in our original conversation about this blog that stories can change you. And, you had mentioned Chapellet. And, can you talk about that? Absolutely. So I had the opportunity, to to meet with Cyral Chapel a a couple of years ago, and it was at a point that I was thinking about leaving the the corporate world and, starting my own consulting firm or or doing something else. So we had a one on one lunch and you know, talked about the plans for the winery and, you know, was just a really engaging, great guy. And somehow I looked down at my watch. We had been there close to three hours. I was disclosing to him, my desire to to leave the corporation where I headed up marketing and, you know, what I was gonna do next and getting his advice and just really found this amazing connection with him where he gave me, you know, some some advice on on how to handle it and what to do and, just some really sage advice on the next step for making this decision. And I'm eternally grateful to him. I I have told him this when we've run into each other again, but I don't know if he knows the impacts, that that he had on me personally. And I was just there to to write the story about Chapel a. Oh, great. Okay. So there's a, shift gears a little bit and and put your marketing hat back on because that's where you really live. And give me some comments on what you see as the the the the state of effectiveness and sophistication of marketing as practiced in, wine industry in the United States. And then after that, maybe we can talk about, e commerce. But, but start with generally your perspective from a tech point of view on how the wine industry operates. I think with the pandemic, people realized that they had to do some upgrading if they were gonna survive. Historically, the wine industry has been very behind in using marketing as a tool to retain customers the way that I think any other industry, would do so. That was very politely stated. Yeah. There's a lot of fear. Right? They they don't a lot of of winemakers are farmers. They don't understand technology, but you you see the power when it's done well. And when the right customers are targeted with the right messages, it does lead to revenue. And clearly, I am a big fan of, of of marketing. It's what I do. I've, you know, live and die by the ROI, and I wish that marketers would, would be incorporated more into winery to I personally am seeing a lot more of it. And I think a lot of it is being driven by, e commerce and the need to pivot, if you will, from the traditional ways of doing things to electronic ways of doing things. And along with that comes the advance in technology in CRM customer relationship management, customer acquisition type programs, who's in control of the relationship between the customer and the brand. Often, it's the retailer, but we've got all these third party elements coming in, which are changing, the equation a little bit. So I've heard people say, you know, we've come ten years in ten months. Well, that was back about six months ago when the pandemic was, before we had the vaccines. But the problem is I was just listening to a podcast today about it from Avalara and Silicon Valley Bank is because the regulatory issues surrounding the beverage alcohol industry three and fifty two different regulatory entities controlling it. It's very difficult to apply technology that is universally applicable in a market that has fifty two different flavors. Right. Absolutely. And and, you know, there's so much confusion, just just moving from from place to place. I, you know, I told a story today on my blog about meeting with with Remy Cohen, who's the new CEO for for domain canaris. And we met at a seafood restaurant where we were going to taste wines from from her old position, which was supposed to be paired with oysters. And when Texas, you can't bring any wines in that are not on the list. And so we had oysters and cabernet instead. Okay. How was it? You know, it was not as bad as you would think. It's a great story and for that's how we became, our friendship started. So Well, let me turn that around. Okay. So if you had your druthers, what would you drink with oysters? Oh, gosh. I a lovely chablis or Montersche or a great champagne. So many great things to drink with oysters. Have you had musk a day in oysters? I have. That's another great choice. Yeah. It's it's it's one of those spectacular things that when when is one of the things that that that just go together I I found that in Greece too, a Surgical from Santorini with lobster. That's been freshly, fished out and beaten on Iraq. It just just kinda remarkable pairing of things that, grow together, go together. That's kind of the way to think about it. Totally afraid. So let's bring us to a close and and talk about, I had mentioned that I'd like to end with what's the one big takeaway. If people are listening to this who maybe aren't telling me who they are or you, is there anything they can apply from what you've learned or talked about, learned about by doing your blog, or talked about in in today's conversation that they they could put to use immediately in the industry. Absolutely. I I think if you have an interest in writing a blog or writing or telling stories or podcasting or doing YouTube that you just need to get started. You just need to get it out there, and, you will evolve a lot over the time that you do it, and that's expected and okay. And people will support you. You'll be surprised how engaged people will become with you if you just put it out there. The reminds me of the story as a great point tell you how old this is. It was a former creative director of mine when I worked on an ad agency and he said writing's easy. You just put a piece of paper in the typewriter. There's the dating part. And he says, and then you open a vein. And, you know, when they say it's from the heart, literally, in that particular case, but but that's what it is is you're putting yourself out there exposing yourself for all the world to see and, you know, read and judge, maybe. And, that's, it's a hard thing to do. But when you do and it impacts people as you talked about with Chapel a, it's kind of really incredibly rewarding. That's what I'm enjoying about the the podcast is, you know, You and I have talked a lot, but, this conversation we haven't, and it's pretty cool. You know, we just kinda always knew it was there, but we haven't said these things. Right? Absolutely. And and the gift of who you actually get to interconnect with and have conversations with. And, you know, it's it's so much fun. It's it's worth that investment of your time. Great. Okay. So, this week, we're talking with Melanate Oftenlock, who was probably at her last name often misspelled. Who is, the Dallas wine check, the the famous or infamous Dallas wine check, and, been a blogger for twelve years writing that blog, one of the longest in the industry, I think, short of, Alda Ryaro, who we also spoke with, couple of months ago. So, I wanna thank you Melanie for, being on the show and also being a friend, and I look forward to seeing you somewhere else in the world sometime soon. I'm so honored to, to have been on. It was it was great to connect with you again. So folks, that's Dallas wine check. And do you have any other social media things that you are active on, or is it just the blog? It's blog, it's Facebook, it's LinkedIn, and Twitter, all Dallas wine check. All Dallas wine check. Okay. Great. Okay. Thank you, Melanie. And that's it for this week. And I hope you tune in next week where we'll have another fascinating interview from with someone, I'm just getting to know. Thank you very much. This is Steve Ray signing off for this week. This is Steve Ray. Thanks again for listening on behalf of the Italian wine podcast.