Ep. 400 Michele Palamà

Italian wine podcast. Chinchin with Italian wine people. Hello. This is the Italian wine podcast with Me Monty Walden. My guest today is Mikayla Palamal of Vinicolo Palamal in the Salento region of Pulia. Whose Salento, EGP Rosato, Micti Uisco two thousand and nineteen vintage, scored ninety five points at five star wines the book twenty twenty, which, of course, also includes wine without walls. The Salento, EGP Rosato, Metiusco, two thousand and nine, was crowned, Milior, Vino Rosato, or best Rosay wine. Here's what the judges had to say. Dark copper pink. This wine holds lovely varietal characters of ripe red fruit, spice, and a hint of bitter orange peel, long, fresh, slightly mineral acidity that isn't out of place thanks to the balance of fruit and a dry whisper of tannin on the finish. A medium weight red with wide appeal. Many congratulations. Where is your winery? My one area is situated in the south part of the Italy. We are in the south part of Apullian region, located in Cutrofjana, small center that is called Kutrofjana, know far by lecture, and, far, thirty kilometers from the Adriatic Sea and thirty kilometers from the Union Sea. So in the middle of, the south as part of Uja. So you get, you get some, I imagine you get some, good airflow where you are in terms of coolness. You got the, you know, those in those oceans, those sea, bodies of sea, the side, of your, of your locality. Does that help at all? Our veneers are, situated in, in, really high area. In our zone, an hour area is something like one hundred one hundred meters on sea level. So not not really high for in in general, but, have one hundred one hundred and fifty, two hundred meters with the the sea that is twenty kilometers far by you, and some sometimes five five kilometers far by the vineers create some really particular wind conditions because we have the possibility to receive some part of salt directly from from from the seaside into our veneers, and we have the possibility to control a lot the humidity into the into the lines of our veneers where we have some really big change of temperature during the day and during the night. So where, we can arrive into the summertime to fifteen degrees into the night and fourteen or or something less during the day. This really particular conditions create a lot of freshness, and a lot of stupidity in, in the wines that we made from, from this really particular vineyards. Did you create the winery or was it a family winery? What's what's the history behind what you're doing now? I am the third generation of a family business that was founded in nineteen thirty six, by my grandfather, Angelo. And that, in nineteen eighty six, was into the end of my father, Nina, that still worked with me, that continue to work with the, with the, with me. We work together now. And, we are a pretty small farm that work on thirty two hectares in total where we have twelve of property and the rest, the other twenty in rent. We make something like two hundred thousand bottles every year. Only from native varieties of our territory of the Salentope peninsula in, in a really directly, way because we are my father and I, who work into the vinegars. We are who work into the cellar, and we are we are who sell directly our our wine. So we have the possibility to be the the winemaker. We have the possibility to to be the the the people who works into the veneers, we follow all all all the the production, moments of our wines. So, it's something really, really personal. What are your what are your key grape varieties? Our top varieties are the red grapes typical from this territory. The first two are Negro Amaro, absolutely the best, and then the primitivo. The best part of our production is from negromaro and really particular local variety that gave us the possibility to make, three different kinds of wines because we made, blank denwar, in, Metodoclassico from Negramaro, one hundred percent, working in in in white. We make, a lot of rosette, our most important wine, and then we make also some really important and aged red wines. So the best part of our production is for the mega drum model. Okay. So the I mean, the one that you're the one that you, was very successful at the five star wine competition this year, was your, EGT selintor Rosato. Tell us a little bit about that because that's a hundred percent negronaro as well. How do you make that? You've got a particular, very particular way of making it? Yes. Absolutely. Mittusco Rosetti is also our top seller wine. So our the best part of our production is for the making of, Matyas Co rosette. My father was started in nineteen ninety six to to produce this, really typical rosette from our area. Rosa is not completely correct because here at Salento, we call this kind of wine rosato. Also, the the the the intensity of color is completely different by the rosaire from some other parts of of Italy of, or or some other parts of the of the world. We make a rosato really full of of color and really strong with a really asean technique that, in our family, is called the Salasso. It means that after the first work on on the veneer of the grapes, after the extraction of the skins, after the the the the produce of mousse and skins together, We have, a long period of twelve, twenty four hours of contact by skins and moves at zero degrees or something like that. And after this process of creo maceration, we extract from the base of the tank from the lower valve that we have on, on the tank, only the thirty percent of the liquid part. This part start the fermentation alone, and, we close the fermentation of maturesco rosir with ten, twelve really small parts that everyone, made with an really particular, comparison of fermentation and with a really particular condition of fermentation. You need to mind that make for making two hundred torniters of Matius Corosse, we need to work, grapes from ten hectares. So I really, really a lot of of grapes. For a small part of Rosier. The rest, of course, became a red wine, but the production of Rosier is the first thing when we, make the program of the new office. Okay. So just just run through that again. So you put the Negaro grapes you press them, where you put them in the tank? How how does it work? No. No. No. No. We never press the grapes that we use for Matyas prosa. You need to mind that at the beginning of the work, we have an process that is really similar to making of red wine. So, we we only, remove the school from the from the grapes, and then we put, we put the rest of skins and mousse into into an stainless steel tank before the starting of fermentation, of acrylic fermentation. After the hours of contact by skins and mousse, we only extract from the base of the tank, a part of mousse before the fermentation. This part became the the metrosco rosette. The metrosco rosette, the rest became red wine from negramaro. Okay. So, basically, what you're saying is you're fermenting juice that has freely come from the grapes with a little bit of skin inside, but with no fermentation, so no real extraction. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's correct. And we separate that from the skins and you ferment that juice apart, and that is what becomes your rosato. Yeah. Yeah. It's correct. Perfect. Okay. Because we loved what we loved about the wine that we tasted at the post star wine competition where you did so well was, it had a lovely, a beautiful color, and it was just really, really clear. It had beautiful, the fruit had wonderful clarity to it, and also a lot of intensity. So, whatever you're doing, it's you're doing a great job. I I I can show you some pictures of the most before the fermentation, but it's something really particular to see because most before the fermentation are clear and have the same color of wine into the bottle. So we remove all the parts that are not clear before the starting of fermentation. This, really particular process give us the possibility to have the most clear aromas the the possible. So, we remove all all the parts that can create some bad aromas, some problems during the fermentation. Another really particular thing is that the alcoholic fermentation is really fast. But with a really, loads in Parisur, we have, one week or ten days of fermentation at fourteen, sixteen degrees. So something really fast, and, we then a really loads in Parisur. We use some different techniques, for the starting of our colleague fermentation, some selectedists, the, the, the spontaneous fermentation. We use a lot of different techniques for a lot of different parts, because you need to mind that we harvest the grapes. We cut the grapes that we use for matusco rosier in ten, fifteen different days. So not only one day only one vineyard for making the Demetris Chorusato, but a part of all our negromato veneers. Interesting. Do you in terms of, the negromato, do you do you you obviously know where your, Rosay grapes will come from or the Rosay will come from which negative amount of do you prune those and and manage those throughout the year slightly differently to if you were making a red wine or they just, vineyards that would also make a red wine, but you select certain parts of those vineyards for this particular rose. We use some techniques into the into the vineyards that, gave us the possibility to make the best rosette and then all the rest. I want to to mean that the veneers that are used for making the materials for rosette are our best veneers a lot, cultivated with the typical, Salentos way, the Alberlo, Salentino. But the rest of part is used for making our entry level line. So we concentrate a lot of extract into the into the Jews that we use for the Mitsosclerosis, and the rest has not the same characteristics that add at the beginning and that add on the plants. So you need to mind that filmmakers are with, twelve and half degrees of alcohol means that the red wine, we've closed the fermentation with twelve and half thirteen. No more than this. In our area, the best red red wines from Negramaro arrived to fifteen degrees. So the period of harvest for the grapes that we use for Metisco Rosato is the the first week of September the second week of this of September. The first ten days of September, we have we harvest the negramaro that we use for the best red wines at the end of September. So, you need to to to imagine that these are two different grapes for two different works. Yeah. There's a clear different differentiation between the rose and the red in terms of in terms of Vigna. Now you also do, I think, a very interesting thing. You have a wine called another Rosato UGT Center, which is called Albarosa. What is Albarosa? How is that made? Albarosa is our entry level rosette, also made by negromaro, under percent. We use the press for making the Alvarosa. We use some negromaro. We harvest some negromaro, and, we put it immediately into the press. In this way, we can have a really lower color than Natusco, and, we have a lot of freshness. Then we add the part of negramaro from Salaso that we don't use for Demetu Scorezado. So you need to mind that after the end of all the fermentations, we have, three hundred, hectoliters, three fifty hectoliters of Metuzco Rosato, of small parts of Metuzco Rosato. The really fantastic work that I need to do at the end of October after the end of all the fermentation is to blend all the spars to make the best rosette that I can do into the cellar. Of course, there's there are some some small parts that will not became Demetrius Curizato, but are really full of structure, really full of color, more than a press process for making the rosette. So we add the spars to the alvarosa to make the wine better than a normal rose made by by Press. So, basically, the alvarosa, it keeps got some of its own grapes, but it's also got the, some of the pressed breaks from the, met you score. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So it's a very good, bit of recycling. I can I commend you for Yeah? Yeah. No. But it makes sense. It's like it's like you're a chef, right? And you have you you cook a dish and there's some some of the ingredients that you don't necessarily need for that particular dish, but you've opened them anyway and you add them to another dish, you don't throw them in the bin. You use them. So there's no waste. And also you create a distinct another, it's a very distinct rosé, a distinct from two distinct rosé's at Oruzapo that you make in the end. Yeah. Everyone, everyone who work into the into the vineyard, into the countryside, can understand that after one year of really hard work, follow-up, of a lot of problems, of a lot of bad days, of a lot of not beautiful things, When you arrive to the end, when you have, your product, your grapes into the cellar, the first thing is to respect this work and to use all the parts that you can use. I I don't believe in losing something during the the the the winemaking process because I'm who work into the vineyard, and I know the the the the quantity of work that I need to to do into the into the countryside to make the grapes. So I need to respect the this work and to use all the parts for a lot of things. Maybe you can you can sell, the different parts to to to to the same, to the same price, of course. But, we we also, believe in, into the possibility to drink wines every day. So we have, also a part of our wines that are really cheap and that we get we we sell directly in our seller shop eater by eater. So, we we use everything for a lot of things. Okay. Final question. Your father is Arcangelo. Is that right? No. My grandfather was Arcangelo. Alright. Is it your grandfather Arcangelo? What was the main thing that he taught you? I was really young when my grandfather was died. There was the first years for me. I was four years old when my grandfather died, but I remember these words because my father my father used to to to say the same words we make what he used to say was that we make one of the more honest and, popular is correct, work that you can do. We are we are not, some important key roots or we are not some really important businessman. We are men who makes a really popular work, and we need to remember to make this work for for the the the popular people. It's something really strange because in last years, winemaking became something really, really popular into the rich area. So people starts who have a lot of money starts to to to make investments into the winemaking into the big sellers into all these really beautiful things. But at the end, we are winemakers, and we are who works into the vineyard directly. So, we work the the soil. We work with the plants. It's important to don't, to remember every time that we our work starting to the soil. Not into the the the rich places. So I really believe in that, and, I want to remain a small producer because I want to follow this really honest way to make wines. Perfect. Okay. I just wanna say thanks, Mikaeli to you, Mikaeli Panama for, speaking just today. Congratulations for your success, with your Rosato. I want to underline. I'm sorry. The only one the only, the the the last one thing. I'm really, really happy about this result. And I will remember for all my life, this year, this two thousand twenty, because, in two thousand, in two thousand and eight, the best result of my father career was the the winning of one gold medal in, concourse international law in Italy. Was the first place for the Rosier category. And, in my second harvest, because I've started to be the winemaker of Inikola Palama with the harvest, two thousand eighteen. In my second harvest, I've won the same award of of my father of, his really long career. And the possibility to work with him and and to to to share with him this really great result for me was one of the best thing that can happen into into the life. Well, congratulations to you and to your family fully deserved, Salentos a very underestimated region. But it's, capable of producing absolutely outstanding wine, and and yours was definitely one of them. So well done, keep up the good work, and I hope we can meet face to face, down in, in Pulea sometime. Mikelly, thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you. Listen to the Italian wine podcast wherever you get your podcasts. We're on SoundCloud, Apple Podcasts, HimalIFM, and more. Don't forget to subscribe and rate the show. If you enjoy listening, please consider donating through Italian wine podcast dot com. Any amount helps cover equipment, production, and publication costs. Until time.