Ep. 1332 Francesca Nonino | The Next Generation

By now, you've all heard of Italian wine Unplugged two point o. The latest book published by Mamma jumbo shrimp. It's more than just another wine book. Fully updated second edition was inspired by students of the Vin Italy International Academy and painstakingly reviewed and revised by an expert panel of certified Italian wine ambassadors from across the globe. The book also includes an addition by professor Atilio Shenza. Italy's leading vine geneticist. The benchmark producers feature is a particularly important aspect of this revised edition. The selection makes it easier for our readers to get their hands on a bottle of wine that truly represents a particular grape or region to pick up a copy, just head to Amazon dot com, or visit us at mama jumbo shrimp dot com. Welcome to the next generation. I'm Victoria Chacha, join me as we chat with young Italian wine people shaking up the wine scene. We're going to geek out on a grape or grape fan and hear about all the wild wine things are destined up to. From vineyard experiments to their favorite wine bars. Hello. Everybody you are tuning into. Just another little episode of the next generation. Today, I'm very excited to take you to not just the great baby we'll be talking about from the Italian wine unplugged two point o book, but also with our very special guest, Franchesca nonino, of the nonino Grapa. Yes. She is such so lovely to have her on and to talk about all the good Grapa things and more because Grapa And wine, very close together. I know Goodapp is a spirit, but we keep things dynamic on this podcast. So we're taking things just beyond wine because what is Goodappah made with? The must, the pumice, the leftover, skins and bits from wine production. So closing that circle, which we will talk about with Franchesca very excited. But before that, We are going to talk a little bit about a grape native to Frulio, Picolet. Picolet is one of the oldest native varieties in Italy, and definitely not as famous as, other white grapes but is gained fame because it is quite a versatile varietal. We'll get to that shortly. But it's particularly found in the provinces of Udine, where nonino is located, and also goriziape in the countryside. This Picoides has quite the noble history, and it was often enjoyed by royal courts of Europe. When it comes down to what it looks like in the glass, we see a bright gold color. The body obviously can range depending on how it's produced, typically, a medium plus body, always high acid, and it is described as a refined line with finesse. Very noble, Picolite. Her majesty, Picolite. Terrible joke. Moving on. So Piccolite produces off dried to sweet wines, as well as still wines, and is often mono varietal, meaning lung grape, making the wine in the bottle. Now, you will find Piccolite made in the give air or like the air dried style where the grapes are dried prior to pressing for sweet wines. They could also be hung to dry. The bunches may or may not have botritus, you know, the noble rot. Again, Piccoli is very, very versatile in this way. It depends really on the producer, but overall a very important grape for, Italian wine history, more specifically the history of Frulio, and like I said before talking about Grapa, these, these skins and whatnot end up, you know, some of them in the nonino distillery to produce, Grampa. But one more little fun fact about Picolet before we go is that it has a few DOCs, so the first and only DOCG would be the coli orientale, the Frullet Picolet DOCG, then you have Colio DOC and Frulley COC. And those are on lead talks about mister a Pico lead now it's mister or her majesty. I think Pico lead is gender neutral, keeping it busy. So I think it's time for us to welcome on our wonderful, wonderful. Yes. And welcome, Chelsea Sanchez. How are you? I'm so happy to be here with you. I'm so happy to be here too. So where are you calling in from? Are you in Uvina right now? Yes, sir. I'm in a small village nearby Uvina Percoto. It's sixteen kilometers from Urdina. And, it's a tiny cute village that I hope you're gonna come visit because, it's a place where all the new history began, where we have the distillery, where there is my I spent my challenge. So it's a place where really dear to me. Oh, that's so special. And and do you, like, you're such a traveler. I mean, obviously, like, with with your job as the Gaut pipeline influencer, do you do you get it to spend a lot of time back at home? Or do you feel like you're you're away more often these days? So, like, I feel like, there was a a big difference in these last couple of years because, of course, during COVID, I it was a period where I see people all the time, and I miss troubles so so much. Now I'm starting to go back, talking about the gap all over the world, and, well, it's beautiful. I love it so much. But I also feel like I need to recharge sometimes at home. So, like, I mean to Florida, Texas, New Orleans, the last month. And, I will go back to the United States in July. Now I'm traveling around So, like, lots of traveling, but, I feel it's, it's an enriching experience. And so it's really beautiful to see how you can create connection, share, share something special with people talking about the spirit, you know? In a certain way, I think that when you're talking about the spirit representative, your culture, you're able to create a deeper connection because it's, like, you're really sharing something special in a sort of way. I don't know if I can explain myself. Sometimes it can be taught in English. No. No. You explained it beautifully. It's it's absolutely true because it's in your roots. You know, it's and it's something that you it's not just something that, maybe defines where you're from historically. It's something you've seen at the table, right, like, from a young age. Like, that's something that's always around. And it's like, you know, it's kinda it's a way of wanting to connect with people. It's like, this is my thing. You know? Exactly. I think that's what's really awesome. Why I'm so excited to have you on the podcast one of the reasons, many reasons, not just one, but, is that I want people to actually know more about Karapa. And, of course, it has a major connection to wine. But, like, Italian spirits are, you know, a whole other world and a really important one. And also to see a woman like yourself really leading the storytelling on Grasa for me is amazing, like, I I love it because as someone, like, I'm American and the spirits industry is still heavily male dominated. It's also international woman's month still, which is awesome. And and not to jump super into it, but, like, how does it feel? Like, do you, like, what challenges have you faced, you know, leading the way as, like, a very young, talented woman in the spirits industry and the intelligence spirits industry. So, like, thank you for this question, and thank you for highlighting that, I think it's it's even if it's two thousand twenty three, I think it's really still important to be able to discuss this because a lot of times people are like, yeah, but now we reach equality. I don't know how do you say that in inequality? Equality. Thank you. Quality man. I was like, yeah, theoretically, but in practical, not so much. And I I have a big hope for the future because I think that, in the younger generation, you see a really important topic, and just like, younger kids are not willing to accept the discrimination in any type of it, and I think that it's beautiful. But working in this business, when I was younger, it was a little bit tougher because, even if, I have a beautiful example of a female role in my family. I had, my grandmother, my mom, my aunts, all of them are master distiller, all of them are working in the family business my great grandmother was the personal one, master distiller in Italy. So we had this type of female female touch since really, since long time. But I think that, still, nowadays, when you talk about spirit, with people, and you are a woman, there is this type of thing where, I don't know, in in Italian equality, my god. I cannot even say Italian, but it's just like people treat you. Like, you have to prove them that you are professional. Like, it's not like, they meet you, and they they know that you are from a a family business as you're working in the and so they think that, okay, so I think that she will be prepared about this topic. No. It's more like, she need to prove me that she knows, what's she talking about. And I feel like, this is the type of, a way of dealing that, involve more women than Matna. And, like, this is the reason why I decided to become a similar AWS at their level because, I wanted to be able to put the those type of titles on my business card to be able to be, like, am professional. I'm no one talking about I know. I know spirits. I know why I study them because, before that, it was more like, every time they tried to make to to to ask me tricky question to be able to see if I really was able to speak about, this type of topic or, like, people were not even looking at me. Like, I don't know how to express it. It was almost like I was invisible when it was, about, a professional matter, when it was about work, or, like, if it was about a chat or, like, just share some, you know, not important, non rebalance things about the business. People were looking at me doing icons that otherwise, they almost treat me like I was invisible. And, It was tough sometimes, but I have to say that, having the role of my family, and the example of such amazing women working in the family business, I was like, okay, I don't deserve to be treated like that. I want to be treated as any other everybody else. I want to be treated as if I were a guy. Like, I am not a god. Like, I want them to give me the same times of possibility. I want them to treat me like, I couldn't be a professional as well. You know, at least the beginning, treat me as I was one. Give me the chance. I don't know if it's right. No. No. Exactly. It's like, you know, having an opportunity, like, to be able to sit at the table and discussion, like, it shouldn't be discounted just by looking at you and being like, oh, she's she's a woman. She's a young woman. Like, what could she know? You know what I mean? And having those associations, especially for someone like you, like you're saying, you know, you have this really impressive lineage of strong, willed, you know, dedicated intelligent woman leading your your company. And it's still in this year, you know, you're you're finding that it's like, oh, well, she, you know, she's just the sixth generation, you know, what does she know? She has this family business, potentially, and people could say stuff like that. You know, and it's like, it's like, hey, excuse me. Like, you know what I mean? It's like, let me talk. And and it's also I think it's also just not even about, like, having as much chance as big of a chance as men. It's also, like, not even even looking at the gender. Right? It's like, alright, here's a person. By the way, just for, you know, the audience to hear, But, vanjessica's yeah. Okay. She is the Grathla influencer, and but she also you you're a a certified bartender. You're, like you said, certified sommelier. What else? You you you know, you travel all all the time. You're cute head talks. You're don't you do? You know what I mean? So it's it's, it's incredible, and and, I think it's really important. And I think it's so exciting to have more women leading the way there. Yeah. And I think it's Thank you. Thank you for everything, but I also think that it's so important to have a more example of women in this business because I think that is the strongest thing you can give younger women to look up to just to make them realize that it's possible. You can be a woman and, be in this business and, in Portugal, you can be a woman, a mother, and a CEO. I think that example is the the strongest thing we can give, because, it show that it's possible. And I know that it can sound a little bit, how do you say? Too much, too much of sweetness in what I'm saying. But, I believe I need to remember that the women did so much in just like, sixty, seventy years. It's just like, we are the one that are setting the the new standards about being a woman for the future generation. Anything that is amazing. And, we need to really get the chance and, take this opportunity to to make the difference. Absolutely. And I think it also comes down to, like, and it's similar in the wine world where you know, historically speaking, women doing jobs that are more, you know, manually labor driven, like, you know, and more, like, you know, working in a a distillery is, is is not an easy thing. You know, it were you're dealing with, like, you know, large forms of machinery. You're, you know, it's a mix of science and creativity and all these things. And, like, and but going back to the whole, like, you know, concept of manual labor, it's like, that's what I love is is that, like, the wine industry, spirits, Gauta, it it shows, like, how multifaceted women are, and it's it's not that we have to do everything all, like, always necessarily in the front of house. Right? Like, it's like we can also be, you know, creating these things that, you know, maybe don't fall under this concept of, you know, femininity or whatnot. And I think that's why I love working in this industry. Right? It's like, it it shows us how beautifully multifaceted women are and how we really can do anything. I I I just believe that the old concept about what is a female, family, what is masculine, it's, it's too much of a big limit. I think, like, there is, like, there is just, like, what you love to do, what you feel like you're able to do, what you, you feel like talented. And I think that talent doesn't have any type of gender. So I think that we need to rethink about the this standard of what is being female, what is being male, and just being like, what I can do with my talent, what the difference I can make. And, I think that these things is becoming more and more real. And, I think it's, it's it's a big, big, big opportunity because, in a, like, most of it, I need to discuss about, how difficult it can be for. It can be the work, life for women. But at the end, it can be, like, this type of standard, really hurt men as well because there are lots of time, men are not able to express themselves, in a deeper way showing their emotion because of this type of standard, what is female, what is male, And, and I think that, trying to rediscuss all of that will bring a lot of new opportunities and new talent. I agree. Yeah. And it is exactly that word. It's not about, you know, your gender. It's about what makes you shine as a human because we're all so unique. Right? Like, I think one of, again, another reason why I, like, you know, love working in this industry is, an Italian food and beverage industry is because it's, like, everyone has their own little, you know, stelina in them. They're like, you know, a little star in their own way and things that they're good at. And it's nothing that's ever defined by your gender. It's it's always, like, and and and I think and you're absolutely right. I think that, like, it limits everyone at the end of the day when you're assessed by that. And I think moving forward, it's it's especially for you and the work that you do is is reminding, like, and I love that you how much you put yourself out there, like, with your face and connecting, like, you know, really connecting with people because it breaks down that, you know, that wall of, like, there's supposed to be this kind of image of somebody. You know what I mean? It's like, no. This is something I wanna share with you. And, hi, I'm here. And, like, and I I think it's it's really exciting. And I know that, obviously, social media is is is the major outlook right now. I'm not gonna get into social media because that's a whole other topic in and of itself. And we could probably talk about that for another two hours. I'm really happy to see people like yourself just, you know, push forward. And also, this is like a major side note when you were talking about your family, in, like, the history, the generations of women. I have to say the photo of the, I I think it was the promotion for the Monovidino Graca from, like, the eighties. I love that photo. Thank you so much. So it's so beautiful. Are you enjoying this podcast? Don't forget to visit our YouTube channel, mama jumbo shrimp for fascinating videos covering Stevie Kim and her travels across Italy and beyond, meeting winemakers, eating local food, and taking in the scenery. Now, back to the show. My my grandma used to say that, Gatha is female because we we are all grown in the family. Of course, there is my grandfather, the that is still there, but, it's incredible how many women are working for this, for our family business. So, like, sometimes, I don't know how to say that in English, but, like, in Italy, they talk so much about the Potte Rasa, the pink curator, And we like, my family said, we need to put the blue rate because, like, we are just girls. Absolutely. No. It's true. And and it's, like, and it's so fast. I don't know. It's, like, that's photo is just like everyone's glowing, and it's it's it's, you know, it's mostly a woman that you're that's your grandfather that's, like, nestled in there. Like Yeah. I think it's, like, and if you find clothing because they do, like, you know, one one thing that I love so much about profit about the family history is the fact that that, like, another nine one product proved to the word that what was considered just a poor, a a poor spirit, a a spirit that created with leftover that people didn't thought and had any type of value, they proved that she distilled with an artisanal method with fresh promise of a single bridle. This period was considered just fire water turning to the sole essence of the great put in the final class and they transform this state from what it was just the fuel for poor people, for farmers, into a state that they represent Italian excellence, all over the world, and I think it's so beautiful to see how passion commitment to a product to what you're doing can make the difference. And I think that is, like, the thing that, make you glow in a certain way when working. It's not just like, you know, have a job, but it's, in a certain way, a mission of your life, like, to protect the the quality of our product, to protect your family history to show what the something can really be if you treat that thing with respect and love I don't know. Absolutely. I mean, it's like the farmers knew something. Right? I mean, we if it's it's in in the in the beauty of, like, and especially in Italy, it's like it all comes down to, you know, the the necessity and the creativity of, like, the the core classes in the past and, like, really creating something out of nothing. And it's also creating something that's ultra sustainable because you're not trying to, you know, create something new. You have to use what you have. And I I think it's a really beautiful thing because it brings together Gauta Gauta brings together so many elements in in the, I hate to say Italian because that's really general. Obviously, like Grapa is more from a specific area. But in in a sense, everyone's making Garetta now. Like, even if, like, they're in actually, I was just telling you I was at a winery and they make Garetta, and they, I mean, they make it in Brescha, but they, you know, send their palmets up there. And it's, like, it closes that circle and it, like, brings people together. I don't know if that sounds too romantic, but, like And I think it's it's beautiful just to see the circular how of a circular economy graph is because, like, an you take the leftover winery so you distill them and create this spirit that that is amazing, but also you do not create any leftover because within these steel pumas, you can use them for fertilizer, for heating. And so, like, for example, my grandma, used the dispute of Palmas. We we received from making Gapa for fertilizing her garden, and she grows these beautiful, beautiful tomatoes, and she makes the best tomato sauce in the world. So you need to So you will have the best grandpa, and I'll put that the best tomato pasta of your life. I'm sorry. I know that you are from lazio and except the saladless and food there is amazing as well, but the tomato pasta. Oh, with the the tomato sauce of my grandmother. It's just, like, believable. I will send you a picture of the tomatoes just to make you a little bit more interesting. I'm already I'm, like, books my trip to Udida, like, right now. Like, I'm on that I need to, you know, I'm picking it up. That's oh my gosh. That just sounds so yeah. I love I love a good pomodoro, a good tomato pasta. And and so you said that she fertilizes with the pomace, or did you say the distillate? The distill pomons. So the after the pomons, the pomons that were used for the for creating the spirit, instead of being a serializer. And I believe that the tomatoes grow so big and delicious because they they get the they grow with all the love that we've put into making grandpa. I have this idea, and I think that we will be able to prove it when you're gonna try out really fast. Oh, I I I will be the taste tester that That's just amazing. And it's also so amazing because it takes that closing the circle, the circular economy to, like, another step because it's, like, the gap already closes it because you're using the Thomas, but then taking that use commas, and then putting it into the earth again is, like, the final, you know, step. Like, that's that's so see, I think, like, what and I know COVID in a way with people being home kinda pushes forward more, but I think reminding, like, how everything really does come down to to the earth, you know what I mean? And, like, understanding where everything, like, everything you consume comes from. And because I think in in Obviously, wine is a perfect example of that, but, you know, looking at Karapa and any kind of spirit is is even is just as important because people drink a lot. You know what I mean? And no one's, for example, like, when people have a whiskey at a bar, they're not thinking, oh, where are the greens grown? And how is this affecting the, you know, farmers and whatnot? But I I love, like, especially with your work of, like, giving the educational side is seeing, okay. Like, this is not just a spirit. You know, this is not just going to make me regret what I did lost. It's it's it's it's something that is connected to, you know, the the ground that I, you know, walk on. I don't fall. That's more romantic ground that I walk on. Alright. That sounds like a good quote from the Bible. I think that, but what made me really happy about the nowadays and also thinking about future generation is that, for now, people prefer to drink less, but to drink better. And, I think that's his that is awesome because we're all about the drinking responsible. But, also, I think that, nowadays, for consumer, drinking is just not about drinking. It's about the spirit experiencing the history of the product, the history of the family, or the producer they made it, love that spirit represent. It's about the experience it's just not drinking. It's just like sharing cultures, sharing emotions, sharing history in a sort of way. And I think it's a it gives a lot of new opportunity for this business and also to to brand that put a lot of energy into quality and into telling their story also to smaller brand. I think it's a it's it's really beautiful. Also, because, people that work in this business, even bartender, bartender are, like, so knowledgeable about spirit and about the culture they're making there. They really want to make you experience that product. And, and in a certain way, it's just like, when I try, for example, a cocktail with our wrap up, it's just like I hear all over again, a different type of story about the my own product in a sort of way because, like, you mix our wrap up with different ingredients, and then you're telling a new stuff, I don't know. You put the for example, in this case, it's a cocktail with a mountain, you know, and a bourbon with paper playing, you mix paper playing mixed together, a mountain, you know, and bourbon, and lemon juice, and you you share together, a story of, Italian culture, American culture, only the same glass. You know, so the way about finding, trying to look for, different type of taste. If we live on a boost of bitterness, I don't know. Like, I I love it. Absolutely. I mean, it's a little cultural fusion. It's like me and a cocktail. It's a little Italian, a little American. Yeah. That's the beauty is it's like it's like culture. It's like where these, you know, you combine these different things and And it's not always, you know, you know, a homogeneous. It's like bringing different elements together and and inspiring, yourself is it for you. Also, you know, like, one thing that I love so so much about tasting wrap up with different culture is the fact that, and we wanted to ask. I know I I'm assuming that this is more reliable. So what I'm gonna about to say is a little bit against what I studied, but this is what I really believe. Is that that the the testing experience changed so much. It's just like because, it changes within the type of days you experience in your childhood. So what we you were used to drink your taste. And so, like, when I go travel around the world and offer wrap up, people are able to tell me that they are facing staff that I were not I wasn't able to taste or this male staff that I wasn't able to smell. I remember one time I I drink a Moskato with this Japanese journalist, and he was telling me that he was, smelling green tea in it and I never smell green tea, but now I'm always able to smell green tea. And so in a certain way, even when we need to see with different culture, whatever kind of make a call, they are able to highlight the different notes that you were you weren't able to appreciate. And so it makes your own experience richer, and, I love it because it's just every time that I travel and may and I offer you up a little to people, it's almost like I experienced for the first time my own product and, fell in love with you all right again. And so I want to do that more and more. Oh, no. That that's lovely. It's yeah. It's it shows how, you know, Gaurapa, spirits, blind. It's not just objectively what it is. Like, the aromas, it's so personal, the experience. And it's it's one of the most beautiful things and how how much nostalgia just like a smell of something can bring back with those memories and being able to share that. No. That's so it's that's so beautiful. Yeah. I I I I love the word nostalgia. Yeah. I mean, I agree completely. It's just like, if the power of smell of paste, it's just like, Can can I bring you back to your chat booth and talk completely different places? You said to me, even before with the binary thing. So it's a Yeah. It's the only way we can actually teleport. Like, we can't literally teleport, but I think those elements or the the closest we'll get to it. Yeah. I mean, I love that. So every time you're gonna be able to drink a panel, you know, you're gonna be able to turn Porsche into our distilleries. I hope that you're gonna be able to cancel because you cannot teleport with the past update. I would now. I'll figure out a way. So we're winding down on time. I know you gotta run, and I gotta run, but I wanted to finish off really quickly with questions for you to answer briefly. If you can name a few spots, you know, local spots in Udina, if someone was to come to visit you, where would you take them? So, like, if you're ever gonna come to Udina, I would first thing, we'll bring you to visit us in our see there. So we will do all the tour, additional distillation, aging cellar, all the facing cocktail. Oh, cheers. Then we're gonna go to lunch. We will go to lunch or to Palmanova. To experience the beautiful city star, because it's called city star because it, is the inside of some walls that are, haven't hit the shape of a star. From there, we could go auto civinalde and friuli where we would experience the beautiful medieval city and we would have a beautiful coffee break, cafe Colatto. Of course, we can slice off the plaza, typical dessert from Florida, and then we would be able to go to Gerardo that is called the Frulano, Vanessa, Veneza, Vulano, because it's kind, beautiful city on the scene. We would be able to look at at the sunset. I would really go to ever, to to to to to as amazing raw fish and, siding south, another typical meal from our region, or in Boriet or Borieto that is like a polenta and, fish stew, no fish fish two or sort of thing like that, that is delicious. Or I would bring you to ring and go look towards the best crab sandwich of your life. Sorry. If you have to if you want to come here, the best crab sandwich of your life, it's in grado, every time I go there, I have a crab sandwich. And then, oh, my god. And then we would talk, go to sleep in grads. We're gonna dance into a beautiful walker on the nearby the the sea. And the day after, we will go visit thirtieth thirtieth thirtieth the the the and they say, like a italian in the middle of the capital. It's just like this amazing city in front of the city. You need to see the piazza, it is this this plaza where you can have a beautiful coffee looking at the city. And then, you can experience, this city is a beautiful melting pot of three different cultures. If you like Italian, culture, Austrian culture, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, and then we would eat some more engines now. Also, amazing white wines because our region is so, so amazing for white wine. So, like, you need to come. I mean, you just sold me. You're just like, we're gonna drink, and then we're gonna eat, and we're gonna see beautiful things. And then we're gonna drink and eat some more. I'm like, I'm I'm already here. It's already booked. It's already done. Oh my gosh. I wish we could sit and chat for so much longer because but that's why I did book my trip So we're gonna we're we'll do that some more. But, I wanna say thank you so much, Veronica, for coming on the podcast today and sharing a little bit about your story. Thank you. It was my pleasure. And thank you so much, like, I I really feel like this experience had reached me. So thank you so much for for this chat with me. It was really beautiful to have your point of view, May the hate financials. Thank you. Oh, that touched my heart. Of Damien will start to talk to you. It's so lovely. And I I look forward to chatting soon. And, yep, everyone check out that on Jessica Nelino. On Instagram, on if you haven't, she's awesome. And I'm gonna send her off to her doctor's appointment now. Godson, Gotta Francesca. Thank you so much. And please come visit us. The best we have to record and the best to make the pasta in the same experience. Whoo. Alright. As always, a big good option for hanging out with me today. Remember, you can catch me every Sunday on the Italian wine podcast. Available anywhere, you can get your thoughts.