Ep. 2410 Pellegrino Winery in Marsala | Wine, Food & Travel with Marc Millon (5StarWines - the Book 2025 Series)

All these technical things I just explained give birth to a really amazing masala, really complex masala. So masala, it's a wine that has so many layers in the nose, so many layers, in the mouth. I'm sorry, but, that I I mean, it's always difficult to to speak about wine, without having a glass in, I know. You you're making the listener, but, you're making me want to taste this immediately. If you could have just like smell a glass of, old John, you will feel, first of all, hints of chestnuts, honey, black pepper. So a really intense and fragrant bouquet. Fascinating people with stories to share, fabulous wines, and the best local foods to accompany them, and beautiful places to discover and visit. All of this and more on wine food and travel with me, Mark Millen, on the Italian wine podcast. Join me for a new episode every Tuesday. Welcome to wine food and travel with me, Mark Millen, on Italian wine podcast. Today, I'm delighted to continue a special subseries that highlights the special award winners of the prestigious five star wines competition that took place in April, just prior to Vineitelli twenty twenty five. Today, we traveled to Western Sicily to the famous wine town of Marcella to meet my guest, Anna Ruini, who looks after public relations at the historic Cantina Carlo pellegrino winery, which won the five star wines best fortified wine award, Old John nineteen ninety eight, Marceana, DOC, Ambra Superiorre reserva, which received ninety two points from the judging teams. Many congratulations, Anna, to you and to the team. This is a great achievement. How are you today? Hi, Mark. Thank you for inviting me, and I'm delighted to be here with you to speak about, Sicily wine and carlo Plegrino. Great. Well, I'm looking forward to our conversation. Anna, our listeners are located all around the world. And I'd like them to get a feel for For the town of Marcela, a town I really love, I I come often, but also the vineyard area where the vineyards that grow the grapes to produce this very special historic wine. What is the landscape like? Can you just describe a little bit about Marcela and about the wine country. Yes. First of all, Marcela is located on the west part of Sicily, and we are in a one area that has the highest density of a vineyards planted in Europe. That's because of the amazing, climate condition and, soil condition that we have. So we are really close to the sea. We have the natural breeze that, blow in the vineyards. We have an amazing landscape just, in front of our winery, there are this whole pant of Marcella that it's an amazing spot for, looking the sunset. And, it's an area rich of a beautiful natural landscape as well, history. Marcell is one of the most, known or maybe wine products I mean, there in terms of brand, historically, all over the world. And the city of Marcella is a tiny city with lots of little gem around, in terms of, archaeology and natural beauty like Agady Island. So I'm lucky to be in this, magic place. Yeah. It is a magic place, Anna. As I say, I come to Western Sicily every couple of years. And, you're describing that view looking across to the Egedi Islands at absolutely stunning. And of course, those salt pans that have been in production for maybe two thousand years going back to the time of the finish. So it's a really historic wineland. And then as you I didn't know that this was the most densely planted area in Europe for vines. That's incredible. Yeah. Actually, this is strictly linked to the history of Marcella because, in the nineteenth century, the Marcella was the one of the most exported Italian wine all over the world. So the landscape changed, in this area because of Marcella before they were mainly, like, you know, cultivation of, vegetables, some, ship breeder, of course, vineyards, but not that high density planted. Then Marcella changed the landscape because, it started to be cultivated at the vineyards in all the trapped in the area in order to supply the grape for the Marcella production. And this one was the pest. Now all this land, give birds to white wine, red wine, and the somehow, this is also the evolution that Carlos Plegrino did. So we are wondering that our history is started in the eighteen eighty. So one hundred and fourteen years ago by Carlos Plegrino. Nowadays, the company is still run by the family. So it's a family business. We still produce Marcella, but we moved also on the production on white and red wine from native grape variety, like, Grilla, zbbo, cataracto. So It's an area that is really vocation for the wine production, starting from red and white wine till the Marcella. That's a really good overview. And these vines, these dense vines that were used to produce Marasalo often low trained bush trained. But as you say, the vineyard in recent decades and years has been transformed. And now there's such a, good range of table wines being produced from the same native grape varieties in many cases used to produce Marcella. Now Marcella is one of Italy's most historic wines, this fortified wine. And the British played a big part in the creation of Marsala. Can you tell us something of the story of Marsala? The before the British came, there was the perpetual wine. Is that right? Yeah. Actually, we call now a day for the local people. We're just like the wine that they did used to drink. So the history of Marcella, Samau is linked to the terrar where we are now. Of course, so, like, an area that it's close by the sea that has a really high term of discussion. So the local, farmer used to produce a small amount of, grape variety, local grape varieties, especially white grape variety. And they used to every year harvest the wine and put the fresh juice in a a small barrel where there were already some wine. So you correctly call it perpetum because you didn't have, like, a real vintage and bottling. But, every year, this wine was refreshing with a new one. And there was a wine that was, refining in contact with oxygen. So an oxidated wine. Then the history of Marcella changed when, John Voudow arrived in Sicily in the eighteenth century, the end of the eighteenth century. He was a trader from, Liverpool, the legend because we don't really know if he came here by chance or on purpose. But the legend say that, his, the boat was hit by a storm just outside the Marcella Harbor. He took refugees in Marcella Harbor, and he entered in a Austria it tasted some local wine. And, this style of the wine reminds him, something that you already tasted like Porto Sierra madeira. So oxidative style wine. You have to think that, all of the wine I've just mentioned are all produced in the sun belt area. That is a specific latitude where you have, a really high amount of, sunlight every year. So it's an area where this typology of wine, so oxidated wine are produced in the best way. So without this this wine, and it took the idea. I mean, it it understood the opportunity of importing this wine in UK. You have to think that, in, in that period, Britain was in war with Portugal and Spain, so it couldn't, import anymore. The part of my data share is all the wine that the the English people were used to drink. And, it started to trade the the Marcella in the UK. But before doing that, he had to stabilize the wine because, to trade the the wine from Marcella till liver put it to also three months. So it added some alcohol. And the in that moment, started the Marcella as we know. So the fortification was done, first by Buddha in order to hollow a local wine to be shipped in UK. Okay. That's a really good overview of the, that historic story of Marcella. And I'm wondering, Sicily at that time was, of course, under the Spanish. Do we work with? The the bobbins. Yes. And, I want wondering if that style of wine, the perpetuum style maybe came from the Spanish influence, like the solera system. No. Actually, the solera was introduced after. So it was just like a local wine. Okay. And the, you know, the knowledge of the farmer at the period of the things that work at for the specific area were higher maybe than now. So they just, like, produce at the wine that, fit the the environment, I would say. Sure. And I guess as well, Anna, because it's a hot area, and it's a flat area that doesn't have so many underground sellers. And this oxidayan dated style lended itself to the wine and by not filling the barrels completely, the wine developed its own unique character. Yeah. Actually, it's funny because, inside our seller, in the historical seller, we have more than one thousand barrels to refine the Marcella. So depending on how far is the barrels from the door where actually the breeze from the sea cans, you have different taste. So the influence of the environmental for the marsala production is fundamental. Wow. That's really, really interesting. And of course, The sellers in Marcela, these are the Balios. The Balni explain what a Balio is because they're quite unique, almost like a cathedral of wine with these vast barrels and wonderful aromas that are emanating from these big wooden barrels. Yeah. So the banger is the typical building. I would say production building that, was created, I would say here in Marcella when, or the Marcella history started. So, it has, like, kind of, like, shape of, like, a u. So in the middle, you have a big court, and then all around, you have, the seller that they've developed along, this big court. And, the masada winery wasn't, like, winery, like, we know nowadays. So they were, like, kind of like cathedral because you need a really big, big, burrows, big volume in order to refine the wine. So really high ceiling, it really looks like a It's amazing. And, now a day, we still keep the architecture. So visitor that comes in, our seller. They just, like, see the winery has it was, almost one hundred eight eighty years ago. Of course, now with it, it's more modern in terms of, technology. So we have some stainless steel, etcetera. But the refining part of the Marcella is still the same. And, inside our winery, we also kept some little Jam to let understand the visitor. How was the Marcella production? Because, you have to think that the inside of the winery, there were also the barrel production, the one that was used to ship the Marcella from the winery everywhere in the world. And, the visitor comes in a winery, see how it was the Marcella production, also the transportation of this small barrel was done by train. So from the patio, it was took with a little chart and horse. It was brought to the train, a rail path. And then, these, barrels, travel till palermo where they were shipped on the boat and traded all over the world. So the confirmation of the city is strictly linked to the Marcella production. Okay. That's actually really giving a picture of of what vast and important trade in Marcella wine. There was with this wonderful, unique wine being shipped all over the world. And we're going back a long time when that trade began. Back to the story of when Cantini Carlo pelegrino began really because that was something of a heyday for Marsala, wasn't it? Yeah. I mean, the story of Carlo pelegrino started with the Marcella. And, we were one of the first Italian family to enter in the business of Marcella because for almost one hundred year, all the Marcella production was run by English family who came here. So we are proud to have this heritage and to keep, still that Marcela production has one of our jam in the line of the wine that we we offer. Okay. Now, Marceona is not one wine. There are many different styles of wine, and it's a complicated wine, Anna, I just wonder if you could give a brief overview, sort of mini master class into the world of Marcela. It is complicated, but we have the or the ambro that rubino and the different aging and the different sweetness levels. Can you give us a brief idea so that our listeners who are located all over the world when they see a bottle of Marcella can understand a bit more what to look for. Of course. Okay. So Marcella first of all, it's a wine that can be produced with the native grape variety, like in Solia, Catarato, grillo, gricanico, so are all white grape variety. And as we said, it's a fortified wine. So the liquid that we drink in the bottle is a combination of, the grape, the fortification. So the kind of, the liquid that is added to for to find a wine, so increase the alcohol degree and the time of aging. Okay? So these three different component give birth to the different typology of Marcella. So the, Marcella vergine is a a Marcella that is forty five, just using alcohol. So whenever you have a wine that is produced, so you get, like, a wine from the vintage that reach around thirteen degrees, okay, thirteen, thirteen Then you had alcohol in order to fortify the wine and increase the alcohol percentage. So Marcella for the shippingari has to have at least eighteen degrees of alcohol. Whenever you had just alcohol. So it can be a or brandy. You get the Marcella vergine. And Marcella vergine is the driest version of Marcella and is the one that have to be more aged. So has to have at least six year of aging. Okay? Then you have, the virgin is reserva, and then in this case, the wine have to be aged at least ten years. After the Marcella virginia, there is another category that is called a Marcella superiore. So Marcella superiore is a Marcella that is fortifying using alcohol and other two ingredient. Or the mistella that is the fresh must. Okay. Or the cookie must. Mosto cotto. So according to the style of a fortification of superiority, you can have if you use the mister La superior or because the color is gold. If you use the most of the cookie, the color is Amber. Marcella Amber. This is the color. Then in the category of superior, according to the sugar residual, you can find marsala superior or dry. That means that has less than fifty grams per liter of sugar content. Marcella superior semi dry that has in between more than fifty and less than one hundred grams per liter or Marcella superior suite, Marcella superior delche. That has more than one hundred grams per liter of a sugar reseal. And the Marcella superior to be called superior has to be aged at least three years. Okay? Also for Marcella superior, you can have the Marcella superior reserva. And in this case, the aging has to be at least five years. Then you have the third version of Marcella. That is the youngest version that is called Marcella Fine. And in this case, it is a a sweet marsala that is eight just one year. So it's the, let's say, youngest, the less complex version. The more important and, the one that, we always say that at the most amazing potential in terms of longevity and, consumption are the, Marcella superior. Okay. That is a brilliant overview of the different styles and the different aging and the different sweetness levels. But I think what I want our listeners to understand is that Marcella isn't just a wine that you see on the shelves. There are many types of Marcellas if of varying quality levels as well. And it is one of Italy's great wines, a great fortified wine certainly, but part of this heritage of great wines, in Italy. And that indicates something of of the complexity of it. Let's focus on your award winning wine, Anna, the Old John nineteen ninety eight. Now this is an Ambra Superior reserva, which you just explained, but tell us a little bit more about this wine. First of all, Ojona, it's a producer just using a grillo grape variety together with Katarato and Solo is the highest in terms of percentage. You have to consider that Grillo. It's great variety that, give the more complexity to the Marcella. So whenever you search for a, high quality Marcella, you search for a Marcella that has Grillo as one of the highest percentage in the composition. Then, according to what I explained of the classification, so superior means that it's a fortified wine with alcohol and something else. In this case, we use alcohol and a small percentage of cooking masks. So you have the color that is amber. It's a reserve because the wine, it's dating back the nine nineteen ninety eight. So it has more than, of course, six years of, of aging. You have to consider that the vintage that is recorded on the label is not the vintage of when you harvest the grape, but it's the ear or fortification of the wine. So this wine was fortified in the nineteen ninety eight, and this is the vintage that is recorded on the label. All these technical things I just explained give birth to a really amazing masala, really complex masala. So masala, it's a wine that has so many layers in the nose, so many layers in the mouth. I'm sorry, but, that I I mean, it's always difficult to to speak about wine, without having a glass in, I know. You you're making the listener, but, You're making me want to taste this immediately. If you could add just like smell a glass of, old John, you will feel, first of all, hints of chestnuts, honey, black pepper. So a really intense and fragrant bouquet. That also combine some freshness like, aggregate. Then in the mouth, you will feel us a really large dense and persistent wind. Another great component of Marcela. It's always the great balance you find in your mouth between the alcohol that is important because you have eighteen degrees of alcohol. In this case, the sugar receded because, all John is the semi seiko. So It has in between, sixty grams per liter of sugar resealer. You have this sensation of sugar, but you don't feel you don't really feel the sweetness because, the other component that you will feel in the mountains. It's a great stupidity. And the stupidity, it's, something that is strictly linked to the where we we are now. So every Marcela, every wine especially the white wine that you will taste the producing in the west part of Sicily has this stupidity in the amount that, just like make you feel like to to just like drink a wine in front of the sea. Okay. That is a beautiful tasting note. And as you say, it would be far better if everybody listening to this podcast had a glass of old John with them when you were describing that. But I almost feel as if I did. You discard that so well. And what I note, mostly, Anna, is that, you know, we have this great complexity, this nuttiness, the the pepper, but also you mentioned the freshness, this vibrant acidity that great Marcella has along with this sapidity, this salinity that comes almost, you can feel those fresh sea breeze is coming off of the sea looking out to the agony islands. So I think that really shows how Marsana is very linked to terroir, this unique terroir of Western Sicily, which is the only place where it can be made. Anna, can Marsana be a gastronomic wine? We don't think of Forta fied wines is wines that we enjoy with food. I'm imagining some of the beautiful sweet pastry traditions that come from Sicily. Are there any other foods? And can you describe some foods that you might want to have with this beautiful ambra superior reserva. Of course. And I would say that actually, Marcela, it's a super gastronomic wine. So as I told, we just spoke about the different technology of Marcella. So you start from something dry like a virginie. You reach the sweet version like Marcella superior suite. So it's a wine that has, an amazing versatility at the table. So, first of all, we have to think Marcella has a wine that can be drink during a meal. And to do that, you have to serve in proper glass. So, like, wine gloves, like, the one that you use for white or red wine and proper temperature service. So not room temperature, but the chilled, like, in between twelve and fourteen degrees. This is really important in order to make the Marcella more drinkable, more easy to drink also by the glass itself. For the old John, of course, you can easily pair with amazing cheese, like, blue cheese, or really aged cheese. Of course, you have the classic pairing with, like, sweet. I we're in sisis. So anything prepared with ricotta. It's amazing. So canali or Casata. But, I love to pair the Marcella Superioros, Amber, also with some umami pasta, like pasta with bottarga and some lemon zest. So anything that has an mommy taste pairs really well with Marcella. In this case, for the Marcello superior or Johnson Miseko since you have also this sugar recidle, you have to have also something pretty sold to balance. But as I told you, like, a botarga, it's an amazing, combination for, for this wine. What time actually is the red tuna roll that is typical from this part of Sicily. That's a really, really wonderful description, of foods as well. And and reminding that as you gave us this overview of Marcela, then There is such versatility in styles and that, yes, it can partner a meal throughout the courses. Anna, what would you have perhaps with the wonderful, the red prawns that are such a specialty of Western Sicily and that our specialty that goes all around Italy, but I'm sure case best when you're in Western Sicily. Yeah. Okay. So if we speak on Marcella, Marcella, Virgeny is a great pairing with the gambler also because, the version as I told you is the dries version you can have. It's more, let's say, cleaning the mouth, so more direct. And, clean up your mouth after the fat meat of the gamboro that is a mustache. So it has this really lucius, tasting, you know. But, of course, if we move also to other wine that we, for example, we produce using a native grape variety, I would say with, a Grillo. So, like, a scenario that is one of our, flagship white wine. So something that is strictly linked to the terroir because Grilo is one of the most representative variety of the West part of Sicily and, still have the freshness and the minerality that can goes really well with the bread prawn gambarosso. Okay. That's a really, really good, suggestion as well. Grillo with the, Gamarosso. That's wonderful red prawn. And I think when you mentioned that gammarosa, when I've eaten them, especially crude or raw, you have a a really lingering taste of the sea in your mouth. It it it's incredible. The concentration of flavor. And I can see why that would pair so well with a virginae. But I'm really intrigued by having the old John with the pasta with bottarga. That's a a suggestion I would not have thought of. So next time you will come to Sicily, we can we can drink and eat together faster with Bartanga and the Marcela and John. Well, I would love that. What about, Anna, one more iconic dish of Western Sicily, of course, is the Kuskusti Pache. Tell us about this dish and about wines to pair whether Marcela or your other range of table wines. Yes. Okay. Because because whenever you say this word, people maybe think mostly to North Africa because it's typical dishes that, is prepared there. But, in the west part of Sicily, so Marcela Trapani, San vitolo Capo, it's a typical dishes that make you understand also the history of this part Sisley because there was a big arabic influence in this part of Sicily, and you can see from some architectural buildings and also from the food. So cusco is one of that. The typical thing is that, we cook we prepare cusco with fish. Of course, we are just like next to the sea. So fish is one of the main, ingredient of the traditional recipes of Marcela and the West part of Sissippi. And, the fish is a really rich intense. And, I would say also tasty. Somehow can be a little bit hurty. You have, the fish You have lots of garlic. You have, of course, the tomato sauce. So it's really complex and, intense dishes. And, here, also, they serve the fish cusco spread with a sauce that is made with the mixing garlic and almond. So garlic is something that you really have in the fish cusco. So sometimes I like to have the cusco with the marsala superior dry because It's a as I told the really complex dishes, really tasty, really umami, and pairs well also with Marcella. But, I love also gained to eat the the cuscoosa with some, white wine that are producing in the west part of Sicily. So I mentioned the Grillo. So Grillo has a sanerias, and the Salinado. It's another white wine that we produce, really versatile and really pair well with the fish cruise cous, but, I would say also another iconic wine that we produce, is isesi, that is the Pantilleria Doca Bianco. So we move in another small island in front of, the area where we have the that is Telier. Yeah. Where we also have a winery and vineyard there. So we have lots of option, I would say. Wonderful. Wonderful description of dish as well. Now, Anna, you've made our listeners want to visit Marcella and the carlo Peregrino winery. Can they visit and see this historic ballio and taste the wines? Of course, we open our cellar all year around welcome visitors, in our historical sellers. So we are basing in Marcella just in front of the egg at the island. So the entrance is facing this beautiful landscape. And, we have, as you mentioned, the value that can be visited and, inside the value you will see beside the barrels and everything that It's a the construction for refined and Marcella. We also have a small museum in our band. So there is a a small part that is dedicated to the sicilian char that are well preserved and kept and restored, and, a visitor along the path can, see this beautiful, sitchin chart. But we also have, even, something that it's older, like, some, finishing rest. When we restore one part of the building, we found some, finishing, archaeology site, just like under the ground. So we, visitor can have also this extra content beside, of course, the wine tasting. So it's something that the more the visit, I would say. Okay. Well, that's really, really good to know. And, actually, that's interesting to remind of this long history of this area with the Finicians, the finishings on the island are just across from you. And, of course, the great naval battles, the punic wars that took place in the waters just off of the coast of Marcela. Anna, it's been a fascinating talk with you this morning. You've really taken us to Western Sicily to Marcella and explained a complicated and historic wine that I really love and I hope our listeners will seek out and find Marcella in all its different styles and quality levels, because it is one of the great wines of Italy. Congratulations again for the best fortified wines award at Five Star wines And I hope I can visit you on my next visit to Marcella. And And thank you for inviting me to this amazing, Postcast. I I wait for you soon. You're in Marcella. Okay. Thank you, and have a great day. Bye. Bye. We hope today's episode of Hawaiian Food and Travel with me, Mark Millen, on the Italian Hawaiian podcast has transported you to somewhere special. Please remember to like share and subscribe, wherever you get your pods. Likewise, you can visit us at Italian wine podcast dot com. Until next time, Chincin.