Ep. 1903 Alberto Cella | Wine, Food & Travel With Marc Millon

The Italian wine podcast is the community driven platform for Italian winegeeks around the world. Support the show by donating at italian wine podcast dot com. Donate five or more Euros, and we'll send you a copy of our latest book, my Italian Great Geek journal. Absolutely free. To get your free copy of my Italian GreatGeek journal, click support us at italian wine podcast dot com, or wherever you get your pots. Welcome to wine food and travel. With me, Mark Millen, on Italian wine podcast. Listen in as we journey to some of Italy's most beautiful places in the company of those who know them best. The families who grow grapes and make fabulous wines. Through their stories, we will learn not just about their wines, but also about their ways of life, the local and regional foods and specialities that pair naturally with their wines. And the most beautiful places to visit. We have a wonderful journey of discovery ahead of us, and I hope you will join me. Welcome to wine food and travel with me, Mark Millen, on Italian wine podcast. Today, we travel to Sardinia, the second largest island in the Mediterranean to meet my guest, Alberto of the Corto Moro de Sardinia winery, which is itself part of Sardinia Terwais, an interesting collective of wine properties located across the various different wine lands of Sardinia. Welcome, Alberto. Thank you so much for being my guest today. How are you? Thank you, Mark. Good morning and, good morning, everyone. I'm, fine. I'm very well. I'm I'm in Holland right now for work. And I'm very happy to be your guest in this fantastic podcast. Well, I'm delighted to have you, Alberto. So you were just explaining to me that you studied in Holland and spent some time there and you're back, presenting some wines now. So you're working, but also revisiting your host family and people you knew while you were there. Yeah. Exactly. I had the luck to Holland seven years ago when I was seventeen. I am twenty four now, and I had this fantastic experience, at school, and, I used to live in a Dutch family so that I could even learn Dutch when I was here. I think it's a it's very particular. It's a particular culture and language that I really like. It's a land that I love, and, I was happy to come back here. Our Dutch importer called me to ask me if I wanted to come to the Netherlands to present our wines to their clients. I was very delighted, very happy to say, yes, to give an affirmative answer. Well, I'm sure your importer was delighted too because there can't be many Italians who can explain their own wines in Dutch to, a Dutch audience bravo. I think so too. Thank you. Thank you. Now, Albert, you're you're from Sardinia. This is your home. But, you know, many of our listeners who are located all around the world may never have been to Sardinia before. So for those who haven't been to Sardinia, Can you help them to gain a picture of this large and and special island? Where is it? What makes it such a unique place? Sure. So, Sardinia is an island located in the middle in the center of the Mediterranean Sea at the center of this beautiful sea actually. We have beautiful beaches where we can swim in the summer. Beautiful mountains where we can see even there's snow in the winter. So, I mean, it's a very various island as, different territories and climates. Sardania is fantastic even for a different is, of the soils that we have. We can have, in many different areas. So it's from a granite. We can have limestone. We can have clay pure sand where we have even Pieda Franco, as Viticulture, and we have also a lot of volcanic soils. So Sardinia has also, its own language, which is different depending on the area where we are located. So in the north, we speak a particular kind of sardinia language, which is very different from the southern the southern sardinia language. And also we have a lot of different foods and, different foods depending on the different areas of sardinia, different villages and provinces. And our food luckily can be from art. So I mean meat, but also seafood. We have excellent seafood coming from our coasts. That's a great introduction, and, I look forward to exploring the foods. But I think you've even within those few words, Alberto, you've really given an idea to our listeners that this is a large island that's incredibly varied in terms of the geography in terms of the the actual terawatts, the different rocks and soils that the vines grow on, but also culturally and the different foods from sea and from land And very interesting that you mentioned as well that the Sardo language differs all across the island. So that's another language that you know as well, Alberto. Is that right? Yeah. That's that's right. We are as Sardinia people, always very proud to have our own language. Just because as you can imagine, Mark, Sard is an island, dislocated from Italy. It's it's a bit far away so that's, in the past, Sardinian people didn't speak Italian before being part of the rest of Italy. So traditionally, Sardinian language has been always spoken by Sardinian people, and we are still proud to speak it nowadays. Italian wine podcast. If you think you love wine as much as we do, then give us a like and a follow anywhere you get your pods. Would you speak it at home with your parents? Would you speak it with your friends? Are people the same age as you? Actually, in my village, it's not very often spoken by him, by the young people, but in, in many villages, it is still. I often speak it also at home with my parents, but more often with my grandma, we we always speakidian. Yes. Okay. That's wonderful to be able to communicate with your grandmother in your own language. That's very special. Very important that you do keep that up. Thank you. Yes. I I think so too. It's it's important. No, Berto. Let's talk about Corto Moro. Tell us the background of your family wine estate and also where you are. You were explaining to me where you are and where the soil is and and the grape varieties that are suited to your area. Yes. So Corto mori is located on the West Coast of Virginia in the territory of Campidano Lizzer alba. So the Campidano is the the biggest valley of Virginia. It is located between the monte Arce which is an old volcano, not active anymore. And the gulf of original. So between the sea and the old volcano. So we are very lucky in Guatemala because in our properties, in our vineyards, we can have different soils in the same territory. And what I mean is that We can have volcanic soils. So with a lot of volcanic rocks. Particularly, the compounds are OBcedia, which is a black stone, special from Monte Archie, is our particular stone, our special stone that we can find only Monty talking about Sardinia and Baselstones. The stories are very difficult to be worked with a tractor and, with our machines. What I want to say is that They are very important for the mineral characteristics that they can give to our wines. And not only volcanic soils because we also work on, Sunday soils, really close to the sea. If we go more to the valley, So, the elevation is, is absent. It's a zero meter above the sea level. Our vineyard, in particular, Vermentino, and also above all the vineyards is totally on Sunday soils. And we have also Pierfranco. So the Pierrefranco vise are all vise planted directly on sand. So, we don't need a a root stock made of an we say American roots. So that's filoxera can't attack the roots of the European variety if they are planted on sand. That's a physical problem, mechanical problems of, of this parasite of Filoxera. So that's actually fascinating. Fascinating taste, here are the old vines on Piedifranco planted in sand, these ungrafted vines, but also this variety of volcanic soil. You know, we talk about volcanic soil, but there's so many different types of volcanic soils, and I've not come across obsidian before in other parts of Italy. I know of obsidian from Mexico where I was born where obsidian was used in ancient civilizations to make tools because it's a volcanic glass, black glass that can be can be struck and sharp instruments can be made from it. But I haven't heard of vineyards growing in obsidian. So it's fascinating to here, even within your corner, Alberto, of this large, large island, the immense variety of terrains that you have. Now just, before we turn to Sardinia Tieron and explore the island, Let's get a better picture than of the wines you produce at Corto. Yeah. Sure. Corto was created in a two thousand and ten by my parents who are Piero and Luchana. Gares my father, who's a winemaker, an anologist who used to work for many years with Jakomotakis, which was a very important analogist of Italy. It's a very famous one. My father was very lucky to work with him by side for thirteen years, actually, twelve or thirteen, Tatina de Santari. But many years later, in two thousand and ten, my father, while was working for many wineries in Sard as a consultant as a winemaker. They decided together with my mother to create a quarter tomorrow so to create an experimental winery. Focus only on indigenous varieties from Sedenia. So that they wanted to create a great quality wines and the focus was the terroir of Montelchy of the Campidano Deter alba. Our variety principle is bovale. So the bovale is a red grape, which can be fresh, which can be fruity, sapid, but which can be also our whole body wines so that, we can play. I like to say, we can play with different kind of fermentations, different kinds of, aging so that we can have, we can produce different kinds of bovale. It's a very plastic variety, I would say. But not only bovale, We also produce cano now. We also produce monica. We also produce canulari and Carignano because my father wanted to have a lot of different varieties and the particularity of Corto is that we produce every wine hundred percent with one variety. So we don't make blends, but every variety is significantly produced hundred percent pure in a bottle, even to to understand well the differences between our different, traditional sardinia varieties. Talking about the white varieties, our most traditional is, is, the Vernacha. So Vernacha, Durystano, but also Vermentino, which is the most famous, white variety of Sedenia, and also Semidano. So that, we can experiment a lot of different wines, and my father likes to experiment a lot. And that's why Corto was born was born as, deducting quinary for him. And then the years passed and now Corto moro is effectively a winery which produces a sixty five thousand bottles and we export wines, outside Sardinia. So to the whole Italian country. Even to Europe and, even to Japan, to the US, to Australia to many different countries, and we are very happy and proud to bring Sardinia outside with our with our products. Okay. Well, that is a really good overview of Cortamuro and how how your family winery was was begun by your father who already had this great knowledge of of sardinian terroirs and grape varieties. And I'm really fascinated to hear just from your own family winery, the range of wines you're producing from the Vermontino di sardinia, or is it a it's a Vermontino di sardinia. Is that correct? Yeah. That's correct. I would say also a funny thing. Actually, we are producing twenty different labels. For me, that I need to communicate to our clients and, to the wine lovers All our production is a bit difficult for me. I mean, it's my father's passion, also my passion, of course, because of, my work in our winery, in our company is also the management of the vineyards. That's that's my great passion, actually. I didn't say it's but I also need to communicate outside Sedinia, what's we do, what our work is, and it's difficult for me to communicate twenty different labels. Yeah. I can one understand that. It it is a really, really Fascinating range, and we're talking about as well the Vernacha Deorestano, which is a quite a unique wine, isn't it? Tell us about that. Exactly. So the Vernacho is a particular, I would say, the cert wine, even if it's not a sweet wine, as, many people think. Verinacciadustano is a particular floor aged wine. So the floor are a particular kind of, this which envelops on the surface of the wine inside the barrel. But these yeasts need some air inside the barrel so that the oak barrel need to be a bit empty. Not filled right to the top. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you, Mark. Yeah. Exactly. It's a traditional way to produce Veracha. Actually, in Guatemala, we don't produce flour, Veracha. We make a fresh Veracha. With some some days of, maceration on the skis because for us, the best expression of a fresh varnacha is this one. So to express in the best way all its, aromatic characteristics, and to express the almond taste, which is very particular of Okay. I've not come across a nacho that wasn't made under the floor. This nutty sort of flavors. And, I guess it's a tradition that maybe it came from when the spaniards were in Sardinia? Could that be when this winemaking came in? Because the floor, of course, is on the tops of barrels in in Harris de la Frontera for the Fino in Mansanias. That are produced there. Yeah. That's totally right. Honestly, Mark, this is a good question. I don't actually know the answer because the floor of our nacho is a very interesting tradition. So we share some different grape varieties and, winemaking ways with Spain. Well, nobody actually knows exactly who imported this this winemaking's way or wine varieties to Sardinia or Spain. We don't actually know it for sure because, you know, talking about Canal is a cousin of, garnacha and Granache in, in Spain and France. And Canal, let's say, is the Sardinia or Grinash. But we don't actually know where it comes from if it came from Sardinia or Spain or France. Even because Finicians before the Spanish domination in in Sard definitions were very good commissioned all around Mediterranean C so that they could, import and export the different foods, the different, habits, and grapes all around the Mediterranean Sea. That's fascinating. That's really, really interesting to show how wine culture in Sardinia goes back to antiquity. And, of course, over the centuries, subsequently, with the various other occupations in including the Spanish. You're really painting, fascinating picture of this complex island. And, you know, the complexity simply in the twenty wines from your own estate is compounded when we look at Sardinia as a whole. Now let's turn to Sardinia Terwas, this project, which is doing just that, isn't it? Is it trying to present Sardinia the whole island in all its magnificent variety and give identity to these different tearwalls, explain the goals behind the project. Exactly. So, Sardena Terwar is a an association which relates eight different wineries all around Sardinia. One is our winery, which is Corto moro. Then we have Antonio Acorda, which is in south of Sardinia, in the in the area of Partiola, then another winery in southern, Sardinia is jiba, which is in the solstice and they produce a beautiful carignano. Then we have Gallura with Saraya with fantastic vermantinos and and granite soils. Then we go to the northwestern part of Sardinia with a Kerke with a limestone producing cannulaic grapes and beautiful cannulaic wines. And then if we go to the central part of Sedinia, we have the beautiful territory of Mandro Lizai, which I personally love is a fantastic territory. I think up on the hills, even with a high elevation, we talk about also seven hundred meters of elevation for the vineyards. And we have here the one in Fradillas, which means, caussies, inserting a language, And we have then in central part of Sard. We've got Yollet, which is in Oliana, which produce Canal. And talking about Canal, we move to the East Coast of Sardinia, Central East Coast. And we got also producing beautiful cannon house but different because of the different and our purpose. Our goal is to let the word know all the difference that we got with sardinian different terriers so that we can have even with sometimes the same varieties, different wines with different tastes and different peculiarities, different aromas. That's our purpose. Okay. That's that's a fascinating project. And I guess those eight producers, all of you must share similar ethos and ideals and an approach to making wines. Is that what brought you together? Exactly. That's why. Also because our focus is to produce wine with the best quality that we can have. With respect for the nature, respect for the vineyards and the environment, which is around the vineyards, and so that the wine that we put down in the bottle is going to be the best response, the best product that we can produce coming from our terroir. And so we would like to give to the world a good idea, a good perception of what Sardinia can produce in a bottle of wine. That's really interesting. And to begin to present to consumers, to give them the possibility to distinguish For example, a Vermentino de sardinia from the west to the Vermentino de Galura, which has a different character as you've explained, or the different Canal from different parts of the island. That's very important to help people to distinguish. The variety that, you know, everything that we talk about is about really how it's such a big island that has so much contrast and so much variety. And I think that's what's really fascinating for visitors. Now you mentioned at the beginning of our talk, Alberto, that just as in wine, just as we have this mosaic of Terwas, this mosaic of different soils and topographies and volcanic soils, or sandy soils that also the cuisines of Sardinia change across the island. Can you perhaps give us an a brief overview of Sardinian cuisine, but maybe some specific foods that pair particularly well with some Sardinian wines that foods and and wines that no visitor who've comes to Sardinia should miss. Absolute must try. Absolutely. So one is, of course, the Portuguese, the Maleo in Italians, which is the, the baby pork, actually, which is maybe a bit sad to say, but it has always been a traditional fantastic food of Sardinia so that this little pork has to be around the six kilos weight and we we roast it in the fire with an iron stick and the the cooking, the the roasting needs to be very, very slow. About two to three hours cooking beside the beside the fire. So that, with this low cooking, so that the juice and the the freshness of this meat can can stay inside. And we can, we can enjoy at the best this particular kind of cooking and this particular kind of, of little pork. So this I think is the is the most typical meat of sardinia, but we have a lot of many different meats like the lamb, like sheep's meat, but also goat Alberto, what would be the ideal line to enjoy with the porche do? This suckling pig that is spit roasted directly over a wood fire. I would say cano now. Absolutely. A structure cano now, with, well integrated tannies Okay. Compared to the fat of the little pig. Okay. That would be the perfect pairing, I think, cano now and my electric. That's perfect. But then, Mark, I would talk about our fish dishes, our seafood because as I was saying at the beginning of our conversation, Sardinia is surrounded by the sea. By differently, we got the the West Sea, we got the north, the south, watching Africa, by the way, because we are very, very close to Africa. And also the ACC, and in these differences, We got even differences about the the different fishes. So we are very lucky. We we can have a raw fish in pairing with a with a fermentino or maybe some fish soup or a roasted fish our cuisine is very various. We got many differences and, yeah, we're lucky that's for. Yeah. And I guess this varied cuisine is easily matched with such a varied selection of wines. Alberto, what about some of the pasta dishes? I know the handmade pasta in Sardinia is very delicious. And again, something that varies across the island. Yeah. Of course, I would talk about the Frigula. Frigula is our wet pasta. They are little little pasta bowls made of wet. I personally really love, fragula with seafoods, like, fresh fish coming from our sea, like orata, like spigola, which are mostly our, traditional fishes that we can fish in our sea. Orata would be sea bream for us, I think. Yes. And, I think the guilt head, sea bream, with the gold on the head? Exactly. Yeah. And the and the spigola would be the sea bass. The sea bass. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. For the, would that be eaten quite soupy with or with a, a pasta shoot more drier sauce? I personally like it made in a soupy way, but also I wouldn't say pasta, but in a creamy way. Yep. It can create a fantastic cream Okay. With a Montecatura. Help me with this formal mark, please. Oh, okay. So when you're you're beating in the butter and the and the cheese, a pecorino cheese, I imagine, because pecorino from Sardinia is some of the best that you will find anywhere. Of course, we got, an ancient tradition for pecorino, but we put pecorino in the Frigula or anyways in in our first dishes when the Frigula is made with meat or also with with kachofi, with artichokes, which are traditional from Sardinia. In Sard, we have artichokes with the spikes which are delicious. And then we don't have, only Frigula. We got in the northwest parts also andarinos, so in the territory of a curvy winery, andarinos is a very rare pasta. Made by the old ladies and who is lucky to learn this traditional way of pasta making is very lucky. I would also like to learn to make this traditional kinds of pasta as regular as andarinos And also, I think the most rare pasta of Sedenya is the filling deo, which is made in the central part of Sardenya. So filling deo is, it's so rare that it is made only in Newora, which is, the central city of Sardinia. And this is made only by the ancient ladies in this city. The best way to make Philendale in the cuisine in the kitchen is with, with a soup of lamb or sheep. Mark, when you have time, my advice is to search on the internet this past a feeling they'll because it's very, very particular. I saw it only in Sardinia, and, I think we have it only in Sardinia. Well, that is fascinating. And it's a a wonderful overview, a quick overview, of a very complex cuisine that I know is varied and delicious from the sea side with wonderful, fresh seafood and shellfish. I've had some wonderful lobster in Sardinia. Yeah. Lobster. Right. To the heart of your foods of the inland, these foods of shepherds, these foods that that are almost foods you can eat with the hands and drink back these full bodied wines. You're making us all want to hit on a plane and visit and discover Sardinia, Alberto. So a final question at Cortamoro, in particular, but also within the Sardinian Tairwa. What about wine hospitality? Can our listeners visit and discover directly with the wine producers? Absolutely. Yeah. One of our goals, was even the one of hosting people at our wineries because we think that, wine tourism is very important for Sardinia. So that's, in all of our wineries, we do tastings, we do visits in the vineyards, and we explain our works on the field so that everyone comes to our wineries can understand very well what we do and what we produce. So first, visits in the vineyard to understand our work, then visits in the wine cellar. And we always finish the day without tasting of our wines. So starting from a sparkling vermantino, maybe, I would say we can taste the steve vermantino, the, other white wines and then we go more to the structure wise, so to the can now, to the bovale, and even sometimes we like to pair the wines with our traditional food. But, yes, we really like to to host people, to host tourists from, all over the world, well, in in our wineries. Extremely important. And, good reason for Italian wine podcast listeners, to discover Sardinia from an insider's point of view through meeting the wine growers themselves and tasting. Understanding, I think you're right. It's important to go into the vineyards, see this unique soil or soils of different terawatts, and then taste the wines. Alberto, we've only had time for a short chat this morning, but you've covered an immense amount of territory in your excellent explanations. Telling us not only about and its origins and activities, but also taking us on a quick tour all around this large island, both from the point of view of wines and also just giving us a hint of the wonderful flavors that we'll have on the islands. You've certainly made me want to return to Sardinia, and I'm sure our listeners too. So thank you very much for being my guest today. Thank you, Mark. Thank you again. And, yeah, I hope to to have explained Sard in the best way as possible in this short conversation that we had. Yeah. I loved it. You've done it very, very well. And, will you be at Vin Italy? Yeah. Sure. We will be at Vin Italy, all of us in the Sardinia pavilion. I'll make sure and come over and say hello when I'm there. Absolutely. Absolutely. We will wait for you. Well, thank you again, and I'll see you in a few weeks. We hope you enjoyed today's episode of wine, food, and travel with me, Mark Millen, on Italian wine podcast. Please remember to like, share, and subscribe Right here, or wherever you get your pods. Likewise, you can visit us at italian wine podcast dot com. Until next time.