Ep. 482 wine2wine Session Recordings | Reaching Through The Screen

Italian wine podcast. Chinchin with Italian wine people. Italian wine podcast as wine to wine twenty twenty media partner is proud to present a series of sessions chosen to highlight key themes and ideas and recorded during the two day event held on November twenty third and twenty fourth twenty twenty. Wine to Wine twenty twenty represented the first ever fully digital edition of the business to business form. Visit wine to wine dot net and make sure to attend future editions of wine to wine business form. I'm on screen now. I think that means that we're starting, Anthony. Here we are. Hello from both New York and Chicago. And if you are here, hopefully, you are here for reaching through the screen, delivering powerful, impactful, dramatic presentations, that take a whole new set of skills, which, Anthony, both you and I have been hard at work on, haven't we? Oh my god. I I don't know about your belinda, but I need a drink. Shall we shall we do a little toast? Listen. I mean, it is five o'clock somewhere. It is five o'clock in Verona, isn't it here? I have a little beautiful Benanti, end of Bianco from, from Sicily. I mean, I have a little mini, but I have plenty of them in the fridge. So I've got a little rose champagne for Moette. Sorry. Not drinking and theme today, but I know that there's a lot of champagne consumption in Italy. So happy to celebrate that today. Absolutely. So we're here to talk about cracking the code. Right, Anthony? Delivering two different styles of virtual experiences as both of us have been doing. Since March, I started on March sixteenth with my first one, and I know you also started quite early on. Yeah. I I I probably started a little bit later. It took me it took me a while to to get out of my paralysis. I was I was, I was literally paralyzed on the couch for about two weeks watching all of more events cancel like Domino's. I lost over eighteen events within a weeks of email. It's crazy. Oh my god. People. And I thought I thought we would we would kick off this way and talk about, what our live experiences are like and then talk about how that's changed completely. Is that a good way to kick off? So how do we delivering a live in person talk is a powerful, impactful, dramatic, and most importantly, fun experience, or at least it should be. And all one has to do is watch someone like Paul Mabry delivering one of his classic acrobatic high energy keynote speeches that winds to wind. To watch a master speaker in action. And it really involves action, not just standing at a lectern or, but working all angles of a stage to engage an entire audience. Look out across the room and an audience is is is measurable. Feeling the audience listening to you. Having their undivided attention is telling, and you either have them or you don't. Delivering a well timed, well positioned quip offers an opportunity to break the ice and hopefully get a reassuring laugh from the audience. This morning, for example, Stevie Kim took to the stage in verona to kick off line to line twenty twenty by saying, I'd like to welcome everyone here and then dead panned. There's no one here. I left too. I'm not I'll be sure that everyone at home left But the sad reality is that now without a live audience, all those familiar elements and feelings and techniques are literally trapped behind the screen. There's no stage. There's no live audience to react, and our audience's attention spans are likely much shorter than if they were in a meeting room or an auditorium birth theater with us. So how to reach through the screen. When I picked this, idea to wind to wind, I wanted to, to partner with you Belinda because the Wall Street Journal recently named you the global virtual virtual wine experience guru last spring at the gimbal. I'm blushing. I wanted us to share what we've learned since the pandemic postponed all of our live speaking gigs. Because we are both, I dare say, thriving virtually while hosting, two very different styles of virtual events. So I wanna start with you, Belinda. How did you become the global virtual wide experience guru? Well, before we get to that, I just wanted to take a peek at the live discussion, and thank you to everyone who's already participating. I see some highs from Tuscany and also from Poland and from Geneva. Woo hoo. We truly are global today, and so I'm good for my experiences. Just to answer your question and share, my name is Belinda Chang. I'm based in Chicago, although I've been on screen with people from a hundred and fifty countries since March twenty twenty and places that I have visited and places that I also haven't visited. So been great fun. And like you, I made my career in wine for many years, a few decades. I'm not gonna tell you how many, but basically, for the most part, in the beginning, in restaurants, many restaurants that I know I've greeted many of you in, at Charlie Troters in Chicago at the modern in New York City, at the fifth floor in San Francisco, and in a lot of restaurants that I put together the wine programs and beverage programs for Frjean George through Starwood. All over the world. So I started out with that, and in March, all of my clients canceled on me through all of twenty twenty. And I sat on my couch for a few minutes, and then I decided to get myself a Zoom account and figure out what to do because, obviously, in real life events, we're not going to happen for at least the foreseeable future. And now I think we see for quite a long time. So I started right away, and I started a thing on Sundays, which I was so glad to hear a few reach outs from people who have attended my global Sunday virtual boozy brunch, which happens every Sunday. And we've now done for thirty seven week and brings in a drink experience, a food experience, and also some kind of lifestyle experience. I'm hoping you'll come, Anthony, for the next one where we learn a dance routine that you can do with a glass of wine in your hand. So that's ready to dance. I'm ready to dance. And I was so excited to hear about you, and we just connected a couple weeks ago as we prepared for this particular panel and to share what we've learned. I wanna hear more, and I hope everyone also learned some great lessons from what you are doing virtually because we both, you know, spend time on big stages with big audiences and places like the food and wine that's been classic. And now you are also doing another version of this sort of virtual experience. Yeah. Thanks, Belinda. I I think, I think what separates, what the work we do, which is very similar, is that, we where we overlap is, like, like, the Food Lion Classic in Aspen, where we're out there, in front of the, you know, the big ten, two hundred and fifty people, and we're doing, you know, we're, like, we're raising the roof and going crazy. The bulk of my work for the past gosh, fifteen years has been, private client tastings. So I can never boast about them. I can't share them. I can't fill them. I could barely even tweet about them or or post them on social because everything is confidential. There's no screenshots of all the of all the Zoom screens. NDAs. Right? You've got all the NDAs that you signed. That's weird. Like, I mean, people barely will let me mail them wine, and I'm just trying to mail you free wine. People let me mail you the wine. But what what what that what that means is that, I had to turn to all of those private client, a client of mine and say, this is still possible, but it's gonna take a few extra steps, and that was where the challenge came. I mean, we can I wanna talk about this further in-depth with you, but, like, it was literally figuring out how to make it easier at first, how to get them to wrap their heads around how this would look because I didn't even know what Zoom was? A hundred percent had no idea what Zoom was. My wife, Tony, who's the winder, the marketing director for Food magazine, saw me on the couch sitting Catatonic and said, get off your butt. And figure out what Zoom is because that's what's happening. And I I I started to do my homework, but I had to then sell that to clients who I have no idea who I was talking about. And then also say to them, no, we can get one to them, but we have to figure out the whole minefield of getting wine shipped across interstate boundaries and, finding retail partners who are actually motivated and and agile and nimble enough to do it quickly and and, you know, get it get it to their houses. And then kick off the event. So So we're really here. I love that the title just came up on the Kyrod. It's wine to wine business forum sharing business ideas. So I think we're two people who could have just, you know, called in sick for the rest of the year and said we have no more business. To do. But I think it's pretty great that both of us figured out what to do with our businesses and fulfill this need. I mean, I've been reading all the New York Times and LA Times and Washington Post articles talking about what humans need right now, and that is to connect. And to be comforted and to engage. And I think these wine experiences are a beyond perfect way to give that gift to all the people who need it. And I also think it's really interesting when we were talking, you were saying that you know, speakers, people like us who, you know, our bread and butter was in real life experiences, sometimes in restaurants, sometimes in big tents. We need to reimagine what's possible instead of just trying to recreate. Right? So We've all been to the wine dinner with someone speaking. We've all sort of watched a webinar with a winemaker strolling through a vineyard, you know, sharing all the beauty. But I think what you and I are doing is very different from that, and we've created something that is completely different that is well loved. I know you've done hundreds. I can't even believe how many of these experiences you've executed for corporate clients. And I've done about a hundred right now, and I've done them from guests from six people to three hundred thousand lives. So it feels really good that we figured this out. And you share a little more about that and how we're sort of recreating experiences here and doing them online. It's, yeah, I'm I'm I'm not trying to beat you here. I'm I'm doing much smaller events. Mine are very intimate. Usually, like the perfect zoom is twenty five boxes. So two dozen people plus me, and that would include some of the clients and then their clients. I have done the big up to, you know, maybe a hundred, a hundred and fifty, but, I would say the bulk of my work is this, is the intimate ones. And, I've done over a hundred and fifty, and and there's a lot coming up in the next month. I would say first and foremost because we can't feel the audience. We can't see them a lot of times, like, especially I would imagine with you with three hundred thousand people, you can't see anyone. So it's like that webinar mode, but you have to involve the audience. So there are a number of ways to get the audience involved. Most of the virtual platforms, even if, you know, the interactive tools like polling, chat, Q and A breakout rooms, I typically ask guests to play wine jeopardy with me. And, you know, let's let's raise the glass really quickly to Alex Quebec who Those rest of the states know, thirty four years he led, a show called jeopardy here in the US, but I always play wine jeopardy, often asking, guests to, to repeat, to answer the question in question form, and it's a great icebreaker, that gets people really involved. Then, of course, there's the chat function, and you could, you know, like, I always say, like, let's break the ice by asking, a question before the event even starts, like, you know, how are we feeling today or which of the four ones do you predict you'll like most how many people think that the riesling you have in front of you is going to be sweet, which is always a great conversation because most people see that iconic riesling bottle and think, oh my god, I hate sweet wine. It doesn't even matter if it's not even riesling, it'd be gruner, but they just see that bottle, and they think that. And I love to you know, burst through it and say, no. No. No. It's gonna be it just trust me. I also like to say, so what's your favorite wine to drink when there isn't a wine expert asking? Because that's always what I find when the people say to me like, well, you're the expert. What do I know? And I'm like, you know exactly how to order whatever you want on the menu. You had to have your steak cooked, your salad dress, your bun toasted. You should absolutely not you absolutely know what your wine is. You just don't wanna tell me. But let's do it. Yeah. This is the same space. There was no wrong answer. Except one. And that answer is whitefinell. But other than that, it's just a safe place. I also love that we both kind of came to the same conclusion over the course of doing lots of these experiences for various clients. Mine is also a little consumer facing because their virtual busy brunch is free to the public, but we work with various brands to bring their brand stories to life. So in some ways, it is a sort of paid advertorial and can be an endorsement type, third party endorsement type thing, but it's really fun because we have millions of people that have come to experience it. But we both decided that Zoom and or all face to face platforms were our preferred. Because what we're talking about here with using the polling functions and having games and also being very engaged in the chats is we wanna have as close to a real life experience as possible in that both you and I, I think, agree, we love to be eye to eye. You know, I see a lot of Instagram lives and Facebook lives and things like that happening out there. And I think yours and my goal is to max max max the engagement and to bring in new customers and to broach new relationships from near and far. Right? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, and that's that's, you know, for me, that's everything. Like, I think that's why we're, you know, we've been kindred spirits for two decades, but, not being able to connect physically. And by the way, like, I I want. I'm completely inappropriate right now because I'm the guy who doesn't want to just shake your hand. I grab the elbow. There's like the chest bump, and there's the pat on the back, the double kiss, all of that, all completely illegal right now. But, so the best we can do is reach out virtually through the screen by engaging as much as possible, even encouraging, follow-up. I only thought of this probably halfway through the summer where I would say to everybody at the end. By the way, look at my name at with the impossible speed bump bump in the last name, Gio, which everyone says gigolo, gigolo, gigolo, gigolo, but look at that dot com is my website. You could ask me questions straight through there. There's nothing not I'm not walking anything on my website, but you could reach out to me. You could also add Anthony Julia through Twitter, through Instagram, reach out. Please g m me anytime, and I'm happy to answer when I can within reason. It might not be within ten seconds, but I will get back to you within a day I hope. And then if you want to take pictures from Costco and ask your for your wine recommendations and things like that, I got a I got I got one question which was, dude in men's room with wine list date waiting, and he snapped the phone on on the freezer. It was thankfully a wine list and a tile floor. I mean, so what's happening for both of us is we're becoming trusted advisors for a lot of people in this virtual space. When both of us were that before already, myself as a Sommelier in a lot of restaurants and yourself and being an education person and doing all of these sort of experiences in real life. I think it's really neat that we've managed to find this kind of connection with all these people. I mean, for brunch every week, I'm so stunned when I see someone from Belize or someone from France or from Italy, you know, we do it at one PM central time here, which is total appropriate time to start drinking. It's two PM in the eastern, on the East Coast, and it's, what is it, eleven AM on the West Coast, but, you know, we love to see people from all over Western Europe joining us as well because, you know, you can have a drink with us then too. It doesn't have to be brunch. It can be dinner. Or Deija Steve as well. Well, the word brunch opens it up to anytime you want, honestly. I guess. There you go. That's it. You can have breakfast at lunch together anytime you want anywhere in the world. So we have a bunch of people from all over, and I love that Michelle is noting that this eye to eye online is absolutely the best way to engage. So there are a lot of different platforms you can do that on, and there are platforms that have stages where you can have multiple people in green rooms and all that kind of stuff. And then have you worked with any platform aside from, Zoom to do these experiences? Only only twice. I'm not gonna mention names because I didn't love the experience. Not a paid advertorial for Zoom. Neither of us is Oh, no. So what I was gonna say is believe it or not. Like, I and and, yeah, with with no love from Zoom, they're not paying me to do anything. I do love the experience of Zoom better better than most. Yeah. And that takes us kinda kinda into the next part, which is we had both talked about breakout rooms. And I know that in sort of event speak, people are calling those private lounges or private tables, like you might have in a restaurant experience. Those are super cool and a great way, again, to engage. And I think I've done it for charity Galas. So, right? I mean, these four foundations and charity charities that used to raise a huge portion of their, operating revenue for the year through some kind of fabulous Galla. They're now selling private tables, which are essentially the breakout room function, where you can have it led by a sommelier led by a winemaker or winery owner. So it's a really cool use of that function. I love the breakout room thing. Super cool. Yeah, I was gonna say, Belinda, I I what's really funny is the I'm never part of the breakout room. I'm usually the warmer upper for the right person. So we again, since I'm doing most of these with with, with smaller private groups, the host wants me to get everybody relaxed and engaged and and feeling good after four bottles of wine tasted at least three times per per per per per wine. And then they'll say, okay. We're gonna take off and go into breakout rooms, Anthony. Thanks so much, and I'm gone. So that's the end of it. So I I've seen them used, but I haven't I haven't been in them. It's it's really fun. It's an experience. I mean, I've also been to those events where, you know, the DJ is in the large room, so everybody wants to be, you know, jumping up and down and dancing with their wine glasses there. And then if you wanna have a more serene moment with maybe a bartender that can reach back and tell you what to make with what's behind your bar, you can do that experience. So now you can do many experiences all in one, which is pretty amazing. Okay. So I wanted to talk about this next part because you are I think you've really mastered it and you figured it out long before I did. I'm following in your footsteps now a little bit in terms of how you become a virtual speaker and also an event planner kind of all in one. Yeah. It's it's incredible. And in fact, when you mentioned before, like, when you're on the crunches and you see people in the leaves or around the world, that's something I've I've actually traveled to to host that seminars or, you know, all all over the place. But, to have to then work on it from here, and sending wine abroad even to Canada is impossible. You have to you have to I've I've had to learn so many different, different vehicles to get wine to people abroad. And then try and sell it to the client that I might not be able to match everything exactly, but if the topic of wine number two is Chablis, it's not necessarily about the producer. It's about the wine and the conversation about Chablis and it's placed in the world of of burgundy and Charminate, etcetera. So, like, there's that kind of creative, that creative, license I have to take with it too, but trying to trying to ship around the world is because and I'm getting more and more requests from, from Europe to send throughout Europe, Asia, middle of the middle east. It's it's just been it's been astounding. It just getting bigger and bigger and bigger. So I'm I'm learning more and more platforms and services that could help me get around the world because god knows it's hard enough to get a wine from New York to Chicago as you know, it's not allowed. Not allowed in our crazy state. Our further in Europe, I just wanna joke that when I mean, I wanna say that I usually joke. We are fifty federal republics that don't get along, and that's not politics. That's wine. That is wine. It's a little crazy. I think I've been following your steps and been inspired by you. Now we're sending what we call experience boxes. Because as we all know, you know, wine is a wonderful way to connect and to comfort. You can geek out on it. But I think most of the people that you and I are dealing with, for the larger groups are consumers. And they love to receive sort of a gorgeous box, not just with a couple bottles in it, but I always create sort of a tasting mat so that they set up their vignette. We might also recommend flowers or candelabras so that they really turn it into a full experience. That's an hour, not just of me going on and on and droning about a wine in particular and also connecting, of course, but also so that maybe we can make the wine into a little bit of a cocktail. So everybody's up and moving and or maybe we're creating a little custom snack using spices that were included in the kit. So I've been having a lot of fun, including not just wines, but also spirits, and also spices and truffles and things like that. So people can be standing throughout the course of experience and having it multiphasic in a way. We can do the tasting here. We can go into the kitchen and make a little snack together. I just can't stand it, and I'm sure, Anthony, you are the same when you're doing any of these experiences and you see this. Right? We know we've lost them if they're on their phone. If they're doing this and they're snapping photos of it because they're gonna post the experience, then I'm really happy. And I feel like I've done my job. But if I lose that eye to eye connection, you know, I do something drastic to get them back. Yeah. Yeah. Linda, I was gonna say, well, that's the new evolution for me that in the beginning, I was well, first, like, if we look at the the there were three steps of of my entertaining evolution, which were in the beginning during lockdown, I would, you know, I we wanted people to stay home so we'd ship them wide, but then we would say, don't go to the store, raid your pantry, raid your fridge, and let's have a charcuterie, a charcuterie contest, throwdown. So we'd make people we'd have best in show off, show your your charcuterie platter, and, we would judge them all, like everyone would take shots, and then we hashtag them or append them, you know, do them within a slack or something. But, that was the first thing which was don't leave the house. It's really simple. You you have a million things in the house including any any manner of junk food, you know, potato potato chips. It doesn't matter. Yeah. And then it became clients would say, well, I wanna send a cheese package from Marie's cheese in New York. I'm like, okay, great. Do that. But then you have separate packages coming. And then it evolved to what you're doing. And what I figured out, you know, probably halfway through the summit, which was let's create beautiful custom boxes and packages that include everything. So you have this gorgeous kit that comes to you, and, you know, depending on the budget, it could be a beautiful box within a box that opens and has all the compartments that are custom made to all the little accoutrements including, you know, nuts and cheeses and and, and honeys and you name it. So that's that's really that's really where it's gone. You've taken it to the next level. I mean, you're shipping egg whites. I mean, egg whites. I think for these virtual experiences, it's very hard to hold people's attention for one hour. And, obviously, if these are sponsored experiences from brands and our friends who own great wineries, We want to give them as much time as possible to weave in the brand story and the winery story. So, you know, it's been really fun for us for brunches to find, for instance, a family owned winery that has sort of a generations old recipe that they think is the perfect match for their Sangiovese based red. And then we have the guests not just learning about the wine itself and about the story and about the family, but we weave in food and all of the culture. And I think it also helps because then the consumers who are watching this experience think to themselves. Okay. So whenever we buy this wine, we're gonna make this dish. Or every time we have a dish like this, it's gonna make us think of the wine. So it's not just like your usual, tasting. There's so much more going on, which I think is really great, and is why we can do it, you know, casually on a Sunday. I know most of the events you're doing, they have probably very specific targets in terms of, like, internal team engagement and or client engagement. So, you know, you don't have to be as crazy. Like, with mine, I I need people moving around and doing stuff, dancing, yoga, tarot card reading, all of it. What do you mean you don't have to be as crazy? I wanna be as crazy, but I have to be very, you know, thank you. I I dropped the tie. There's no more tie ever again, but I I will put on the pocket square for you. But, but, like, I I have to I for me, it's all this background engagement for for weeks leading up to it, which are don't mention this. Make sure you stroke this person. Bring up this one. Congratulate this person. Don't mention anything about this, this, or this. And then, you know, and then, you know, these are the people we're talking to. These are the people you don't have to talk to at all. They're on the team. It's it's it's so much more engaging than I've ever had to deal with before. It's fascinating. But, like, by the way, I wanted to say really quickly that, your your egg your egg white shipping Eblinda, I think Pfizer has stolen your technology to ship the first samples at That's embarrassing. I mean, the question was just I never answered your question fully before, but to say, like, so for me, it's about these retail connections, which, you know, have to be really nimble and ready to to send hundreds of bottles out till they need the inventory. So there's time to gather that inventory and then gather addresses while they're gathering the wine and they get everything out within hopefully two weeks. I mean, people think though it should be, like, you know, like, if you use a platform like wine dot com, which can ship within seventy two hours, that's great if it all goes smoothly, but I'm never willing to take those chances because Right. We have a lot of important clients that we can't disappoint. So I want at least two weeks of a buffer. So there's an information gathering. There's figuring out the shipping. Are we paying for expedited or not? How do we keep costs down? There's rehearsal times beforehand. So that's what all these these extras are throwing at me like, oh, by the way, so and so's gonna pop on, but they're not gonna put their camera on. Don't even know if they're there. There's instructions to guess that I send that in advance saying please chill everything even the red wines because Yeah. Forty five minutes by the time we get to them, they'll be in a perfect temperature. And that's a whole new learning curve for so many consumers who still drink their red wine at ninety degrees, which still throws me. Offering them something extra. Like, you know, like, and you, like, you have, you you have, you're the queen of the extras. For me, it's sort of like I wrote a lot of books ten years ago, but I could certainly send you something, or my favorite corkscrew or something like that. We're also offering offering them, like, a VIP session or, you know, I'll go shopping for you. Like, give me a link to your favorite website for your your top VIPs Yeah. To your retail site, and I'll go in and click my favorite five, x, y, z's, and then send them to that as a as a giveaway. Also send takeaways from the tasting, all these things. It's been crazy. But I think also, Anthony, that's a testament to you and your ingenuity that, I mean, it's a pretty crowded space right now. I feel like for virtual experiences, right? You can even be a vendor of experiences on Zoom, and, you know, everyone on Eventbrite is now offering virtual experiences. But yet, you know, you're very booked. I'm almost booked. So people have a little bit of space on my calendar, but Listen or working with vendor different. Very different styles. Yeah. But it's doing more and making it more engaging and making it more of a success for the client no matter what it is they're trying to do. I mean, for winery, obviously, they're trying to connect with new customers and sell more wine and share their story. And then, you know, for the corporate clients, they're they're they've got some goals Right? Yeah. Well, I was gonna say, look, I am the first to admit that I am the I am not the sommelier, I'm not the master sommelier. I'm not gonna talk to you about the subsoils of the rheingau. And if you want that I could spend you in plenty of directions. I'm the guy who's gonna give you just enough to know. Just to to walk away with learning having learned so much more than you ever imagine coming into it, even like simply had a taste and then tasting it without food and with food and see to see what happens. And then to make everybody laugh, laugh, laugh. That's I think that's why I have so many repeat, clients coming back to me because it's not just the wine tasting. It's an experience, literally an experience, and I I I I'm, you know, like, short of dancing like you, which I wouldn't mind doing, by the way. I'm happy to do it. I'm I'm trying to get people to lean forward and and listen and start laughing. Like, that's the whole point. It's like that's like from from live where you know how to do that, how you time something, you you pause just the right moment and you look at the crowd and then you you dead pan like Steven did this morning. Like doing that on virtual is tougher. So I'm in the constant, kinda, like, I'm I'm setting up the joke and and hoping that they're laughing. I could see people silently laughing, but That's that that's the goal that they should be taking, you know, like, I never learned so much and laugh so much. It's gotta be I love it. Yeah. I mean, someone had mentioned in the chats that they really loved this seminar from provence. And I've done actually some series both for Van de France and Van de Borgon and Loire Valley wines over the last couple weeks, and it was all just about just like you said, not just about giving tech details to consumers, but really helping them with shopping list and teaching them what to eat along with the Cromontalour or whatever we were tasting that day, and it's been a lot of fun. Okay. I see a couple questions for us, Anthony, in the chats, and I wanna address the first one to you. It says, as many people believe that you need to be technology savvy in order to kick off the virtual exploration, what are your opinions about that? And also, do you have any tips for wineries who are gonna begin their virtual adventure? Well, I would just say call us. Right? Exactly. Exactly. Exactly. We we can't tell you right now. We have you have to call us directly. No. I'm kidding. Well, that, like, again, I think I think all of us, but, like, I I think you definitely were up had to leg up on me on this, but for me, I learned it all literally like googling, how to do this, how to do this, how to do this. Zoom sends out tons of, great information too, and then I learned all the other platforms as well by just researching all this so I knew what the pros and cons were and just how to how to how to how to get them up and running. And then remembering that you needed a a really, you know, an interesting background, you're not supposed to I I don't know if you, but I'm never sitting down. Like, I stand up as if I'm on stage. Like, you know, I've I'm the camera for the car. You can feel your energy Yeah. Because, again, so, like, I I would say I have not sat down for one single tasting in in since March. I mean, if I'm up and I'm, like, I'm I'm, I'm trying not to move around too much because, you know, that, you know, I'm, and then I'm all hands, like, like, like, this, but What do you do? I've watched a few wineries. I've been I've just been a a spectator watching some wineries, and they try to, take the camera outside and walk through the vineyards, a walk through the cellar, and everything stalls and spins, and, audio cuts out. Like, that's that's super next level. You need a production company to do that. Yeah. I think it's I think it's great to be in your beautiful seller that none of us have. Right. You need Belinda to do that, and then I'll co host. So it's it's very simple. We have the whole package right here. Yeah. Right here. No. I think you're right. I mean, when I first started the first few episodes of virtual Busy brunch, I collaborated with TV hosts and producers because what we're doing now is we're showing off our quality and integrity and authenticity on camera. So, you know, we take a few tips from how they do it when they're filming movies and also, I think more significantly live TV. But we have another question, which I think will be a great one. I think each of us should maybe give one, at least one of these. Can you give three do and don'ts based on your experiences with virtual experiences? What are yours, Anthony? Oh, gosh. Susan, I wanna hear yours first, so I can look at them. I'm gonna say well, one, is do, make your setup beautiful. Right? I think, you know, we've learned this from our in real life experiences, and all of you have as well with your beautiful dinners and beautiful restaurants. I mean, you're making a statement about your brand, your wine, your winery by what your background looks like. Right? So, you know, I've seen a lot where people are sitting on their couches, which is totally fine, but, you know, zhush it up a little bit. I always have props that are apropos to what I'm talking about, so I can grab them if people are interested. And I think that people are loving getting all over the world. They're loving getting a peek at your home or wherever you're live streaming from, and we'll ask a lot of questions, and we get a lot of engagement that way. I think I have a second one, and then I'll hand it over to you, and that's don't look down. Have you been on a virtual experience where someone is really, like, emesh in the chats and and doing one of these. I mean, they're very inexpensive teleprompters, additional screens. You can also have a social producer, which is maybe just a son or a daughter who's taking care of the chats while you're giving your jazz hands to the camera? Those are my two. What do you got, Anthony? I was gonna say, like, I I really think that, it's worth doing a test with a friend with great taste. I happen to have a photographer who lives next door who during lockdown. So we really weren't even socializing at all. He saw me do a tasting with, a big group in New York City of of event planners. And he said, you need to move your camera. You need better lighting. I'm dropping a bunch of stuff on your doorstep, and then I'll and call me, and I'll tell you how to set up the lights. And he gave me beautiful lighting and told me to cock my camera sideways because I was sitting. I had the I had the the bookcase straight behind me. Oh. And he said, you know, we can see some depth It looks like you're a former fake prop, but I assure you all these bottles are regularly replaced. They are real. I am drinking. But you're set up, Anthony. It says something about you. You know, you care about Campari and Averna, which I know you do, and I do too. But I mean, you're definitely making a statement with what you have behind you. I'm gonna move on to the next question because I found a bunch of them, and that's okay, Anthony. Please. Please. So the next one is your video and lighting quality are really great. Do you have any tips in terms of camera set up? I we were talking about this earlier. Somehow, this is my live work space. It's a small seven hundred square foot apartment on Lake Shore Drive here in Chicago. And when I first started, I bought a bunch of these. Right? Do you have one of these too? I have a mega one that Foodah Wine sent me for the classic at home, and it's it's I swear it's it's about three feet in diameter. I mean, it's a pretty small amount of equipment. I mean, you do need a computer that is fast enough. I've been using I think you are too, a Mac Air laptop, and that is definitely, right, fast enough to be able to do HD video. I know a lot of people are doing video streaming and filming videos on their iPhone, but I think you lose something with that crop. Right? I think both of you and I are widescreen. You can do the same shot, I believe, on an iPad as well. You know, people wanna see sort of the panorama if they can and sort of visit you. So, I mean, I think those are really the two things you need, and you can be off and running. Of course, you can take it a little further as Anthony said in hire a production company and have somebody doing the chats for you and doing the spot lighting for you and all that kind of stuff, which I I'm lucky to have now, and Anthony has a solution for that too, which is really great. Okay. I have another one. It's from, Nitza and Piedmont, and they would like to know what we suggest for topics for social media posts from wineries. Do you have some ideas for that, Anthony? What would be interesting to the consumer in terms of the posts that they're posting? I I mean, for consumers that because, again, we're talking to the trainer. You might roll your eyes at these suggestions, but for consumers. I think it's so interesting that they have no idea that, about the seasonality of releases when new things are released. Yeah. When we're picking, when you're picking, when you're, you know, when you're waiting, what, you know, like, pictures from the from the vineyards of of what's happening. I think it's super interesting. I mean, that's as geeky as we should get, but, like, I think people have no idea that, you know, had the production schedules and and how that stuff comes about. Someone asked me last week, like, Oh, isn't this beaujolais season because beaujolais is coming out. They're the third Thursday. Remember, I'm like, yeah, but let's really talk about beaujolais crew when they come out in the spring. That's when you should pay attention to beaujolais. Like, things like that. Like, get that. But so for wineries, I would say it's it's it's actually, newsworthy to talk about what you're doing, not just bottle shots of our, you know, or don't you love our, you know, our latest whatever. We have the bottle shot and the wine glass open. Berta, Senia, from Berta also asks that same question. And I would agree with you, Anthony, a thousand percent. I think the other thing is people love things that are like insider information, right, that they can share with their colleagues and their bosses and their friends that make them sound smart. Right? Like, wow. Did you know that right now, Berta is doing leaf thinning, and it's looking like the vintage is gonna be x, y, or z. I think a lot of the classes that I've given, especially for people in business, They love to just have sort of little one liners or sort of insider tips and tricks that make them sound smart about wine. So if we can give them those kinds of things, I think they're, they're generally really happy. I don't know about you, Anthony, but lately, I've been giving a lot of the, sort of, stump the sommelier little tips. Yeah. I yeah. That's that's exactly right. That's one of the games we play. It's like, try try trying try and fool me or try and try and make me guess. Well, I'm getting mission control in my ear saying we have to go because the translator is needed it was so much fun. We went over time. It was too fast. We didn't even get to finish our wine. So cheers, wine to wine. Thank you for having us. We hope to be back next year. And until then, you know where to find us. Cheers everybody. Listen to the Italian wine podcast wherever you get your podcasts. We're on SoundCloud, Apple Podcasts, Himalaya FM, and more. Don't forget to subscribe and rate the show. If you enjoy listening, please consider donating through Italianline podcast dot com. Any amount helps cover equipment, production, and publication costs. Until next time.