Ep. 1390 Pablo Fernandez Interviews Anderson Hernanes | Clubhouse Ambassador's Corner

Hey, guys. Check out Italian wine unplugged two point o brought to you by Mama jumbo shrimp, a fully updated second edition, reviewed and revised by an expert panel of certified Italian wine ambassadors from across the globe. The book also includes an addition by professoria Atilushienza. Italy's leading vine geneticist. To pick up a copy today, just head to Amazon dot com or visit us at mama jumbo shrimp dot com. Welcome to this special Italian wine podcast broadcast. This episode is a recording off Clubhouse, the popular drop in audio chat. This clubhouse session was taken from the wine business club and Italian wine club. Listen in as wine lovers and experts alike engage in some great conversation on a range of topics in wine If you enjoy listening, please consider donating through Italian wine podcast dot com. Any amount helps cover equipment, production, and publication costs. And remember to subscribe and rate our show wherever you tune in. Today is actually Friday. We usually do this on Thursdays, but today is a special occasion. I don't know why, but It's on Friday. Maybe Larkin can tell us. Lika. Hello, Lika. Hi, Citi. What's going on? Why is it on Friday? Well, I've got I don't know. I think it's the availability. That's why. Okay. So So of course, Leica is our clubhouse manager. And today, we have with us our this is where our Italian White Ambassador can choose their favorite brown wine producer, and they do more like a fire start side chat, the guest. And today, let me just introduce you first, Armaud from Armaud squad. His name is Pablo. Chow Pablo. Chouseaving. Chow Pablo. I'm very happy to have. Is this your first club house? No. No. Actually, it's the second one. Oh, it's the second one. Who did you do first time? It was with Angelo from Varvalloni. Oh, yes. Yes. You're right. So Pablo Fernandez is from Brazil. And I'm pretty excited because this is actually how we met originally. Right, Pablo? Exactly. Yeah. It was a year. Yeah. And he has since been, stalking us, one of our favorite stalkers on Clubhouse, and he decided to join us, at Italian, wine school, which we run. It's called Vinitally International Academy. To become an Italian wine ambassador. He actually joined us on our satellite edition in London two thousand twenty two, which is just last year. And then he came, to Vinicty this year, and we, had a very good time. So and but you originally started in engineering. So you're an engineer. Is that correct? Yes. Yes. My background is engineering. Yeah. So and then he he got the wine bug, and now he is both, w set, level three, Italian Mind Scholar. And of course, the most important thing, the Italian wine Ambassador. Yes. Congratulations. Thank you. And now it's just like here, like, a road that you're also you've started the diploma certificate. Yes. Yes. How's that going? It's very demanding. You thought you thought Vineito International Academy was bad. Right? It's tough too. Right? The dilemma. Both both are of both of those. Have you done your, d three yet? No. I'm I'm setting up the d three now probably between June and July of this year and the the exam next year. Too bad you're not around because I had started the diploma, you know, studies, but I've only done one and two. So they call the beast, the d three world, world wines, and no stow lines. And I've not started that. I've kind of abandoned from, for about a couple of years now already. Listen. So Pablo, you are going to now interview Anderson Hernanes. Hernanes. Is that correct? Yes. And is is Anderson with you? No. No. Actually, he's in Italy. He lives in Italy. Well, where is Anderson? Cause I don't see him? Yeah. We're trying to to put him. There. Because front house changes that the interface is so difficult. He's here now. Okay. Let me invite him. So in the meantime, to you, would you like to tell us why you've invited you've selected Andrew's Anderson, to be your, interviewee today on this call today? Yeah. Yeah. Of course. On reason number one, and he's a Brazilian make wine in Italy. Oh, yes. And Fellow Brazilian. Yes. Okay. And he's a hundred percent involved in the process. So and also, I connected with Hernan is because, he shares a similar passion driven approach to his mind project, which also happened to me, so the change in career in the middle you know, midlife crisis. We discussed a debt here, but not he's not in the midlife crisis, of course. He has retires, football player. And I believe only He's a football player? You mean soccer? Yeah. He's a he's a for soccer. Yes. A very famous one in Italy, actually. Oh, okay. Exciting. So but he's now making wine in Italy. Is that correct? Yes. Yes. Okay. Alright. Then his story is very interesting because he was a very successful football player. And he played it in the biggest, Italian clubs like Latio, internationale, ventus, won the the the the championship in Italy, and also here in Brazil, player of the World Cup play at the Olympics. So a very successful football player. And usually you don't expect a football player to become a white maker after Right. Before a year. That's what happened to him. So that was that caught my attention. And, of course, I met him in Vinitally. That is last unit received. Oh, that's exciting. Because there was, like, I went to this hall. There was a booth. It was called the champions of wine or wine champions or something. And but there were it was more like a celebrity wine club. You know? So that's something different. Whereas, he is actually making wine. Andres Yes. Very good. Totally totally into. Okay. That's very I'm very, looking forward to this conversation. So what are the learning objectives as, you know, we get a little bit geeky around here? What should we expect from your call today? Well, learn more a little bit about the tejoatum of Moferrato and the native grapes that Cado ProFetta produces their wines. I also understand how someone's so successful in their profession prior to wine And even being an idol in two countries like Brazilian, Italy, in both there, have this disconnection. How this profession, can start a wine business on a small scale, completely motivated by passion, also learn about the effect of agricultural wine tourism on the business of a small wine producer. Mhmm. And also to show how good stories can help sell more bottles of wine, especially to those outside the the wine bubble. So that's good. Sounds like a perfect, wine marketing course as well. So I am looking forward to this. I am going to now, leave you, the entire floor to yourself and Anderson. And, you know the drill. I will probably be back towards the end of the transmission and see if there are any questions from the audience. Okay? Okay. Alrighty. Over to you, Pablo. Okay. I'm going to do a little introduction of hernani's. I understand hernani's the car value on Rajilima. Better know as hernani's or simply the profit was born in RECivi, Brazil in nineteen eighty five. A successful athlete with great skill, ball control, and a powerful shot with both with right and left legs. Hernani's played for various things both in Brazil, San Paulo, Italy, Latio, and Yventus, and even in China, as well as representing the Brazilian National Team during the two thousand fourteen World Cup, and also in this two thousand eight summer Olympics. He won titles wherever he went, such as the Brazilian Championship twice with São Paulo, the Italian championship with Yventos, and copper Italian with both Lacio and Yventos. As for wine, Afghanistan's had no previous contact with it and was abstinent until two thousand ten. When some power sold him to Latio in Italy. From there, a passion for wine completely took over. When he moved it to internationale de Milano in two thousand thirteen, two thousand fourteen season, the midfielder began to take this his passion seriously. Things progressed even further between two thousand fifteen and two thousand sixteen when the Brazilian transferred to Yventus. Upon arriving in Torino. Ernane's visited several wine regions. They became enchanted by Mocerato. At the time, he didn't own a house in Italy and thought it would be the perfect place to establish his residence. So he started looking for something there. During the searches, he founded Cado Profeta, which he purchased in two thousand fifteen. In addition to the cop, the professor, Cado profit winery, Ernani's also owns Cado profit, Ristorante, and Relay's. I want to reason destination and also, I want to be sure ernanis, thank you very much for accepting my invite here, and welcome. It's a pleasure to be here with with you guys, and to share a bit of my passion and my worth now because as you guys said, Now I, you know, I retired and I kind of hundred percent into the wine, and I it's very nice to be here and to share the stories and what makes me change life. K. Thanks so much. So the first question is how did your journey with wine began? And what sparked your interest in it? Yeah. Your ad said something. And, it is very interesting because when I arrived here in Italy, almost thirteen years ago, I didn't drink wine at home, and I didn't know anything about it. And also, I had some prejudice based on my ignorance about the wine because I thought it was grape juice. They add alcohol. And I and since I am Yeah. I I was completely ignorant about that. And, also because I am from a receive in Brazil, and I was, drinking only Jewish made of like natural fruits, you know, and then I when I heard thought about that. I was like, no. I I don't want to drink wine because they rain the the white, the the the the the Jews, and thirteen some alcohol and that. So I was completely ignorant, but when I arrived here in Italy, then, the friends invited me their homes, restaurants, and, I couldn't find I I couldn't find nice, Jewish. I start trying some wines. And then I got very curious about to to understand more and more and was, like, away without, like, no return. Then I was every every year, every month, I get to know him more. And then when I arrived to Milan, I came here in the Barrolin Babaresque and Barbera land to make a visit. And when I arrived here, I saw the, the, these little hills And then I fell in love with this, landscape here. And I decided, oh, my gosh. I want to have a farmhouse here, little your heart in the back. So I was a family love. First love. Yeah. First sight love. Then, and so, yeah, it was like this because when I and every time I was, going in a wine cellar to make a visit and I find a family of third, fourth, fifth generation, they were producing wine. I was, like, even more enchanted And, these things was, like, just growing and growing. And, yeah, he, he, I am. Interesting. So that's a good juice. Right? Yeah. Yeah. It is basically the same with, like, a process more than, you know, it's always bad. Yeah. No. No. I totally relate to that because I think even, until two thousand ten, I barely drink wine also. So was something that is very recent in my life also. So, and suddenly you you you start to understand that it's something that is the culture, the story, and a very human thing wine. So that's really, catch catch you in a way that you cannot escape after that. So how have your experiences traveling and playing football in Italy? Informed your understanding of wine culture. How how did the that built, on you? Because, of course, it was after going to Roma and to Latsu that you became a a wine drinker. So How how these experiences are held with that in Italy? Yeah. So I used to say that the the football, gave me the possibility to, to have access to many things. And, and then it was nice because in here in Italy, they are very passionate about football, you know. And then everywhere I tried to go to visit a wine cellar. The biggest ones, to most important ones, to those, like, not knowing, little one. They always, like, had, doors opened, you know? And then that was the beautiful thing that, was kind of easy to me to fell in love with this world with with this culture because always I found doors open. And then they were, literally teaching me, main things. I can tell you, for example, Varesio is a great, barolo producer. And he, like, produced barolo for, like, thirty years. And his barolo is amazing. His barbera is amazing. And then, he was teaching me how to, to cut, how to plant. And I was like, I got myself thinking, oh my gosh. Why, you know, are you this guy teaching me those things that he took? Many years to, to learn. And so, but that's the point about being football player here in Italy because you have access and also, visiting displays And I like this. For example, when I was playing to to you, ventus, I was training in the morning. And then the afternoon, I was like, have lunch, had lunch in, in the club. And train center, I going to, like, to visit one seller in the afternoon. So I was doing that many times. And, that's how I, like, build my build up my wine, make a wine lover carrier. That's great. That's great. Yeah. Yeah. Training in the morning and going to wineries in the afternoon. That's that's amazing. When did you decide to start a winery? And what motivated you to take that tank? Which is a big one? Yeah. That's nice. That's nice question, you know, because, okay. So The first thing was that, as I told you, if I'm in love with this, this area, Monterato, hills, and language hills, they call it, calling us. And then the landscape. And then I said, I decide I I have been here in Italy for five years, and I didn't achieve any properties to me. So it's take to take to to to make this decision. And I said to myself, okay. I decide to have a house here, a farmhouse with a little garden. And then when I arrived in this, particular place, I found the house that I was looking for, but then, I found a guy, which was, like, third generation wine producer, and he had the vineyard. Bigger than I was looking for. I I looked at for just a small yard, you know, backyard, but then, he had, like, five act hectares and property. And then I said, ah, nice. At this time, I was I was already, yeah, totally immersed to this culture, gastronomic, wine tourist. And and then I decide to, like, okay. Nice. I was looking for a farmhouse, but then Let's make also the wine and was in that moment. But, okay, one thing is you say like, let's make the wine, but then I start building the algorithm that we're gonna talk a bit later. And, and then, I I started. I took three years to build up everything one year only for the permission to build because here is the area and then you you cannot, like, build up the things that you want. You have to respect many roles. And I took, like, to complete all the process for five years, something like that. And then when I arrived I arrived there, I said, oh my gosh, what I have made here, you know? And then, I was asking myself why, why, why, but sometimes when I I am, like, before of a glass of wine, and I a great wine. And then when I drink, I understand everything because those feelings that you feel how, when you drink a very nice wine, then there was the, like, that momentum that impulse that gave me to, like, just go deeper and don't look back. And, I like this because I, I mean, I want to transmit that that sensation, that those feeling that I am feeling when I drink. I'm very nice. So the wine is the, is the, the perfect result of your passion. So you can, transmit the message to people, by using the wine, like the the wine you could do so you can, Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Because, I mean, when you think like, okay, it's totally different between Football and McCoy. Okay. Yeah. But then, when I was playing football, I was trying to, make score goals, make some dribbles, some things different, you know, to understand people. And when you, ends the same thing that I I I I want to do now, go, entertain people, bring joy, bring, and jump. How they say, you know, those those sparkles to people, and that's the point. Yeah. Interesting there. Because you you were a very talented, player for real. Like, it was very nice to watch your play. Even if you're not rooting for some Paulo or other, teams, it was very nice to watch your play. Like, you're already elegant and world class players. So I I I want to ask you, about this. How does your passion for wine intertwined for a lot for football if at all? Like, if you you just told me that that you wanted to to to to to show people the same thing that you you when you were playing in the field, like, the the the the the beauty of the game, like, you want to to to pass people the beauty of the wine, maybe. So Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. And, as I said, no. Because when I was outside of this world, when you heard, when I was hearing something about wines, all those complex words and techniques and all those things. I always just think like, oh, those things is not it's just for, you know, marketing. But then, now I have I had and I have access to, as I said, to visit the most important wine sellers in the world, in Italy, in France, and those things. And then you can perceive the difference of the the things that is, the history of those one sellers of those products. And then, I feel like, okay. I can, make people also, introduce people to those things. And, And that's the point also. Also because as you mentioned, I have a restaurant, then we make some lunches that I open bottles, just like, I feel like open a nice bottle that moment. For my clients that now they became kind of friends because they came constantly. And then I said, okay, now let's open this, this bottle is by me. And, so just because the bottle, we have to open it. And that's it. That's the point to, because I I hate, and I don't like exclusion, you know, and I am like inclusion person, and I I use that to, in the in the one's word. Okay. So let is let's talk a little bit about the the winery. So what's the story behind the name Caddel Profeta? And it's his significance to you. Yeah. Because, I mean, was my my nickname in football. And as I said, when I started playing here in Italy. They already know me by this name because this nickname was given to me in Brazil, and I arrived here. They already know me. And, on my career, they were calling me like this. And in the beginning, I was looking for just a house, a farm house, and then, is abbreviation of Casa. What means house in, in Italy, you know. And then, Calal Profeta means house of the prophet, you know, and, that was the point because it must be my house, my farm house, then, I mean, I think. And in Italy, you can find a lot of, a cattle boss who come out here on the cattle bio. So it's a, like, common name, you know, this abbreviation, like, because before as we said, they are very traditional and, the wine sellers, the restaurant, before, to became a restaurant, they were like, just house Indeed, it's like this because, the grandmother, if you go in the restaurant, Chattoria, here, you can find a lot of grandmother that is in the kitchen cooking because it's familiar, business, you know, and then that's why you can find a lot of car here. And I always just, following the same same tradition. Okay. And how how has your background as a professional athlete? A football player influenced your approach to managing your winery? Actually, I I have to say that my approach to to the wine changed, a little bit my way of to see, my work as a footballer. Oh. You know, because yeah. Because when I was playing, I always tried to be like the best, the best of myself, always to improve. But in football, sometimes you cannot be very precise or scientific method because when you are in the pitch, you are kind of you use the, the system, the brain in yourself that is, like, creative that came to you in that moment. You have to take decision that, I mean, you didn't think before. You, you, you didn't plan, but just came to you in that moment. And that's the beauty of the game. And sometimes, I was very, like, using all that system. But then when I arrived to, the wine sellers to make visitors, and then they were explaining me, like, how precise was, like, the temperature to, get the fermentation, to start the fermentation, and then the the pressure, the pump to make the works in in the in the cellar. So the the sugar grade. So everything was very controlled. And I was like, oh my gosh. But when you think, like, about grape is just like a fruit is, nature's product. And you think that, that's it. But, okay. But they use a lot of, like, scientific, stuff precision and those things. And I and my approach to the, to football, to football, changing a bit. I was, like, trying to be, and try to research on myself how I could get more, relational and less, like, creative emotional, you know, and that's helped me. But then, My approach to the wine is just that. I I'm I have my ideas very clear, and I get to improve every year, to improve the quality of the wine because I I play I play just for for quality and when I not find that thing that I want, I will not stop research, you know, because quality for me is the best thing. I mean, I don't I don't work for, I don't search quantity, just quality. And I I can give everything to find that thing. Then I I I think like that. It's the same approach in football, similar personnel in the wine. Nice. Nice. Curiosity. How do you manage the expectations that come with being as famous now retired football player, turning the wine a winemaker? Actually, as I was, you see, like, same approach. So I don't care because as I said before, I I had my ideas clear. And then because, it's like, double cut knife. Being famous, you know, because they think, okay. It's easy for you because you are known then people will like, buy your wine in those things, but, there is also the other part that they think, oh, you were a soccer player. Why? What do you have now been a wine producer? Then you you have, like, two things, you know, that, for for people. That's the point. The people that was that were following me, like a football player, in general, they are not interested in wine, and people that interested in line. They don't care about you being a football player, films or not. They want to, to deal with a good line, and that's the point. So sometimes I think myself I I got myself thinking how to this contract and how to say to destroy the image of, football footballer to build up the image of, a winemaker. So, but then as I said, I don't think more. I don't care much about what other the expectation with other people because I know what, I I want to achieve. And then, of course, the nice and positive feedback is nice to hear. Negative putbacks is, important to learn. But as I said before, since I had main experience I had the idea the clearer idea, then I I know, so the direction, that I want to go and I keep going. I keep going. And I know when I arrived there, people, will be, like, satisfied with the product because, as I said, we research, we play for quality. Right. Right. Yeah. Definitely. And what are the most rewarding and challenging aspects of being a winery owner, especially being from outside Italy? Of course, you are famous and you are an island in Yventos. That helped a lot, but still, what is the the the the challenging is in also the new orders? Yeah. They show yeah. The challenging is that because some people, they are, like, kind of avoiding, you know, because they think of it is was, x player. So I his wife must be, like, expansive. So those things are and then that is the challenging part that you have to deal with. You have to show them that, okay, you know, I was a footballer. Now I'm doing something else. Then is a challenging part. And, the rewarding is like deal dealing with people. I I love that. And before I I was dealing with people, but from a from distance because I was in the pitch, they were, like, in a tribune. And then we didn't have, like, many, like, you know, contact now. I am dealing daily with people and it's very nice. Dealing with people and when people are going, like, yesterday. I was in the restaurant and I had guests from America, from Florida, and then they, ate, drink my wine, and then they are like, oh, very good. Very nice. So and then they are going going away, like, satisfied. And then that's the the rerouting part that people just, experience a nice moment, a nice experience, a nice location. So nice moment. Yeah. That's very rewarding. Like, having people at your home, and they are having a great time. So, very, workable moment. It that's that's the thing that's, worth in life, actually, in my opinion. So, yeah, I I totally agree with you. So let's talk a little bit about your wines. So, what unique characteristics those, Montal deescalam, they bring to your wines and which grapes do you have in your wines? And let's talk a little bit about them. Yeah. We had we had three grapes, you know, a soil on a planted, grino, barbera, and brachytto. They are all talking grapes. Very, like, from here, from Monterato, and they have, the best, How do you say? They they they show up the the best qualities here in this territory, for example, you know, and because the terroir is, we we found a lot of calcium carbonate, calcareos. And, and we have we have a lot of, like, acidity present in the wines. Also, the tannin, And, for example, when you take green olino, it's like a very light, red wine. It's only thirteen percent of alcohol. And determine, you feel that you are in because it's present present in the in the wine, even though, the maturation that, the agents only and it's still in the bottles, but you still can feel the tannins that is characteristic of the of the amount. And then you can find the barbera, which is like, completely different because it's strong wine, full body wine, and we make two different ways only in steel, and for these people, they prefer more, this barbella made in steel because you can feel more of the fruit. And because barbella is known by fruit, intense fruit and acidity. But then we also make, a park in the barracks. We age in the barracks. Like this, we can, we can get this part of the international clients, international people, which, like, this, vanilla taste. This is more complex, you know. And, and then Bracheto is the the set wine that It's very fresh. And that you can pair them with, a nice dessert based on fruits, also chocolates. And we try to make balanced wines Even though we had this, we have this character, excuse me, the tanning, the acidity, we we try to balance the fruits with the acidity, with the, the tanning, because as you as you mentioned, our word, talking about me when I was playing that I was from elegant. And, I, I try to to make the same that that the wines can be elegant. It means balanced. These are wines that are very, food driven, right, because the excellent pairing for lunch for for China. So what's your favorite wine and food pairings in your in your in restaurants? So, we have, of beet beet root, New York. On top, we have this, Buena caulder, cream, form. That my account is a typical dish from Piamonte. It's make with a lot of garlic and a lot of, a chugga. A chugga is, kind of sardinia. Something like that. I don't and how to know the the word in English for, I I shug it. But, I mean, miss, those little fish, you know, little fish with, a lot of garlic. But as I said, we try always to make the things balanced. And then this dish is very nice, because we can find this beet root in yorkie, not potato in yorkie, and this form of bianca powder on top. And, I mean, since I'm also working in the restaurant, as a familiar, and I before our service, yeah. Yeah. Because, yeah, I love it. You can really I'll do the whole thing. And so, yeah, for now because our familiar last year, he has gone, and then it's very hard to find. So people to work now in Italy, then I said, okay. Let's do that. But I mean, and then, yeah, and then I was, like, pairing this dish with a red wine, red light wine. I mean, not strong wine. But then I found, like, a from, not so young, not so old. Something like four years, four years old age. And then, I mean, the the parents just I mean, it's the best pair. I I I I have a eight And I am very happy with this with this combination because one thing, so it is very, coherent with another thing in the dish and the wine, and, it's very nice. And also, sirloin, with, our Babera, Barbara, that's superior. So it's also a nice, but more like classic, pairing, you know. But the first one that I said is just, I mean, yeah, just I love it. Nice. I asked you that because it's lunchtime here in Brazil. I didn't have my lunch. I just had to ask. So, you good point about you being a familiar at your restaurant. So what do you hope people take away from their experience at Cado Profeta, whether they are tasting your wines or dining at your restaurant or staying at your added to this move? Possibly the whole package, you know, like, As I mentioned, those Americans couple, they were like, drink my wine, eating the restaurant, they were is sleeping close by. They came, like, walking. And, one one piece, glad to know. And, but I mean, the whole the whole package, it's it doesn't mean the, what I I look for because that was I was doing when before starting that, you know. Also, that's why I am now proposing those, on those service because I was looking for a place like you could eat very well and then drink very well. And then dinner time, get late then. So before, go back home, we we was sleeping. Over there. So that's the complete experience that you can find. Italian wine podcast brought to you by mama jumbo shrimp. Yeah. And the place is turning. Like, I never been to Mufferato. I have to go there, visit you, actually. And the place is amazing. Like, so beautiful. No. And I I I I no wonder than to but your your winery there because it's very very you fall in love with the place. There's no no doubt. Yeah. Of course. Indeed. Some people ask, how come you, like, travel the whole world? Why? Why? Why? You know, and I say, like, but look outside. Just just take a look in. I mean, no no words is required. Just like, it's beautiful. I mean, I for me, it's beautiful. Yes. And how do you see the future of your venture? Both in terms of winemaking and winer reason? So I I plan to be one of the best destination here in in the faratto because of the great quality of the of the of the of the food. And and also because I have, excellent wine. So I mean, it's not like kind of, proud or thing. But when I was playing, you know, I I I was, training and doing everything to be, like, the best. And then the same thing here, I want to make the best, Barbara, the Mufferado, And, so that that is my goal. And then I I want to be, like, as I said, best destination for food and also for wine. That is my plan. Nice. Nice. Now I want your advice. What advice do you have for other athletes or individuals considering a career in winemaking in, in, or starting their own winery? So I'm not a businessman, and then I cannot, like, say, oh, make this because, this is the number, that you will get. So, no, I'm just, as I said, is a stir of passion, you know, and I love food. I love wine. I love, have a great time. And then, so my advice is, like, if you fall for the territory, the story, and then guess a number of things, then just go to it and give your best. And, also, we are receiving a lot of foreign people from North, not Europe. Then they also came here and travelogue and they are, not maybe not, building, one seller on restaurants, but a lot of them, they are buying houses here, you know, farm houses here. And, so just because of, as I said, and when you'll find something that spark on your eyes, then just go for it. That that's my advice. I mean, not the if you want to play football and, you are in age in a age that you can play, just go for it. So I mean, just follow. Just follow your heart. That's my my my advice. It can be, like, not everyone can can do that. I I am also aware of that. Not not, ever people are lucky enough to follow their heart, their their passion. But if you can go for it and invest and give all the energy, all the intelligence that you have, but you go for it. That's my advice. Yeah. I think following your passion, even in the hard times, makes you stronger to move forward, I think. So, yeah, it's a it's good advice. I think, of course, having a winery requires a lot of investments. Not only with money, but with, effort with, a mentally also because you have to be there, and it takes time to to get your money back there. So but still follow your passion. I think it's a very nice advice. And my last question, can you share any of course, you are a very famous football player in Italy? So can you share any interesting stories or anecdotes from your time visiting other wineries or learning about wine? Or even your winers in Carlos Profeta with defaultzipan visiting, Colorado ProFeta? No. I mean, I can say that it's nice when people fans come from Rome, for example, to visit me, lots of fun, of course, because they are from Rome. And, it's very nice. When I found I'm I when I meet Brazilian people, they are coming here, and the the best the best ones is when people don't know that the restaurant, the the wine is made by me. And then they arrived here, and so they have, the surprise you know, how is you? You know, so it's very nice. But, I I remember visiting wine cellar. I took, a friend of mine the time of juventus, he was, young, five years younger than me, and then he was starting his journey and get to know whines. And also me was, like, in the beginning, you didn't know much. And then we were in a barolo, Juansella. And then in the end, we had the negotiation, and then the end, we started, like, has, okay, let's pick up that that bottle and also that. And that's also that because we didn't, we we didn't know the price. Was like for us was not famous borrowers house, you know, but but all important new wines, but all the wine in cellar. And we we were thinking like, okay. The the cost would be like, okay. And then in the end that we took, like, main bottles and then the then the, the guy told us the price and we, like, almost like a fellow because I was very, very high priced. And then I I felt like guilty because I was introducing him to this world, you know, and then, we got, like, he in the first visit, he was spending a lot of money. And I said, look, look, I didn't know the price. So if you want me to buy your wife, no problem because you will, arrive home with this, expensive bill. I don't want to, you to to fuck fight with your wife, you know, so it's why my my responsibility if you want to me to buy. So why do I it's very nice. And sometimes we remember that at that moment. Hey. You you got the wine bug to other to other person. That's interesting. Yeah. It's a very passionate world. Like, it's not it's not hard to fall to fell in love with wine, especially if you are going to the best wineries and drinking very quiet. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's yeah. So oh, just just the last, how many bottles do you produce at Nunnies now? Now around twelve thousand. Twelve thousand. Okay. Okay. Mostly cellular, or do you export us? You export to Brazil, of course. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Yeah. We we do also one third, one third of the wine in Brazil, then and the other part to stay here and a a a beach in America as well. Okay. Okay. That's it, Stevy. Good number. Okay. Those are like your fans. So listen, I have a question. One simple question. Is your I'm I am so sorry. I don't know who you are. I know nothing about Saka. Is your first name Anderson or Hernandez? So it's, double name Anderson Ernanes, and then my surname is is, the carvalho under Adelino. Oh my goodness. Alright. So your your name is both Anderson and Hernandez. Yeah. What what do your family call you? Everybody called me Hernanes. Hernanes. Of course, your fans call you, professor, from what I understand. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right? So what is your, are you still you're producing four wines, twelve thousand bottles? Are you planning to increase, the production side, or are you quite happy with your production four wines, four labels? Is this kind of where you want to stay in terms of the wine business? Yeah. Good question. Actually, I don't want to produce main type. Maybe, for example, now, three days ago Mhmm. We finished to plant Nebula. And then I And then I, when I start producing the biola, also a kind of, spumante, then maybe I would still like spumante ne biola and only Barbeira, for example, no. So three, four wines. I don't want to, like, if you have, ten types of wines, and hundred both, ten towers of both. No. I want to stay, like, small. And as I said, in quality, and that's it. I mean, is is what I think now. Right. Because you you started, about twelve years ago. Your first when was your first vintage? Sixteen. So sixteen. So you've been doing this. Your, you know, your first vintage was sixteen. So you've had, you know, six seven vintages. And so as of now, you'd like to stay quite small. You service your, your restaurant, your hospitality, some wines in Brazil, you're quite happy with that. Right? Yeah. Yeah. I would say. Yeah. Yeah. So, hernandez, What is your typical day like? I mean, going from a footballer to, you know, winemaking. And how involved are you actually in the winemaking process? You said you just wanted Nebula but, like, how involved are you? Okay. Yeah. So I have, the ex owner. Mhmm. He is working with me because as I said, he was, like, third generation wine producer. And then luckily, we had, like, this, good imprint that we he now is working with me. And and then he is very smart expert. He knows everything about planting, producing all the, you know, the steps of the chain. Mhmm. And then, we have, they're an oligo as well. Mhmm. And then I the other day I wasn't there, and the wine seller talking with them all, tasting the wine, then say, like, okay, let's this year, let's do less. How to say. And because I learned everything in Italian. You can say Italian. It's okay. Yeah. It's travaso. Travaso is when you, like, the wine is in one, still, boxed, and then you have to make the, to the other one. No. And then you have to because of the segments of the the wine. Mhmm. Stay on the bottom, and then you have to to clean the wine. When you're racking the wine. Mhmm. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Right. And sorry. My wine English is not No. It's okay. It's also wine English. Is it completely a different language? You know? It's like learning another language. So that's For example, In Portuguese, I don't know how to explain because I I learned, as I said, everything in in Italian, then it's possible. It could to me explain Portuguese, but yeah. And then, I I would say like, let let's touch as, as less as we can, in the wind this year. Let's, like, change the brakes now big barrels. So we are just pacing, and he can understand what I'm, like, researching that my wine will have. And he is, like, so, changing some things, little little things, to to arrive in the the aim that we have. Okay. So you're quite involved in the winemaking. It's not just another celebrity wine, you know, like just giving you a name. I know. Yeah. Yeah. As you yeah. As you mentioned, as you mentioned before those, that manifestation in in Italy. I know the guys and I know also they are no longer that is doing that thing. But as I said, everything was born, like, like, my fun house. And then, though, it's my fun, it's my house, it's my then it's completely different. I know I as I said, I'm not a businessman, you know, it's not business. It's just my passion. And I I I want that bottle. We'll achieve the level that I want. So, that that's it. Excellent. Okay. So I think listen. I think, we're going to close-up because we're, getting to the hour. Thank you so much. Renana's. Hope to meet you soon. How was Vinitzley for you? Was it nice? Yeah. Was it your first time? Met Pablo? No. One second. Oh, okay. I met Pablo and also, all the people, like him, and we are in contact now. So we are working those things. So it was very nice. I I had a chance opportunity to to to try all the pro products, and so it was very nice. So if we come to you know, our audience or, classmates, our ambassadors. We come to visit you in Cuddl, profaita. Will you be there physically or, you're just there sometimes? No. No. I I I'm always here because I said, now I'm also familiar here. So I Oh, okay. Yeah. So we'll have the, professor as a sommelier. You should just call yourself Sommelier ProFector. That's a new career for you. Yeah. Exactly. Okay. Then, yeah, we we opened the restaurant from Thursday till Sunday, before the weekend. And all these days I'm here. In in in bid, we are about to start the dinner, in half an hour. So So you better get your yes, Amelia, hat on. Yeah. Yeah. So listen. Thank you so much for your time. And, you know, I, I'm going out over your website right now. And I love the fact that your wines are very affordable. You're a superstar, but you make the wines affordable and also your restaurant very approachable in terms of price and presentation. Thank you very much for sharing that with us. And hope to meet you one day. Thank you. I'll be here waiting for you. Okay. Fantastic. Thank you. Thanks Pablo for bringing this fantastic guest Like, childlike. Are you still on? Yes. I'm still here. Okay. What's going on next week? Okay. Next week, I'm still finalizing something with Nikle Longari, but, it's going to be next week. So it's just confirming with the producer, but we have something for next next week. So we've got Slawi Kominski, Marco Discardo from Enobis company, and also the owner of Fosso Corno is actually visiting him in Poland, so they're going to do clubhouse. Fantastic. I see Slovac in, in our audience, as well as to Kevin and Julie and Susana Hello, Andre and Charlotte. And of course, Cynthia. Listen, so we're going to sign off. Are we going back to our Thursday slot? Yes. We'll be back on Thursday. That's good because it's Friday and no one's at the office, and I think I have to close-up the office. Okay. One second. Here we go. Swirl, sniff, sip. Smith. While you're saying, don't forget these testing tips. Listen to the Italian wine podcast, wherever you get your podcasts. We're on SoundCloud, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, email, IFM, and more. Don't forget to subscribe and rate the show. 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