Ep. 2005 Anna Obuhovskaya interviews Gabriele Brugnori | Clubhouse Ambassadors’ Corner

The Italian wine podcast is the community driven platform for Italian winegeeks around the world. Support the show by donating at italian wine podcast dot com. Donate five or more Euros, and we'll send you a copy of our latest book, my Italian Great Geek journal. Absolutely free. To get your free copy of my Italian GreatGeek journal, click support us at italian wine podcast dot com, or wherever you get your pots. Welcome to this special Italian wine podcast broadcast. This episode is a recording off Clubhouse, the popular drop in audio chat. This clubhouse session was taken from the wine business club and it Italian wine club. Listen in as wine lovers and experts alike engage in some great conversation on a range of topics in wine. If you enjoy listening, please consider donating through Italian wine podcast dot com. Any amount helps cover equipment, production, and publication costs. And remember to subscribe and rate our show wherever you tune in. Alright, you guys. So let me just start the room and see. Hopefully, we will have our guests. Ciao, Anna. Ciao. Ciao, Steveie. How are you? Good. Hello, everyone. My name is Stevie Kim, and while come to Italian wine room on clubhouse. We've been doing this since the pandemic, really. So for some time now, this is the way it works. Okay? We ask one of our Italian wine ambassadors at large. We ask them to invite one of their favorite Italian wine producers and they get to have this more like a fireside chat style interview. Through Clubhouse platform for about an hour or so. Right? So, we've been doing this for some time. Oh, I don't know, since the pandemic's a quite number of episodes. And I know Ann has been our host for many times now already. Right, Anna? Yeah. Yeah. I just love doing this interviews TV. Really enjoying this, nice talks. Yeah. So Anna Obuskaya. Did I say that right? Oboskka. Yeah. By the time maybe we can't we'll have an hour to learn or so. Yeah. There's a lot going in the office today. We have the blind tasing with Cynthia going on in a little bit. There is the game. I think some some soccer match to everyone going to a ball. And we we've just come from Naples, from Campiflegre, There was a lot of there was an earthquake. There was actually a fire going on as well, but we're all back. A lot of things going on today. So Anna, Anna, where where are you? You know, in my show notes, it says that you've been an Italian wine ambassador since two thousand and twenty three. I feel like you've been for many, many years. Well, Stevie, I did three attempts to become an investor to pass the exam. Alright. So I've been around long time. Yeah. Wait. Hold on. Hold on. Hold on. But you definitely made up for lost time. Because you've been with us and now you are living in Slovenia. Is that correct? Yeah. Yeah. That's right. I'm now in Ljubljana. And how is that going? How is that change? Living from Russia to Lubiana. Well, Slovenia, I'm sure you've been here. So, you know, it's a really beautiful country. It's small. It's somehow a hidden gem of, of Europe. There's not so many countries like that, because it's just on the border with Italy, Austria and Croatia, but somehow it's, not on the touristic path so much. And the nature is absolutely beautiful. And the food scene is, stunning. We have, quite a few. I think now it's, what, eleven, Michigan star restaurants within a small country with only two million people population. That's crazy. Yeah. So a lot of creative chefs, great food, you know, which, which is really a base for a great, cuisine. So, yeah, it's really, really interesting. And we, I'm working on, you know, I'm working in, importing company, and we import European wines to Servina. That's really our focus. We're not so much selling Australian wine, but introducing Italian wines, French, Spanish, and Portuguese. Which Italian wine producers are you importing so far? Well, we have Suwabia. Okay. We have, we have, of course, the mail from Compania. It's one of our recent, additions. We also have, great Canti Chico, silver piano. Okay. Antonio from Gatinara. Yeah. Yeah. Very good. Alright. I guess I'm not Tumilla also natural natural wine. So I guess that's about it. Alrighty. So today, your guest is Gabrile brionori. What did you ask Gabrile brionori to be your guest today? Just because Verdicchio always fascinate me, since since I studied started learning at, the Mediterranean International Academy. I discovered more and more about this variety, and I'm just so fascinating with a range of styles and the beauty of aging of these wines. And Bishi winery is a great example of relatively small, but outstanding in quality producers. So they deserve that more people know them around the globe Definitely. Fantastic. And when did you meet Gabriella for the first time? How did you meet Gabriella? Well, it was, Bishi, what was one of my personal big discoveries at Okerwan two years ago. So Gabriley was presenting, his wine of the of the year. And, I test I tested a lot of great wines that day, you know, like creme de la creme of utilities out there. For wine, one of our favorites. Yeah. And then, and then I got absolutely swapped away with, Bishi. What they represented that day. It was Sanex Verjico de Matele Carizera, and I met Gabriela in person for the first time. And he just explained everything about specific terroir and about how they work. And, I just also ask a lot of questions why this one is becoming so complex and what gives a special character. So So that's how that's how we met. Fantastic. And what are we looking into in terms of learning objectives from your call today? Well, I just what what I would like us to to know more about Matellica, specifics, just, to know, this is quite a small, area, area of production, and I would like us to discover more of the origin, of the particular style of Virdicchio, also about key specifics of the region and what is going on in the area right now in terms of winemaking. Fantastic. So I'm looking forward to this call. Welcome Gabriela. I will be now muting my mic and will come back towards the end of the show as usual. Okay, Anna? Over to you. Thank you, Stevy. Thank you. So hello, everyone. I would like to start the this interview with Gabriela. How are you? Shohan and Joseph, I'm fine. Thanks. Maybe thought over here, but it's fine. Has it been, really, really, warm, very hot these days out there in Matellica? Yeah. I mean, to help, Kain Sondra in the last two days. And, but, you know, we expected them. So we are prepared. Yeah. Great. Great. So Gabriela, please tell us, a brief story of Bishi winery when it was found and and who who is in charge of making wines? Well, first of all, thanks a lot for organizing this interview. It's a it's a pleasure. And, Bishi, Bishi is a historical, state in America, was, founded in nineteen seventy four. Everything started from, Kierino and Josephine, two brother of the Bishi family. They were a good carpenter, but they were in all of their land of their area. They were a lover of wine. So, they were looking at the area where the state is now since some years. And then, because they knew that was a perfect area for growing vineyard. There were already some vineyards over there. And, so in seventy four, they succeeded to buy And from then on, they for a few years, they've been growing some grape and selling locally to other producer, a small cooperative. And later on in eighty two, they they had the they're on first portal. And, from then on, the story of which he went ahead. Always, producing why that is really respectful of what they produce in the vineyard and, trying to create and produce the the cleaner wine possible. So from nineteen eighty two, that the production, and then the first, probably the first, knowledge of the, of the wines, started in later on two thousand and, two thousand and six two thousand and eight. From then on, the wines, so it's been, very well received and appreciated the by the markets and by magazine, by, journaling. And, and then in the last few years, we were also selected in the the create top of the wine that you just mentioned. Great super event from wine spectator in verona. And, so Let's let's say that's the the top we we are reaching, but we would like to to stay up there. Excuse me. Which year you were first invited to operator mine? First indication was, was four years ago. I think the first time time I my incorrect. So it was, I mean, usually when, you are a top pair of wine, you see all these, big names. And at the beginning, where for us, was, a bit of a surprise, but, we were, you know, not expecting, but we are thinking that, you know, historically by the way we are considered in Italy. We think that, we appreciate a lot of that invitation. It was it was great. I mean, if you paid a lot of effort that has been done in the past years. Yeah. I think, once we update our team does a really great job selecting smaller producers from regions that are not, really on the radar, not not really on a big scale, some hidden gems of Italy that's a really appreciate it. And and last year, this last, opera wine, I was happy to see more and more producers, from basilicata, from from, from liguria, you know, It's it's really it's really outstanding not only big names, but also some some smaller, states which need to be known in the one world because the quality is just, spectacular. So how long have you been, within this project within within Bishi? Well, I've been involved in the Bishi project since, more than eight years now. I mean, the in the past, the, the state that was within the portfolio of, the, the famous, market grads group. And, so but then, later on when, the state was took over by Maure and Tito, the Tucson of, Giuseppe, they wanted to have a bit more direct control of, of the distribution. All over the world. So they I knew a lot of the a lot of the knowledge. And then he wanted me to to join them and support them, consult them for taking over the distribution, trying to develop it better. And so, more than eight years now. Yeah. That's that's that's great. And, you know, within it seems like a lot has has changed within this, eight years already. So quite a great progress. And, to which countries you're now exporting with, you know, where are where are you present now at which markets? Yeah. I mean, the the the the main markets are the standard main markets, I think for most of the data and winery, The main market is definitely the US market. We are presenting US, since more than twenty years. And, thanks to great partnership, and we cover, different state in the US, and that that's really the main market. Then the second market is, Europe. It's closer to us and Provedicchio. Is the, well known even if, you know, the story of Adico had been quite particular. Because it it was more or less the same story of soav, you know, you know, it was, very famous in the seventies, then the production, increased too much. The quality went to be down, but likely in the last, fifteen years, a lot of new players came, lot of new young guys started to to have their own winery. And, they've already regained, a lot of popularity in terms of quality because really, is very well known as one of the three main white varieties that can produce top wine in Italy. Italian wine podcast brought to you by mama jumbo shrimp. So the main market are definitely Europe. Maybe the west area, but I'm concentrating more now. It's trying to develop a bit more the east part of Europe. We are presenting a very mature market like, Japan and Korea. Let's, that's something that, I'm very curious to try in the future. South East of Asia. But, again, US and Canada are the best market and Europe second. And how is it going, with Asia? I mean, Are you are you trying to get there or you're already there in some countries? We are in countries as I said, Korea and Japan. I mean, those country are, as a great knowledge of our, mainly of our Italian whites and reds. And, but it's a bit more difficult in the southeast. Southeast, I've been trying. I did try in the past, Singapore, but it seems like, nowadays, they are opening up a bit more. The market, becoming a bit more curious about, about, white wines. Usually China and Southeast that they were more keen to it seems. I mean, a bit, for my knowledge. It seems they were more keen to, to to try and to drink red wines, but it seems that, you know, the the popularity of the whites are gaining, a lot of fields. So I'm very, very curious and interested in developing, the the southeast conservation because I also think, that for us, for for our verdict or for the verdict in general would be a great market, because I think, there will be a nice pairing between, the characteristic of our wine and, and the food they have, in the Southeast of Asia. Yeah. Absolutely. There's a great appreciation, for white wine in, in Japan, in Japan Korea. As far as I know, as as far as I talk to, to my colleagues from these countries. Yeah. That's really interesting. But, closer to the, to the specifics of region, can you please tell us or describe, what are what are the, the most specific traits of metallic area and what are the, what influences the style and what makes this wine so different from other vertical wines? You know, Verdicca and and Caselius, they did the two denomination of the Verdicca are completely different there. And also completely different insights. If you if you look at the sites, more or less, it's one to ten. One metallic and ten in, yes, it's Atinica, we have a bit less than three hundred hectares. And in EAC, they have, a bit less than three thousand hectares. But the main difference is really the area. The ACR is, characterized by these rolling hills, going from the pre up and nine toward the sea. And, so that area apart from, smaller valley that created within the hills. He's influenced by the sea. While Mathelika is a more inland valley facing north protected by the sea in France, by the pre apennine. So we have this valley where the climate is, it's continental. And the really most important and the really what it makes the difference is the climate, but in particular, in summertime. In summertime, harvest time, when, you know, we're talking about the, August mid September when the temperature in Italy reached quite high level, the the thermal discussion, the temperature at night drops a lot. So easier, you know, in August when the temperature goes above thirty degrees, in Mathelica during the night, it goes down to twenty twenty one. So and that's really something that helped the grade to stay, completely safe from from being cooked by the sun. So The skin is well preserved. The the perf the perfume is well prepared, and the acid is well kept. That's really the most important part that really make the difference between the material and the Yassy item. So if you wanna compare the two, the two line, but, it's, we can say I mean, generally, we can say that Emattelyka. You have, beautiful structure, great city, probably a bit leaner and vertical style. Yes. Depending on the eye, you have a bit colder, and bit bolder and, vertical. But again, it's beautiful. I see that it's something that is typical of the group. But, yeah, thank you so much for for, explaining this. But due to higher altitude in Matellica in comparison to Yazy, there's also a higher level of solar radiation. Yeah. Sun is more active. But, are you, are there any training practices, to protect, grapes from the sun. Are you are you using anything, specific? No. No. No. No. No. I mean, we we work, trying to, keep the the the the bunches protected, using the leaves, keeping the leaves, when it's necessary. No. I mean, the soil radiation is very important. Bright sun is nice. Ventilation is another, very interesting components in our area. But in terms of solar radiation, I mean, we don't use anything to protect. I mean, anything that is not part of the wind itself. By means of leads. And, that's when no other particular practice for that. Yeah. It's interesting. Interesting. Yeah. Thank you. And also, also, probably soils are quite different. You know, it's more, metallic is a bit is more inland as you described, but it's also in the valley. So it's in the mountains more or less. Yeah. So so what's the soil components? But, you know, and, if not really, they have to do the make difference because, you know, we are around the four hundred meters. And, if you look at the highest part of, Yacie's probably be tired. But the main difference is really is this valley oriented north where the where you have a completely different climate. That's really a difference. And soil. Soil where we have clay with limestone. In particular, in our vineyards, we have different, and important caries beans, caries components. Yeah. Which gives which gives, a lot of familiarity and structure to the one Yeah. Excellent. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. In all of the wines, I mean, I tried the whole range of what you produce. I thank you so much for for that opportunity. And I can say that all of the wines have this specific, very clean mineral finish, very, bright, character, you know, as if it's, metal spine to the wine. You know? It's not a softer character. It's, if you draw a picture, for example, you would take a really sharp pen, you know, to Yeah. That would be that would be the style, actually, of the of this acidity of of style of, bichuan. You know, it's it's lovely. It's it's really striking. That, I guess, that's what, eliminates so much when you taste it. You don't expect this, power from the white wine. Yeah. I mean, if, I can use the word that, Jantaga has been using, I don't know, a few years ago when we did the the fifty anniversary of the, the fifty anniversary of the doc, Mathelica, it was two thousand seventeen, that means that, the DOC of Matilica is quite old. I mean, it's one of the oldest, white denomination in Italy. It was nineteen created in nineteen sixty seven. And, you and Tyler described the the the d q as the wine, white wine with the burgundy structure and, with the freshness of riesling. So I really gives you, I think, this, two sentences per year of what, summarize what you have been saying. Well, definitely, you know, Dougita. He's a genius put in in this simple phrase, really the key meaning of, I I couldn't say better. I honestly couldn't understand that. I don't know. It's a it's a great knowledge of our head. I've been visiting the area and testing, many, many vintages. So he knows they are very well. So I hope, that would be a really nice key to enter, you know, the the the Asian market is now working in, China. With a terrorist sense project. So I hope it will be we we'll have the radicchio to answer them. Yeah. Definitely, more and more countries deserve, to have Bishi. And more more more great, more great, and planning wines. Yeah. The great would be, you know, that that the barbecue in general will receive the recognition. You know, as a as a bishi one, we we are trying to do our best and, probably what, characterized our wine, in the in the different market. And, really, what made, be she went on in particular in the US was the was the coherence. We had through all the years in producing our wine. And if I need to go back to the initial, question about the history of, Bishi, Probably I would say that, a mark of, of the history was two thousand and six. In two thousand and six, Arardo Bellelli, the current, the current, winemaker, It was already there at the state because he joined the state quite young, as an agronomy. But in two thousand and six, you know, those years, there was a bit of a fashion of using, wood in, white wine. And, so I still remember the tasting different white wine with a lot of, wood too much in my, in my taste, for my taste. In two thousand and six, there were some of, consultant that we are trying to, not invite, but trying to explain to the owner to Giuseppe and his brother that probably would have been the time to start to introduce some, some wood in the in the Verbicchio because, the market was looking for those kind of wine. But, that was really a decision taken later that really marked and put the sign and, what the decision to go ahead and keep the clearance all over the year. Because at that point, when those requests arrive, modem, son of Luciuseppe and Araldo, they both, were saying, look Giuseppe. If you want to introduce the wood, I mean, the state is yours. You are the owner, and you take the final decision, you decide. But don't count on us because, we do not agree. So after a few days, you said, we went back to them saying, okay. You are the new generation, and I think I better listen to you. So from then on, they went ahead using, just concrete as as usual. And that's, I think, is really paid off. Paid off because, when I joined the company, eight years ago, and I started to get in contact with, in particularly important US, I found different people that, new, and every time it was the same, the same statement. You know, I know I know this one since many years and it's great because I recognize it. I recognize it. So for me was really I was surprised. But then knowing more and more the way we work in the in the state, I I realized why why that that that that that is really true. That was a very wise, decision, actually, not numb well. Well, you know, and, you taste it. You don't need you don't need any wood. I mean, there are beautiful verdict you're done with wood. And in the recent years, are even nicer because, again, for my taste, too much wood is too much. Nowadays, they are very nice, use of wood, delicate wood in the but we think for what we like that, I mean, if you want more important wine, more, let's say, more structure, you don't need to use any wood. You need to work more better in the vineyard. Select more concentrate more probably in the vineyard rather than adding or using a root. And, that's our side. That's our idea. And I think, we managed to And I think if you taste the different, great selection of Erika, you will really find that wood is nice, but it's not necessary. Thank you very much for explaining. This is really, I guess, it's a lot to understanding the, the, the particular style and specifics. And can you please speak a little about, single vineyard that you, have? What makes it so special? Where is it? And, What's the terroir at the single vineyard? Yeah. This is a single vineyard. I mean, they state that is, the vineyards are all around the, all around this. They all around the seller. And by the way, you have to come and visit this date. I mean, it's time now. And, so, you know, the wine that you need to know, the the vineyard as well. You see the vineyard in person. And, Oh, thank you. I would love to come. Yeah. Well, you're quite close. You know, it's Lavinia. So it's it's not that far. And That's true. That's true. So all the vineyards are around the the seller. We probably plant, and expand a bit more, planting two more Hector in a middle property that is close by to the seller. And we recently, I mean, since, two years now. We started to manage another beautiful vineyard, that, it's not that far from the seller, but owned by, you know, the producer beautiful, more than twenty five years old, Vigna, then we use that. Just to say that, the main part of the Vigna are all around the center. And in within this, vineyards around the cellar. We have this beautiful, old vines, vignette of O'jana. Most of the plow, the plant has been planted in nineteen seventy eight. As you know, some of the vines that have been replaced because some of them, die. So we replaced some of the brands. But in general, Divina has been planted in nineteen seventy eight. The soil is really, as I said, is, clay, clay, not really compact with very important beans of, limestone, calcareous components. And those two things, clay, and calcareous components really give something special to the vineyard and to the grape that produced by these all vines. And there what we do, we also have the lowest year, the the lowest production, compared to the other vineyards. That's the vineyard where we really leave only probably two two benches, three benches sometimes on, on divine. Just to have something, that really they really produce beautiful bunches, beautiful grapes. Because again, what makes a difference is what you produce in the vineyard. Paying a lot of attention in the vineyard, paying a lot of attention on the vines and the grape you produce it really makes a difference. And so that that is really what makes the the vineyard especially. All lights, selection, lot of attention, clay, limestone, And once we have, we are able to to have this beautiful grape from the vines. We keep those fine. The the the the juice, the mask in, in concrete. We didn't say yet. I didn't say yet, but we only use concrete. We don't have any we use a little bit of wood only for the San Jose and, fermentation of the Merlo on stainless steel, but for the wipes, We do fermentation and refinement only in a large concrete pots. Mainly fifty eight liters, vitrified, concrete valve. And, the vignette foyano, we keep the wine in, in these spots. Complete paths for more or less one year. Let's say between nine, ten, twelve months. Depends depends on the vintage, we taste the wine and we see and we decide when it's time to to put it in the bottle. Does a climate change? The does does it make a big difference, now for you? Are you facing any challenges within, climate change? The the I have to say that, what really scare us for the moment are ales. You know, when you have these, some are, but also in this period, we had, two, three thunderstorms. And, like, likely, I mean, unfortunately, the the the hills, didn't hit the the heels. It was hitting mainly the few weeks ago was mainly on the coast. And the but, that's really something that scare us because, in terms of climate of climate change. While for the increasing of temperature and the the weather change, I mean, for us, I don't wanna say that it was better, but, you know, we started to harvest a bit earlier by means of, more or less ten days. In the past, we used to harvest by the end of September, beginning of October. Nobody, we harvest. We started harvest around the mid September. Alright, after mid September. And, this means that we anticipate the period of, rain. So most of the time in the recent years, with a climate change. The harvest is quite fast. Quite fast with the good weather. So the change we had for us, is, I wouldn't say it's better, but, it didn't really bring anything, wrong for now. But really what really scare us are the hail. Hale is something that, it can happen. It can happen. It's absolutely unpredictable, and, then it just it's a solution. It is, there is nothing you can do because probably, it hit you and under meters, far from you, there is nothing. Only only rain. And that's the hip. Yeah. That does, sound pretty scary. Yeah. I mean, you have seen this year. I think this year, Shabri, the Shabri area got hit, very hard. As far as, I've been reading. So Yeah. I I want you to ask, there I know that in Matallica, there is longer, ripening period. So you obviously have, you, you pick up, you have harvest, later than, on the coastal area, but, what's the difference between, what's the difference in the harvest? Is it one week? Is it more? No. Usually, well, you know, how best it really depends from the size of the of the state. We have, in total seventeen hectares of, of, the deco and the other part of, Medlo and Sanjay. And, usually, when everything, goes, correctly with good weather within a week, we complete everything. Since three years, we we we start a bit earlier to take some, some grip that we use for the bubble, for the Vedicure, extra boot to the martin Automator that we introduced since, two wind three vintage now. And, If we don't have any rain, really in one week, everything is is over. Otherwise, you know, if some little rain comes, you need to stop with a bit, Sometimes it happened that it takes up to two weeks. And, usually, yes. The difference between is that we always service the around the ten days later than ten days later than the easy area. Moreover. Okay. Depends. They lower part of YES. Sometimes they even start, at the end of August nowadays. Yeah. Yeah. Well, interesting. Interesting. You already mentioned a few varieties that you work with, but can you, give a bit more details, which varieties you work with, aside from the education and, what's the role of this, varieties in in your state? Which ones you also produce and reach populations? It's really interesting. Yeah. And then as I said, we we are a unique producer, and we will increase the production, on the Vedikyu, but, we also have this little part of reds, you know, in the past, a really long time ago. There were also other reds in the vineyard that has been, removed and, planted, replaced with Vaticio. But, what we kept was Merlo and Sanjuvacing. Because, we realized that, those two varieties, they were giving us, something, very interesting. I mean, my law is an early ripening, and did these colder area that it very well. And, Metlo is quite common in, in Matellicaria. And I probably arrived there with the occupation of the French in eighteen hundred, and they paid, adapted, and we use it, out of this, two variety, Merlo, and San Joese. In the past, we used to have a blend, a blend, little entry, IGP with more Merlo, and the other, selection with more SanJobese. Nowadays, we have, the Merlo, I g t zero sumerlo, that is, almost one hundred percent. We probably use, I don't know, three, five percent of Sanjay. It depends on the vintage. And there, we probably increase a bit as well the production because nowadays, we don't produce more than, twelve, fourteen thousand bottles of Metlo. And because we found a very nice middle close to the other vineyard that, we are managing since Samir. And the other red is SanJovese. This is really a small production around the between six and seven thousand bottles. Great selection of San Jose, a hundred percent Sanjay that we keep, in for a few months, around the eight, nine months in to know. Fermented in stainless steel, don't know for refinement, and then concrete, and then butter. And, that's for Vila Castioni, our, sangiovese wine. Those are the two reds that, we like to keep because, you know, the merlot gave a very nice for it. It's not a bold middle. It's a fresh drinkable merlot. Nothing to do with the medal from, from Bulgaria or from other border. San Giovanni is when, we have time to keep it for a bit longer because the collection is very small. It becomes so so fine and elegant. I mean, I also there. The typical stupidity that you get from the boutique, you recognize the same inner and separate notes that you have on accentuate as well. That's interesting. Yeah, for for those of you who never tried, never tried, breads from, market from Mateleka. It's a very interesting experience. Yeah. Indeed. These are these are varieties that are grown in other regions, but, they do have a different character. It was very interesting experience to take them. Yeah. And it's completely different also because the most common, red variety in, the people important wine mean, the market is, you know, it's a multiple channel, mainly for the rest of the corner. And also, of course, you have a different, over the region. A lot of, San Jose used, together with Merlo or Cabernet to make some sophichannel. But, really, in Matellica, you mainly find Sanderes in Melo? Yes. Are there many producers in a Matellica area nowadays? How many in total? No. Not many. The the probably we are a bit more than twenty or less, or less, yes, a bit more than twenty. You know, in total, it's it's so is more calculation, you know, less than three hundred hectares, more than twenty producer with one or two producer that, that is quite a large property. At the end, there are different, small producers with, with some new entry in the last few years. And what is nice is that, most of them most of this new entry are going towards something, that, that we like. Vertical approach, no wood. Trying to put focus on, on the really notes of the ridiculously. So I think, we like this approach. We are on that side. So when we see new new guys, trying to take the same road. We like it. Yeah. It's very this looks like a very small and cozy community of the winemakers out there. Yes. I I do still have a a couple of questions for you, but I would like to ask, the audience if, you guys have any questions, please, you can write, them on the chat, or raise your hand, and I will, give you a mic. So if you have any, if you have anything to ask about, about Matélico or Virzikio or any other questions to Gabrelli. Please do so. And I would like to ask you, Gabrelli. If, well, speak about food. I'm always curious not only not only in wine, but also in the food. What are, how you could subscribe the the signature dishes of your area? And what do you think, makes the best pair with your wines? Well, with your detail, I would, I would say. You know, we'll we are this is the market region that is was mainly done by small industry and farmers, and they used to eat, what make us famous, probably the most famous dishes I can mention probably two, three. One is beaches, grassy. It's, vintage grassy's, chicken, pizza, and good ragu, with tomato, and cheese. That can be described as, a friend of mine in London. Describe it. The next level of lasagna. So that's that's Davincii, and then the oliva las Colana that are this olive stuffed with the pork and chicken meat and then deep fried. With, deep deep fried. And then the soft salami that is showed for these are the very typical and most known, and most known, dishes. But, in general, and now we we need a lot of, there is a long cost, a long cost. We have more than a hundred and forty kilometers of cost. So, like, you can imagine, We had a we have a lot of fish, very common, the the muscle, motion, or build it, or fish. So as you can imagine, those kinds of things, pairs perfectly with the verbatore. Or those kind of things that has a bit of fat or some fry tasting are perfect with the with the the city of the verbiage. Another quite common dish is that we use a lot of, codfish. So you can imagine this fat fish, quite, with a quite tough need. It's perfect. Again, we never did kill them. Code fish is common because we have been under the poke terminator for a long time, and they poke, love the cord. I think they were the the the main importers of, code pitch from, greenland, so in a long path. And, So, really, those kind of, of dishes to really pair, with the the radio. You know, by curiosity, I went the other day. I went to see the the menu of, one of the most renowned, you know, the restaurant we have that reached our Michelin Odyas in Sanigalia. And, by the way, for our unit of Poyano, and, like, reading through them at all, really, at the end, I said, well, eighty percent of the all these niches really are really perfect for for the web detail. And, because as you said at the beginning, the vehicle is very versatile. So you can have, for example, our medical team at telecom that is perfect for antipasti light inshita with parts or fish or or even like me or white me. And when you go to more elaborate the dishes, you just need to either take, an older vintage of radicchio material, or you take the the foyanna, or you jump to Sanex if you find it because really there the production is through a lever. That is the, you know, Sanex is our top selection that, that we may call in the queue vintage. And it comes from, from the same vineer, though, the Villan, so from the old one. And Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's Sonix. I'm sorry. I'm sorry for interrupting, but, Synex was, was the first one I tasted from Bishi. It it's a top one. The one that, Yeah. You're suffering from the serious one. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The serious one. Exactly. No. I mean, you know, Senex is something very particular. Something that, are really together with for Yana, together with the predicament here, it gives you really the idea how we're surprised if, it's ever been here. And, you know, I wanna mention, I don't know if, if, I have some time, I can go ahead. Otherwise, I'll stop you, Tim, and because, on this point of, versatility of, over the period, during the pandemic, you know, there was a lot of, online meeting, online meeting, online interview. And, in one of this interview, done by another producer, with an American journalist, it's It's so many, and there's so many, Nedompari, great guy that he was working in Palmora in London. He made the really nice, he really a really nice point about the video giving the different, the north side, but the different result, from Vevicchio, only talking about the different age and different selection. So it was going. He was comparing the Vadipio when he's, young and cool vintage to a to a chablis, to a young, Sharpenet. And, it continued, have to, have to, to, very old selection comparing it with the more so, another chardonnay in between, input also with compare the two three years old, per video with, some reason. So, really, this was, a beautiful, let's say, comparison just to say how we're satide and how the great Vadito and great, producer of Vadito can make beautiful wine that really can be compared to well known, well known around the globe, well known varieties, well known, denomination. Well, absolutely, I think, the ridiculous one of the most, fascinating white varieties of Italy, one of, best. I don't know, three best, I would say, one of my best. Well, my my it's in my it's on my personal top three, honestly, within within Italian ones. Usually, what what, what is quite recognized by value so many and, people that write about wine is that probably the main three white white items in Italy are the Greco. The so I'll be from the Casi Colare, from the volcanic area. And the and the boutique, those are the, the three main white grape that produced, due to future white. Well, I would agree and accept for, I would I would change Greco for, Fiano, but it's it's my it's my it's my preference. I I think, I would my my fault because, I wasn't sure about the two. Probably, yeah, I'm I'm sure you're right. It's Beyond is the one that, yeah. I'm glad we're on the same page. Yeah. Really. Some it's something it's something really outstanding. Well, can I can I have, I think, the last question for you, because now, the session is about to be over? But, I would like to ask, about not not specifically about wine, but if a person, comes to your area, what is a must see? You you can name your own, favorite things. As a local person. I'm really curious where you like to go. What you personally can advise to those who come to the area who are, who is enthusiastic about wine, who who loves, eating and drinking well. And, it's in the nature. Just just your own preferences. Well, you know, I really and markets finally becoming, popular to different tourists. But still, we still, have a lot of space with them. It means that there are not, too many It's becoming more and more popular because, people start to recognize that, it's still a good place to stay, you know, especially on holiday. You stay on top of one of the the beautiful, rolling and, you can enjoy the nature and the the the agriculture you have around you. And, you have to see that this close by between half an hour and forty minutes, you are by the sea. And there you can enjoy a beautiful restaurant, we are still with affordable price with beautiful, per week or, well, we're beautiful, other grade from the market, pecorino, or, beautiful, wine that you can drink. This is the fall of love. And again, if you go back on on the top of the hill, and within another half an hour, forty minutes, you are on top of the mountains, and you can have a beautiful work. There are beautiful, trades for a mountain bike. There are beautiful naturalistic traits. And, that's what that's that's what I would do. But, and if I want to enjoy nightlife, I mean, especially summertime, go down south at some point in the airport in Georgia. There are beautiful places when the way you can enjoy music. You know, another thing you need to consider, originally from from Macharatta. This province of, of, where the state, reside. Macharatta is the the second largest, open theater, open arena. It's the second b behind, the arena de verona. And there, if you like the operant, from Rosini, that is another, Machiziano composer, you can enjoy a beautiful, live concert or live operas, they are in, very seriously, muchirata. So, there are plenty of things. You will not, you will not find, and, if it's a style, you will find more relaxed place where you can enjoy both beautiful night night life. Beautiful relaxing beach. Very, very quiet and calm, rolling hills, then countryside. Nice. Beautiful. More and more reasons to to come visit Mark. I didn't know about the the opera stage. Well, we have, we have, Andre, here. He has a question. Can Andre, please? Hello. Hi. Hi. I am a Taliban ambassador. My name is Andre, and I'm from Latoya. I'm really huge fan of Verdicchio, and, I must say that, yeah, I I I also was, the part of, Jitos Galastica, and we visit the last, November, your region, and many, many years, I'm I'm really huge fan of your wines. And what I want to say, and then I will ask my question. Okay? I am a wine writer, but also I'm, a wine club owner. And, the last Friday, we had a wine tasting of your neighbor, winery Borgo Palganeta, you know, this, of course, I hope you are good friends, not not a competitor. And, what, I must say that, Virdicchio, despite, this variety has, let's say, bad reputation from the end of last century as, for a wine, pizzeria, a wine, you know. But this time, during wine tasting, what amazed me, the wine that was really great. They had the wine has such amazing, fruity acidity. They help me. And let's say, a restaurant when we are sitting during last several years to earn more money as a restaurant, of course. Because people usually they are usually ordering two plates, two courses. This time, they order three or even four. Because this, great taste and great acidity, they promote to order more, more food. So I, I, let's say, whole and, I suggest to work more and more of the restaurant to explain which advantages your override and your wine could give them. So this is just my, let's say, experience and why good wishes. And what about my question, is, do you have a plan, let's say, for releasing of aging aged wine. Let's say after the three, four years bottle aging, they are are gonna let you go dramatically changing in good way. I mean, this became more complex, more noble. So do you have such a plan? Or Well, Andre, I mean, to produce a edge to, wine as additional wine label in your lineup. Thank you. Thanks, Andre. Thanks for for for the note about your clients. I'm happy that you made more more money. And, but really, really it really doesn't surprise me. I mean, you know, the the acidity, probably some some doctor Malay doesn't want me to say it this way, but really just easy to help you to clean the mouth, and you really feel the need to have another bite, you know, you have a sip and another bite and the sip and another bite. With that is easy, you can go ahead for hours. And then, you know, you start to even think. I mean, really, that's the beauty of, this kind of, of wine and wine with this style, going to the respect to the question. We do already release, for Jano Villo for Jano for two years. The idea behind the wine is to really even try to keep it more, but I think, two years, one year in concrete, one year in motor. It's a perfect time to to show the wine, and then from then on, leave it the wine to evolve, for the next ten years in the bottom. And the panic is released, after more or less four years. After spending more than three years in completing when you're in Boston. So we are already producing something that we released after a few years. What we are doing more and, we started to do this, since, two, three years now, we should have done in the past as well. It's trying to keep aside some of these borders and trying to not to release, but to really to to show to people, to let people say how a great selection or good selection of Adiquin' eight because we producer, producers that produce great selection of Adiquio. We always, stay I mean, good predict you can age more than ten years. And, you know, I sometimes I see the heights of people in front of me when I explain this that they never had, they were with the older than ten years. So they they trust me and they try to say, okay. I do I do trust you. And, but then when you they you show them that it's really something, super true. I mean, it's it's great. And that's what we are trying to do. Trying to keep aside a bit more of, talk of, why we produce and trying to to let people show and enjoy later on. Unfortunately, we don't have a huge production. In total, we produce, under them, forty thousand bottles. Probably we arrive under fifty thousand, probably a bit more on the Vadigio. We never become an industry. We always stay as a farmer as a artisanal producer. And, Yeah. For schools. So not having a huge quantity we we don't put aside, but, we are trying to do an effort and putting aside the the more we can. Okay. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you so much, Andre, for the question. It's really interesting what you mentioned about the restaurant and about the highlights that it's, getting from from the Dictio wine in the wine is that's really a fantastic point. Okay. Boys and girls. Thank you so much. Thank you, Andrea Anna and Gabriela. We have come to the hour. I'm afraid I'm going to have to close-up the room. I had a couple of questions myself for Gabriela, but I'll have to do it in person because we have run out of time. Thank you so much. It was a great conversation. We are very much looking, forward to more conversation about Virdicchio, especially from Matelica. And also maybe one day we can do a blind tasting with those from Yay z. Thank you very much. Again, once again, Anna, thank you for coming back, and Andre. Keep up the good work. Thank you. Thank you. Listen to the Italian wine podcast wherever you get your podcasts. We're on SoundCloud, Apple Podcasts, Spotify, HimalIFM, and more. Don't forget to subscribe and rate the show. If you enjoy listening, please consider donating through Italianline podcast dot com. Any amount helps cover equipment, production, and publication costs. Until next time, chi qin.