Ep. 2224 Eugen Gabriel Axinte Szakacs interviews Renato De Bartoli | Clubhouse Ambassadors’ Corner

We produce, also Bekyosamperi, pre British, and Marsala, post British. The difference is the fortification. Marcella is only fortified. Prebritish is not fortified, but is not possible to call Salle, DOC, because is, generally wine, is not DOC, Marcel. It's not regular for the shipping area. Welcome to the special clubhouse session Utahai and wine podcast. Listen in as members of Utah and wine community engage in fascinating conversations about contemporary wine topics. If you enjoyed the show, please consider donating through Italian wine podcast dot com. And remember to subscribe and rate the Italian wine podcast wherever you get your pods. Hello, and welcome to club house the Investors corner. My name is Carveraviano, and today I'm pleased. To welcome Eugene Gabriel and his guest, Renato De Bartoli from Renone Du Marco De Bartoli Estate. Welcome, everybody. Hi. Good evening, Carla. Good evening. Hello, everybody. Our pleasure. So, Eugene, you will be today's host And before passing the mic to you, I would like to start by sharing a few more words and information about you. Eugene is an Italian wine Ambassador from Romania. In one of his previous lives, he started as an engineer continued his master's studies in communication, public relations, and hospitality, lived, worked, and paid for his bills in eight different countries, which is super cool. And in recent years, he decided to leave behind a very lucrative career as a business consultant to reinvent himself in a passion driven career shift as a sommelier and a premium beverage communicator. Congrats Eugene, that's a very brave and interesting choice. I actually would like to hear your thoughts about it. Do you have any suggestions or how are you feeling about it, actually? It is a very cool career path, and the people around the wine business are really good people. Passionate doing things from the heart. I love it. Yeah. I totally agree with you. I had the chance to meet you at Tarmina Gourmet, Sicily, and all the people there were amazing. And I know your guest is from Sicily too, so I'm very much looking forward to learn more about him. All this leads us to this moment. So my question for you is, how did you discover about Marco De Bartory? And why did you decide to invite Renato here with us today? Thank you, Carla. Hello, everybody. One more time. Yes. In the world of the wine connoisseurs, the name Marco De Bartolier resonates with high quality wines. We all know they are benchmarks of excellence both for Marcela and Pantalleria wines. Their reputation precedes them. As an Italian wine ambassador, we are encouraged to apply for educational field trip to Italy, both for, continuous learning and, also to stay current up to date with a very complex and dynamic world of Italian whites. And like you said, we had the pleasure to meet, a Tarmina Gourmet conference in November two thousand twenty four last year, last November. After this conference, a Western Sicily press tool was organized for a few selected wine communicators from Italy and abroad. I was part of that beautiful group. Some of, the colleagues, I can see them. They are in the audience today. Yes. Hello, everybody. And the one of the wineries we visited in Marcella was Marco De Bartoli. A very highlight of this trip. We had the chance to discover and to immerse in their famous wines firsthand directly at the producer. That's amazing. I kinda wish I I could join you for the tour, but next time, So my last question, and then I'll pass them back to you is what are the learning objectives that we should expect from this interview? Yes. In a short one hour interview, we will not have the chance to go in technical details to profiling wines and, tasting and, soils. And we we just try to scratch a bit the surface. So our goal is to introduce or introduce the bigger audience to the spectacular universe of Marco, the Bartolin wines. To share insights and knowledge directly from the source to increase awareness about the big spectrum of the wine styles they produce. And also to outline and reiterate that out there, there are wine producers who will try to focus on quality And this is our case with Marco De Bartoli. That's a very interesting and busy agenda. So without any further ado, I'll pass the mic to you, and you can properly introduce your guests. Have fun. Thank you, Carla. So today's story is not about meat. It is about wines from another dimension made by super humans. It is about a family, a family of winemakers. It is about working together throughout my personal experience. I had the chance to meet a perfectionist, a very good winemaker. Somebody who understands the ins and outs of the wine business, somebody carrying on a very rich family legacy. It is time to give a voice to the story and give the word directly to Renato de Bartoli. Good evening. A very warm welcome from our side. Thank you a lot for being here with us today. How are you doing? How is everything? Hello, Eugen. I am so glad to share this moment with you. Thanks, Jean, for your consideration of my job, of my experience work. I am Renato. I work in Sicily. We have had a family business wine. My family produced wine for, more than, one hundred years old. Our tradition is in Marcella. And from, forty years also in the Pantaleria Island, And from, four years, we are also in, Etna Place. Thank you, Renato. So, it's a pleasure to have you here with us. And as a short warm up, if you can, give us a bit more details about you, and, you're rolling the bigger picture. Actually, let let's start from the beginning. Why Marco de Bartoli? Marco de Bartoli is the name of, what, binaries is the name of my father. My father, fifty years ago about, make a is the brand because my father has been a a revolution man, a Netarito in Sicily, And, we follow his philosophy production. And I, and my brother and my sister, we follow his idea and, his vision of the wine. I am a white maker. I study analogic, busy culture. And, I work in a seller, but, my work is, also in the market. I follow our trade marker. I'm a master door, you know, of our wineries. Thank you a lot, for, these details so far, Renato. And now if we have a good starting background, can you please give us a bit more details? Where do you own, wineries? Where do you have your vineyards in Sicily? The wine style you produce, the grape varietals you use, what is the current, vision direction? We work, in Masala, where we have, about thirty actors where we cultivation, the green low grade, green low variety, and, we produce also, and Pignatello in West side of Sicily. And, instead, in Panta, area, we produce, the bebo grape. We have, eight actors. And, now, we produce also in Aetna. We have, four actors. About, Mary Lomascales. Thank you a lot. I would like to touch also an important, topic, very trendy topic. You were always known as artisans and pioneers in organic Viticulture and natural unification. Can you please let us know the current picture and your current initiatives in this direction. I remember that, you once told me that you are hundred percent, certified. So for, Panteleria and Marcella. We produce wine, in, organic, protocol and certified from, twenty nineteen. In cellular, we don't use chemical And we use only a little bit, so fight. And we don't make a verification, but, we are in a hot territory. And, we use the fridge. We fridge the the grape. We use the temperature control, soft press, all of the modern style technical. Thank you a lot. Okay. Now let's touch of an important, name, Marzala. It's a iconic wine city with iconic fortified wine styles. And, we all know that, you are not only famous in Marcella. You're also an influential, winemaker, and you are pivotal in shifting the perception about quality in this case. Let's go together to the existing Marcella wine styles and what you did and do differently than the other producers. We're born with, masala wine, the traditional wine, in Masala is the Perpeto, but, we have been also the innovator. And we produce also with the same grape or talk to the same grape of tradition. Few contemporary wine from, about thirty five, forty years. And, are not not oxidative wines, but more fresh, more, identity of there are more, light, respect the tradition and the respect of, licorroso Masala, DOC. Well, you have, style of wine, which, to be honest, I've tried it for the first time, and I was really, really impressed. So I would like to touch a bit the pre British wines. You are one of the very few producers present on the markets with a long forgotten wine. Can you please introduce to the greater audience, this style, we would like to learn more dialect it from you. Our, British, style wine, sedated. We call, Beckyo, Samperi, because, Beckyo is old. Wine, white, made from Grillo grape, and some fairy is the name of the place inside the Marcella area where we have the vineyards and then wineries. Before English people found Marcella wine, in Marcella, we produced this kind of wine, no forty five. And the history of our, beauty culture is very old from, two thousand years about from, fanish people. They start to make a promise of a wine in this area of Sicily. We produce, also Vickyosamperi, rebritish, and Marsala post bleach. The difference is the fortification. Marcella is only fortified. Prebritish is not fortified, but is not possible to call Marcella doc because is a January wine. It's not DOC, Marcela. It's not regular for the shipping or Yes. And, the grivorietta for these wines, it is Grillo. I would like also to shift a bit the focus on the Grillo, Always, a winemaker would say, let's find a good vineyard, a beautiful vineyard where the food speaks to you. For us as wine communicators, we say, let's find a beautiful wine producer where the actions of the winemaker speaks to us and, engages all our senses. So let's focus a bit on Grillo. It's an iconic sicilian grape. Also, thanks to you and thanks to your father, great vision. We produce, with Grillo, and, because, in our, VANeries, he said, most talent tools and the polyvalent grape, because there is very much, the affinity with the terwar. It's near the sea three kilometers about, and the underground is, stand and marine fossil is very important for, this variety. And very important is also the winds. Different winds from, Morocco, from, south east, and in opposition of this wind, there is the mistral from, northwest side. And, there is, every year, the match of these winds. And, if, the winner is, the hot wind, the the wine will be more body less acidity is more good for the traditional way, oxidative way. If, the winner is, from the northern side, mistral, the wine will be more fresh, more acidity, more, structure in the test, and it's very important when it's possible to play with this, different style of a natural proton. Yes. The the expression, the faces, the colors of Grillo, I remember one, fellow Italian wine investor told me that this is his favorite grape variety. To be honest, I didn't understand in that very moment, but then when I had the chance to taste the wines and enjoy your craftsmanship and hospitality in your winery. I was just amazed. It's unbelievable how many different grillo based wines and how many different styles you are able to produce. Very impressive. Let's go a bit, to all these different wines and different expressions of Grillo. We produce, with Grillo from sparkling. We call terzabiya, the tough way of Grillo grape, Mato de Chappenas, And, we produce different white wines, simple stainless steel binification. We sell no more aged. After we produce, is a more aged wine reserved by Grilla Reserve. And, more we produce the integral, is made with maceration in aim for. No filtered and the nozzle fighter d. And the the other are Marcella and Vecos and Peri, very, very different wines, but, all are expression of our terwar and our vocation in this territory. Thank you a lot for this, beautiful overview and for the beautiful wines made with this scraper at all. Let's, move now a bit and focus a bit on another very famous scraper at all. On the Zibibo, also for the Pasadena wines. And, also for Catranera, probably the best dry Zibibo I have ever tried. Same philosophy, but with the Zibibo grape. Zibbo in the history is always used for Mac Street wine for Mac with a dry grape under the sun, but my father, as a division, There is, the bebo is possible to make a very refresh and aromatic wines. And, in nineteen eighty nine, to born YETranera. After we produce also maceration, style that we call always, integrate ZBO made in aim for without sulfite and no filtered before bottling. So we covered Grilo and Zdivo. Now for the greater audience, we'd like to make sure that we are covering also all the other wines based on other grape varieties. We would like to make sure that we don't miss anyone or any current initiative information, which is really to all of us. And also, the wines of Aetna would be nice to touch them. Oh, yes. We call about, the wines that we I produce in Aetna. I produced with, Narello Masca laser, I produced two different red. One made with the two different vineyard in, Edna Nord near Pasto Picaro Place. I produced also Rosato rosato Rosay with the forty eight hour of maceration, staying still aged, very fresh and very simple for test. And, after produce all straw or sparkling with, Marillomascaleza. We harvest very early in the end of the August beginning of September when there is a good acidity, and we produce also sparkling white, blend noir, white humidification, and the last three is the white in two thousand twenty three two thousand twenty three. I produced also Karicante and a little bit, Cartarato, white wines, Etranalog at Etranadoc. Perfect. Thank you a lot, Renato. Now we would, like to know in which markets are you present? That's an important piece of information. We export, in, about twenty countries. The most important for us, are in Norway, Japan, USA, Switzerland, Orlando, Atlanta, Canada, Korea, Thailand. This is the the most important. There are other, like, multi other smaller challenges. We export about sixty percent of our wines. And we won in the future, exporting Romania. Perfect. Let's do that. You are a very strong player. And, anywhere you will export your wines, it could be a big hit for sure. For sure. Okay. I would like now to enter in a more, let's let's say, more winemaking, question. So we are speaking directly with the winemaker, and, you are a very good winemaker. Your wines are speaking with us. Yes. With this big complexity, how do you determine when your wine is ready to be bottled? When it's ready to be released on the market, how do you take these decisions if you can give us a bit of insights from your side? I follow my test and my experience. And, I like to risk. I like to try in the market, not in a small quantity. And, at the moment, it has been good. But it's possible to make the mistake in the future. I don't know. Speaking about your gut feeling and your experience. Yes. We all know that you have a lot of, previous experience in other wineries. Can you give us more, details And can you tell us what did you learn there? Yes. I have been also, work experience outside our family winery. I work in a in another company for, five years. And for me, it's been a good experience because, he's not comfort zone. He's more, complicated to make, understand our philosophy and our vision for a other owner and, as be a good experience because there was a very many program and qualification and for, follow the target, the, budget. And, for me, it's been a good manager. Experience. Perfect. Thank you. During your your, winemaking, and wine business career, can you please let us know what was a big, big challenge? And, maybe also which part of the winemaking process do enjoy the most? In the past, has been, make a sparkling wine in hot territory and, in, a zone in area where never they make sparkling wine. But, fifteen years ago in two thousand nine, I try with Greelow grape and, has been a good experience. In the future, I think, the most complex, experience for me will be make good in Aetna in Aetna where there is more competition, more more production, more a challenger is very important for me. I can concur with you and, say that you have passed the test of, making sparkling wine in this marginal climate, very hot climate. You passed the test with the flying colors. So the sparkling wines are just from another planet. It was another highlight during the tasting with you. Let's, focus a bit on the tradition. And, we would like to see when tradition meets the innovation. So you are in a very traditional area zone. So it's Marsala. We know the traditional sicilian techniques And, how do you incorporate, modern practices and how do you balance these elements to craft your signature style? The most important thing is the debocation, is the quality of the grape The grapes are very good. They were great master nature and perfect. Only with perfect grape is possible to make a great wine. The difference is the time of the harvest the material of the fermentation, recipient, the temperature control, and, the experience, and, a little bit, crazy, a little bit crazy. Thank you a lot. I would like to say hello also to Alessandro in the background and to everybody. He's a great hospitality manager, and he was there during the wine tasting. Yes. In a previous as what you said, Pina telo. We all know it in the textbook, Pina telo and not Pina telo. Because in Marcela area, these varieties is, in this territory from, two hundred and fifty years old. But, in Marcella, is not to match, production because, the soil of Marcella is in the sand and pinatilo don't make good in the sand. But there are some area when there is more clay. And, in the in the past, this pinatilo was, a plant in the clay. And, in the same place, the people take the clay for make the pinata for make the construction of the house. And pinata pinata, we need sallah people call this variety Pinyatello. From a trapani to other area in Sicily. Everybody call, but, I prefer to call in the historic name of Marcela. Beautiful. Yes. I would like now to ask you a question. So we've spoke a bit about the past and the present. And how is the future looking for, Marco De Bartoli? Who will be taking over who is, doing what, and, we would like to know more insights who is going to do the the spectacular wines in the future. Hey, is it not, a simple question. It's a complex question. But We follow our idea, our vision of wine, and we make a serious, not only business, but we have the passion, the health in this work. The most important things is, make a correct make the good in different area and, make the wine with the only vocation and known for, only the business. And, I hope, per other product follow this value. I fully resonate with your philosophy. I had the chance to interact with the you and the extended family. I enjoy the craftsmanship, your craftsmanship, and hospitality. And, always, my cred related to tarwar focuses on the most important component of the people. When you are, the right person in the right place, making the right decisions, being passionate, staying true to the core values, setting the quality bar on a different level. It's you just went the extra mile and you. Cracked for sure the quote. And, we would like to have your wines on the market and enjoy them because, like I said, these wines are from another planet. I have just, one last question prepared. And then I would like also to take a few questions from the audience. I saw that our colleagues already wrote a few questions. So my last question would be related to the rich history of the sicilian, wine culture. And what role do you see, Marco, the Barto is playing in the Cicillis broader one narrative today? And how does your work contribute to preserving this heritage? We all have the answer. We know it. We would like to hear it from your words? My my father has been a revolution people. He traveled to Master, and, he drank most important wines in the world, and his, approach has been for Mac, the great wine in the world. Not the best wine in Sicily. His approach has been, relation with the the great wine in the world. For example, when has been in Panteleria in ninety three, his idea was, shot of the game, not the other casino, for, for example. And, this mentality is a serious mentalities, is good for, we make a value in the territory for the terroir, value of the traditional, culture and, variety. Perfect. Thank you. Now I'm checking the questions from the colleagues from the audience, and I see and I would also to say hello to Beverly from Canada. She has a question for you. It is, related to the organic, affiliations. Are you a member of, Vinatur, or any other, organizations? No. We have, biologic, organic certified, and we have, a association with the Vina tour, association. Thank you. Another important topic, one of the colleagues from the audience is asking, what do we think about the wines with low alcohol or without alcohol? I prefer water. I don't like, the wine without alcohol is, I prefer to drink water. I don't know. For for me, it's a mood. It's a fashion, at the moment in this moment, but, the wine has very many historic And, the wine is our culture, the table for it, and, for me, or take off the alcohol, the there is a very, many manipulation of the wine. It's not good. Very many technical immersion, invasive technical is not good for wine. Not alcohol, but not in Huddl, and, it's better to drink water. Very good point of view. Yes. So wine is the is vegetal water, and we have to leave it natural. And, the magic of fermentations creates the alcohol in it, and I also concur to your your point of view. Yes. Okay. Question from Nixon, our colleague from Kenya who was also during the tasting, with us. Hi, hello, Nixon. And, the question from Nixon is Marcella has long been associated with an older generation. How can producers best position themselves to capture a younger generation of wine consumers? The most important thing is, the work, made, your, association there people, different school of, negotiation. And, another thing is that the price don't, make too much level of the price because the wine has been democratic product. Thank you. Yes. If there will be other questions from the audience would be more than happy to go to them. And I would like to touch also an important, let's say insights You have a family solera. We you you have a beautiful interpetoma wine style, the Victor sampari, and also for Marcella. Can you please let us know about, this beautiful gem in your cellar? But the Perpetual style, the Perpetual technical is a very similar over solar system, the same method though. The Spanish people use for McSherry. But, in the Perpetual, we use, for example, the berries the cask bigger. And, we put inside the heavy here. It's more quantity. We're no more than ten percent. We bottling, and we take five, ten percent with adi in the wine. For make a good Perpeto need, thirtieth before bottling and only concentration, only evaporation. We continue to produce, this wine because it's our tradition, our historic But, back to you. Some for us is the origin of everything. Yes. We have a beautiful comment also from Beverly. She's an expert in a food pairing. And, she gave us an insight about your catarato Luciido. She said that it was a spectacular, pairing with your flavors with fresh sardines. Can we maybe touch a bit also this part to, pairing a bit your, wines with local cuisine or with international cuisine? Thank you, Beverly. Thank you. Here's the cases for you. When you you come in, seller, these cases of wine are six bottles for you. You'll be in touch. That's the way we are happy for Beverly. We might share the wines with her. Yes. Yes. Can we do some, regional local and some international pairings which are going, well with, your spectacular wines? You wanna you want to say. For example, we had, we did some spectacular wine pairings when we were there. So, for example, Petronera, Muscado, Alequito, went very well with the And then also with fish soap and, tuna fish, for example, tartaro tuna fish, pasta, and chobas, different anchovies style plate. Peteranera Zibibo is good also with with aperitivo. Yes. Petanera is for sure one of the the best, dry Zibibos I ever tried. I was completely impressed. And, Of course, we all know that, that passitos of Pantaleria are the the most requested wines. But, again, in this direction, again, you are the first one taking a bet. And again, you pass the test with the flying colors who had this, idea and who really believe in a dryzy bebo from Pantaleria, from the historical greater war of Pantaleria? First vintage of Petanera is was ninety eighty nine. And has been the first, the unique dry wine in that period. Yes. And, you you were the first one. So it was, again, your father, Marco de Bartoli, having this, Yes. It was my father. Yes. Yes. I would like to go through a bit all these pioneering moves. So your father had full trust in Grillo. This is spectacular move. And then your father also fully believe in the Makeosamperi, which is the prepaid British wine. And like I said, you are one of the few wine producers. And again, full full trust in a dryzy bebo. I can see. We can see that you, like you said, one of your challenges was to create, traditional, method, the sparkling wines. And again, that was a bet. And, again, you you just went on on the footsteps of your father. Do you have any other, let's say, ideas or do you still have some initiatives, some, spectacular wines, which are coming soon out from the winery? From the seller? There is a a too much things, for, do. And, the most important, is, follow this way. And, I hope, to produce, half percent of the wine we produce now because I wanted to work on, less. Yes. It will be will be my brother, my sister, or my son, and, they can, choice either way? Yes. During the winter tasting, you told us about the family, and you also told us about your son what he's studying currently. My son studied Viticulture and, anologic school in Veneto. The name of the school is that is in, Ponelliano Veneto. Perfect. I wanted to ask this question just to make sure the lovers of Marco de Bartoli wines to assure them that the history is on a good hands, and you are already investing in the future. And your family is part of the different parts of the business. You are it's all a family business. And, the families in the first line, you are the winemaker and, I just wanted to, also, the audience to know that, you are all in in the wine business. We go with the same, direction of of family. That's the way. Thank you a lot. Yes. We have, let's say, all the questions which were prepared for today were answered. And also the questions from the audience I would like to give you a big thank you, and I won't would like to to tell everybody that from the moment you block this spot, you kept this spot. And I know that, every single evening you are, having master classes and, You are the ambassador of Marco De Bartoli wine and traveling a lot. I just want to give you a very small insight. This gentleman, Renato, he just arrived from a business trip, and now he's directly in this interview with us. And, we would like to show our gratitude for this. Thank you to you to the extended family to Alessandro also. And, let's say, please keep up with the good work. And we are more than happy to enjoy your wines and, to meet in the future on the markets and on the wine events and in other tastings. It's going to be always a pleasure. A big thank you to to you, Eugene. Very, very much. Very much. I very enjoy this interview. Our, winery is open for, all people, stay in the in the chat now. Schedule a very big thank you. I just want to give another insight, you know, during the rest tour in, western Sicily and Marsala. Before going to your to your winery, we were, like, he's going for the first time in a in for the movies or going to Disneyland. So we were so excited to visit Marco De Bartoli, try the wines on spot, and everything was Talk top. So thank you a lot for everything. And also the this interview was a natural step after our visit there. So everything was out of this work. So thank you a lot one more time. And, wishing you all a very great year. I agree with Eugene. I'm gonna wrap it up after this just by saying that I'm sure that my first sicilian wine when I was younger was, Marco de Bartoli wine. So I'm very much glad we we managed to have a talk today. It's a very renowned and esteemed winery. So thank you again for your time and for your insightful conversation. Hope to talk soon again. Thank you to you. Bye everyone. Thank you, Renato. Thank you, Carla. Thank you, everybody. Thank you, everybody. Bye bye. Listen to the Italian wine podcast wherever you get your podcasts. We're on SoundCloud, Apple podcasts, Spotify, email ifm, and more. Don't forget to subscribe and rate the show. If you enjoy listening, please consider donating through Italian wine podcast dot com. Any amount helps cover equipment, and publication costs. Until next time.