Ep. 821 Sarah Bray Interviews Giuseppe Tornatore | Lux Portfolio Series On Clubhouse | Maze Row Wine Merchant

Welcome to the Italian wine podcast. Join us as we present our new seven part series with our fantastic partner, e and j Gallo winery. We are proud to present this series of interviews, diving deep into the heritage and legacy of their portfolio of excellent Italian producers in the run up to the launch of the new brand identity for their importer, which will be shared on March sixteenth. In an episode with Maria Allegrini, tune in every Saturday from March fifth through to April sixteenth as we take an intimate look at these respective historic producers and their role as part of the Galloe family of luxury wines. And remember, to check out our YouTube channel, mama jumbo shrimp, for incredible video content featuring a visit to Arjano. I'm so excited to be here today with Giuseppe Doratore to kick off this series of conversations with Italian winemakers in the Gallo luxury portfolio. Welcome Giuseppe. Hi. Hi, Sarah. How are you? I'm doing so great. Thank you. I'm so happy to be here with you today. I'd love to just jump right in with a question about what you think makes Aetna so special. So as a wine growing region, but just for you personally. Okay. So as you know, Aetna, I know that you are, a fan of Aetna. So, but, first of all, of course, Aetna, it's a quite, unique place. It beautiful. It's a magical place because it's, is the, actually, is the highest active volcano in Europe. And, it's characterized by really fertile volcanic soil. Very full in micro elements like iron, magnesium, potassium. Let's say it's something that it's a place that when you, I usually travel a lot for my, my business. And when I, I come back to it, you know, There is always a kind of sense of, astonishment because, it's a it's a place like unique in the world. You can ski in the morning, and in the afternoon, you can go on the beach. So it's something really unique. Then, regarding what we are tonight, talking about is, you know, the wine. The exposure, to the sun, it's, in the north part where in the north part of Aetna where we are is, is really unique and, let's say, there are very huge, remarkable thermal discussion between day at night. So, it's a really unique, and we are we are in love with it. Yeah. I think it's really one of the most striking places I've ever traveled to. You have kind of big black boulders of recent lava flows next to beautiful vineyards and olive trees and chestnuts, and then sometimes that there's a smoking tough at the smoking summit at the top. So it's it's a crazy place to grow wine. Yeah. It's it's it's really when I when I when I when I talk to people and say that we grow wine on an active volcano, they they look at me like, oh, you're crazy, but it's it's it's right. But, so this is the, the magic of the of Aetna. It's, we have just one Aetna in the world. So, and we are really lucky to be there. So, and we, we, we try to do our best to to make everything perfect, to try to do everything perfect to not to waste what natural gave us. So this is very important for us. Well, let with that, let's dive a little bit into your family's history there. There's been a an explosion of activity on Aetna in the last thirty years and a lot of investment from both local and outside investors, and wineries. But your family's been there for a long time. So can you let us know kind of what you think sets territory apart? Yes. Yes. I think that the most important point is that the deep connection to the region, is what sets tonatore apart. My family is originally from, Etanari, especially from, Casilio de Sichelia that is situated in the northern side of the volcano. According to the historical archives, the Tonator family has been present, in Casilona, Desichelia since sixteen hundred. So this is something, quite unique because most of the actual internal producer are coming from, from other places. So this is not, obvious, let's say. Actually, my great grandfather helped to draw up the lines of the contrade And at the end of the eighteen, hundred, the start of nineteen hundred. This gave, to to my family, to tornado a family, a great advantage in choosing to plant vineyards in the best So I think this is, and then there is, I think these two points are very important. Well, let's, for anyone who isn't quite as familiar with Aetna, and actually, you know, just these this Italian term generally, let's talk a little bit more about what the contrade are because, you know, your your great grandfather helped draw them for a reason beyond just Viticulture. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Contrade are politically, let's say, political territories that since been appropriated for the crew system of ethanol. And each contrada was, let's say, unique volcanic soil due to the, the, the certification of several lava flows of different times. And the consequently different moninorals concentration on the ground makes every, let's say, every plot different from the other. And also important diversity is, is played by the changes in altitude and exposure to the sun. Yeah. I think the changes in altitude are really extreme. You see them sort of on a on a printed flat piece of paper or on your screen. You're like, oh, that's not so far, but you can really, you know, change two hundred meters dramatically just by driving up a single road. I don't recommend running. It's not the best activity there. But it's also interesting. The first time I went and I was looking for an address just to see, you know, you're you need to go to guardiola. So if it feels like everyone who's local knows what that means, because it can be also for the post office or for all these other things. And then it also makes sense for wine. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Something that is distinguishing, let's say, yeah, it's not from other places. It's a little bit close to what they have in France, maybe. Yeah. I think Burgundy is a great example there because you have, you know, a lot of people might own vineyards within a single contrada. Right? Yes. Yes. Correct. Well, let let's jump back to your family and your family's history in the region. It really sounds like your father, Francesco, was the one who really spearheaded getting, you know, today's winery project up and running. So I'd love for you to just kinda tell me about him and what inspired him. Yeah. I would say that he's really the soul of our vineyards of our state of our company. Unfortunately, he doesn't speak English very well. So I'm trying to to tell what they would say. So You're doing great. So so told me, my father was born in Casilio, that is, in the northern eastern part slope of, of Aetna. Due to, let's say, limited economic opportunities yet to live, to make, his, his fortune elsewhere starting a business in telecommunication, but, he never forget his country. And they had always had the, the countryside, at Tarah. You know, Aetna now is is quite common in the world, but, like, forty years ago, fifty years ago, wasn't very popular like now. And so, my family home, these, these lands, they, they use to, to grow ads and not, olive vineyard, of course, but the, you know, the dimension and the quality of what they they produce couldn't be the only way of, couldn't guarantee a good, you know, status of life, so yet to, to live and start a new, and and and follow another another way, another business. But he never forget his territory. He never forget his, his land. And when he had the opportunity, he came back, and, and started what is, was in his art and what he really wanted to do that was starting this, this, you know, this, this company, this state. Well, I think your comment about, you know, so many people having to leave and find fortune elsewhere was really the driving story of Aetna until only very recently. And so, it makes a lot of sense that he kept it with him as he, as he went away and kept doing the the agriculture and Viticulture. Can you tell me a little bit more about sort of your family's history in the vineyards? Because even though the winery itself is a little bit more recent, you were just mentioning always kind of working with hazelnuts and vines had an old man. So how has that kind of changed over the years? Yeah. In the old times, you know, around the early ninety, nineteen hundred, my grandfather used to sell mostly bulk wine. Balkine, olive oil and Arizona. But, starting in the seventies, my father decided to to stop producing Balkine and started selling the grapes to the other producer. At the beginning, so the state was made initially from just from vineyards that belong to my family, handed down, let's say, through generations. In the early nineties, my father, Franchesco, due even to the success that we had in, in the main business. Luckily, we had, we had, we had success on the business on our, like, let's say, main business, in the other business, the telecommunication business began, began to, to enlarge the state, to several acquisitions always in the same area of Castillio on it. Always in the same area of Castillio on it because he was very linked to to to his village that is, you know, Cassilio decision. So this is the reason why we are all our parcels, all our, containers are based in, let's say, the moon, municipality of Cassilio. Yeah. I wanna I wanna talk about that more in a little bit because I think that's a real, unique point. But I first wanna just talk about you as a kid. Do you remember being in the vineyards? And have you seen sort of the same people be involved with your family operation for for a long time? Yeah. Yeah. For me, it was a little bit a nightmare going to the vineyard when I was a kid because, you know, six years old kid that has to spend all these, Sundays, inconvenience wasn't so, so nice for me. Now I appreciate a lot. But when you are, you know, when you are a kid, you you want to go to to other places, of course. But, I even remember some of the people that are still working with us, picking grapes, on those times, So, and they have even other nice memories of the past. I remember when, once me and my father slept in the Palamento during the harvest because they were a little bit afraid that someone could come and seal the grapes. So it was something that I I still keep in my well locked in my memory. Remember another nice episode that my mother is always telling people. I I was like, six months old. She was, she held me in her arms, and she fell on the floor. She fell on the she fell on the on the floor and on the on the ground. She they were in Tremarquiza contrada. And so she said, I'd never come back again in this place. And now we are in. She didn't get away. And now, Tremarquiza is in, top one hundred and twenty nine wine, of Italy. So it's something that makes me laugh when I remember it Well, maybe you got the bad luck out of the way early. Yeah. Yeah. I beat my head, so now I'm a little bit. There you go. So I wanna talk a little bit more about, you know, all the different vineyards that you have, like three Marquiza. Your family, you said, has sort of started in Castillo Natici. Yeah. So for those who haven't known that kind of the the main largest village and that that is on the northern side of the volcano, a little bit lower down in elevation. So when you talk about that, there's a lot of different contrade and even smaller towns like Solikiata that are that are part of that. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And so you go ahead. Yeah. As you said, you can John is the largest village in the, in the northeast part of, of, of Aetna, and we own, our estate is, quite quite large. Maybe he's one of the bigger. I don't know exactly, but he's, for sure, he's one of the bigger in, in the, in the northeast part of Aetna. We own, roughly one hundred and ten hectares of land. And, sixty five are Aetna doc. That is, it's quite a lot. If you consider that all the Aetna DLC is roughly one thousand hectares. So we are almost eight percent of all the production. And, on the Aetna, there are more, more than one hundred and twenty producer. So This is, this is quite a lot. Another key point is that all the, all the vineyards are planted just with indigenous varieties. Carricante and Cartarato for for for whites. The elevation is, between four hundred and fifty meters and seven hundred meters. Yeah. That's really interesting. You know, that you've stayed around that area. It actually does mean that you end up having most of your vineyards as a DOC, even though there are vineyards up to three thousand feet, but, you know, it sounded like there were some family memories of why you didn't purchase so high. Can you tell us about that? Yeah. Yeah. We we this is something like an internal fight between me and my father because, you know, now there are many producers that are producing wine at, three thousand feet. My father due at especially to family, let's say, family heritage because my grandfather, my non, you used to say that in the upper vineyards, not ripening. So, you know, due, maybe due to the climatic change, the heating, global heating. I don't know why and how they are, they are ripening, in on the on those places. So my father all never wanted to buy lands, over seven hundred meters. But you have to consider too that, Trimarquiza, that is actually our, one of our best wine, the wine that was, awarded by Wens Spectator is, located at around four fifty meters. So it's quite low. Compared to the Aetna standard. Well, if you also gave the sacrifice as a young child, so that's why. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Now he's the best. Yes. Yeah. I mean, four hundred fifty meters in the grand scheme is still quite high. But for for Aetna, it's on the lower side. Right? Yeah. Yeah. For Aetna is in the lower side because Aetna is be between, let's say, four hundred and eight hundred mainly. Yep. Yep. And it changes a little bit, you know, as you go around, but it's interesting that on the north, you're contained right with in it. So you were talking a little bit about all of the indigenous grapes that you have planted, Narello Moskaleza being kind of the leading red wine, but were you always planning to keep them? Because I know some of the trends, you know, back in the nineties were to pull these vines. You know, why did you why did you keep these? Yeah. Yeah. In fact, this was the trend was to to plant especially, you know, Merlo, Caberne, international variety. And we had, an advisor that was, remember. She remembered we were in task, and I I won't I will not tell you the name of the guy, but it's quite quite famous. He suggested us to to pulling these vines and planting grapes like Cabernan or law. You know, Aetna was, wasn't yet, you know, that we everybody knows today is, as I as I said before, it was, completely different places. And the the wines were completely different too because, you know, there were not so much, the click, professional people working on, on the terrace. And so, but my father was very tough with the guy. And so I told him, no, no, I don't wanna pull out, pull the the vines. I wanna keep on, producing in, in, in indigenous, varieties because Aetna is unique in the world, and, and so he decided to, to keep on producing and, and Karicante. And his choice was, was really the best choice. It was a good one in the long run. Yeah. In the long run was the best choice at all. Even, you know, to preserve a little bit, like, some romantic view of, our nonna's memories as to how to say the heritage and the legacy of the family. So I think that we were lucky. My father was very, I don't know, I don't know how to say. It was very convincing to keep on on his, own path without, following these these adviser and these people that even as smart people that started producing international varieties on it. Well, and exactly. I think it's everything you said. You know, he was investing it in this place emotionally for the memory and the history. You know, it wasn't just to make money. Right? It was just to Yeah. Yeah. Be on Aetna. Yeah. This is a very important point because, you know, this is, something that, maybe I didn't say before, but, you know, there's no shortcuts. We didn't, we didn't follow any shortcut to, to get, to the point. We just want to follow to follow. We invested a lot of money on, without any return at the beginning. No stress for the immediate result. Because, luckily, we had, the opportunity to, to have our own business in another before in another business. So we didn't have to have the return immediately. So these are the, the, the starting, a lot of the, of the state, of the business of the wine business because we didn't have the stress to get the result immediately. This is quite important in my opinion. Yeah. And it sounds like, you know, it was just kind of a long methodical process. So you were invested on Netna there for many generations, working in the vineyards, I know we're gonna taste together a little bit later, so you actually did start a winery and selling your own wines. Can you tell us a little bit about how that happened when the winery was built and your first harvest? Yes. The winery was built, because my father, at a certain point, decided to stop selling the grapes to the others because, you know, the, the big of the work was in the land. So we wanted to see the final result. That was the reason why we decided that at a certain point to start our, our own winery. And even that choice was a good choice. So it was around, twenty twelve, twenty thirteen. And the first service actually was a two thousand fourteen. That was a great vintage on Aetna to start. Fourteen was, an awful vintage everywhere, but you know Aetna was one of the best. I know it's so delicious. I I Yeah. I remember being there on that harvest as well, and it was just perfect conditions all year. So anyone who thinks Italian wines and fourteen, we're not good. Go to Edna. I mean, auspicious start. So you started with that first vintage, and now how many wines are you making? Today, we produce ten wines, all from our vineyards. Of course, the grapes are coming one hundred percent from our vineyards, so we don't buy any any grapes. We produced two sparkling wines, shaman method both from Monroe, one, still Rose wine. Three white wines that are, and each of these wines embody the sense of volcanic soil the unique characteristic of the single of the different single vineyard. And then we produce four wines that are the Yeah. And I I think it's an interesting thing because you didn't you didn't stray from your philosophy of keeping it to the family, roots and domain by going and investing on the east where it would be the superior Vietnamianco. Right? You just you're working with the grapes that you have in your vineyards where you where your family's from. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. This is, this is the key point, and this is what we are trying to follow is our philosophy, let's say. And even each one is edged in, in, in its own way, we, we have big barretts for Eds, sale of silk tank, barrick's barrett for white. And then we have a concrete tank for raging, pre bottling maturation of the of the rails. I love I love the return of concrete. I think especially for volcanic soils, you know, there's there's some things that, you know, whether it's it's technical or just, you know, the the beauty of the mystery. It it for me really enhances that minerality, which is what we love about Aetna. Right? Yeah. We we we we we believe a lot in concrete tank. So we we have, we have plenty of those. And even the minerality, you know, that gave to the wine, it's, it's quite unique. So we are investing a lot. We are, we bought a lot of those, those those tanks. Well, let's, maybe move to the wine that you and I are sharing across the ocean. We have for listeners, the twenty seventeen contrada Pietarito. So I ported about a half hour ago, and it's been fun to sniff on and and watch open up while we've been talking. But, Can you maybe just start by telling me a little bit about this contrada before we, you know, talk about the widened? Yeah. Contrada Petarito is located between six hundred and eighty meters and seven hundred meters. In the tallest part of the contrada, we have, the caricante, the white caricante, and a little bit of catarato. In the lower part, we have the. So the terrace, the terrace of six hundred six hundred data, eighteen, eighty meters is, all Nerello Vasquez. From that, to us, is, coming the grapes that are using for Pietarito Espanarosa. The vines are, let's say, around twenty years old. You know, the the feature of the soil is that is very rocky, volcanic, and, the contrade is very windy. So it means that, You know, we don't use, a lot of chemical. We don't use anything because the, the, you know, the, the soil is very dry. And, and we produce around, nineteen thousand nineteen thousand bottles. Yeah. Bottle, not cases. Right? It's still not a lot of wine. No. Yeah. Sorry about it. No. No. No. It's good. I, I love that about Aetna that really there's not a lot of need for intervention. It's just a a pretty healthy growing environment, mold, and mildew, not not big issues. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. That wind. Yes. I don't. Yes. It's super windy. So it's, it's one of the windiest place I've ever seen on Aetna, actually. And that's saying a lot because the the north, we didn't really talk about this before, but the north, you know, is a bit of a wind tunnel. Right? So you've got the mountain range that it faces, the Peloritane, that, you know, the wind is coming off of the ocean. And I find the north generally to be windy. So it's good. It's It's great for this contrada to have that extra. It's hard on the grapes, but good for the wine. Extra win. Yeah. I prefer on the seaweed because I like kite surfing. Oh, there you go. I cannot do kite surfing on it, but unfortunately. So No. But you can you can drive down to to the beach. Forty about that. Right? But on the beach is not windy. It's always been just in Petrades. So anyway, we are dropping up. It's a very, it's a very unique place because you see Castillo on the on the right, you see Aetna on the back and, it's a magical place. It's really a magical place. Everybody, all the visitors that we have that are coming to Petarritz and, and visit to this contrada, the, the astonished ment on their faces, is unbelievable, really. And you have about, you know, you said they're about twenty years old. Are they all sort of kind of the Elborelo style planting? Or No. No. We The more modern style. Great. That protects them. Yeah. They're modern style. Yes. This is something that we it's another way that we've we we followed since the beginning, and it's it's giving us great result right now. To produce this wine, we so we are best, by hand, and from this, from this vineyard, we disturb and lightly press the grapes, then we the do you want me to go on through the winemaking? No. I think I think it's I think it's great. The only thing I was gonna just translate for anyone in America is that six eighty meters, just so you know, is about two thousand two hundred fifty feet. So it's it's still quite up there. It's part of that windiness. But, yeah, talk about talk about the Contrada, how you make it. It's one of your top bottling. So I think you handle it pretty especially. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. We handle the really especially because it's, it's one of my favorite. I like all our wines, but this is, something a little bit more special, special to something different. It's a completely different wine in my opinion. Anyway, I tell you how we, we produce this wine. We are this, of course, by hand, We just turn, and as I said before, we lightly gently press the grapes. Then the maceration is lasting around ten, twelve days in cement tank. After we we separate the wine from the skin, using, press, and we press the the wine in, big, French, oak barrel for at least one year. They are big with is another philosophy. We use big barrel. We don't use, we have summer heat, but we mostly use a big, big, French barrel. After the aging, before battling, we, we, we do another passage in, in the cement tank, the one you love for some months at least, around four to five months in cement tank. And then, up to roughly six to seven months in bar tools. Yeah. I I do like that passage back in cement tank. We talked a little bit about that minerality, but that's that part of that's part of what makes Aetna. All those volcanic soils are special. So I love that you're trying to enhance that where you can. You said that this was a really special wine and one of your favorites before we talk about vintage. I why do you love it so much? But I love it because it's, let's say, it's, you know, the mint. I think the mint is the most, the the the the mental, the the basami, that you can find in this wine is quite unique. It's something that they can recognize this wine among many others. The drinkability, maybe because I know where this, this wine is coming from. So my mind is a little bit, a little bit like, you know, he he love before starting to, to, to drink the wine because I l I love the place where the the grapes are coming from. But, you know, the the balsamic notes and, and the, the team, time, I don't know, time will team. I don't know how to say English. Time in English team on Italian. Time. Yes. Tim of the team of the team of the time. The the the meat that you can, the mint that you can, you can feel when you drink this wine is quite unique. So these are the reason why I mostly love this wine. Well, and I I think I think you're right. You can it's those are they're in the air, you know, depending on where you are stronger, less strong, but that mint on Aetna is so strong in certain places. So Yeah. Yeah. And this and this place most, like, the wind is, super strong. So I will it whips it up. Yeah. It's something that really, I really love. And even the seventeen, the vintage seventeen that one is the one that we are talking about is, something that I still remember because in August seventeen, my my son Francesco was born. So I remember paying well that, that that Vintaj. I remember really really well well that Vintaj. Your core wife, it was so hot in August. Yeah. Yeah. I remember because we were, my, my wife was pregnant and was super hot. He was born on eighteen of August. So we, let's say, we lost the summer for a good reason, of course, but it was super hot. So I, as you remember that this was one of the hottest summer we had. That, that thing, that was, of course, linked to the maturation of the graves. That was amazing. But after that, I remember that after the harvest of the white, the the climate changed immediately, and and started, like, to, like, light, light train and cool temperature. So it kind of refreshed the wine at the end of the hot season. Yeah. It refreshed the wine. Yeah. It refreshed the, you know, the thermal discussion, doing this ripening period. Maybe gave this excellent development of the bunches. And, arrived in the harvest, like, perfectly healthy and ripe, everything. So, this gave to this vintage, in particular, a really complex car there, and a great elegance, and an extraordinary balance, now nose and mouth. Yeah. I I agree. I'm I'm tasting it as you're talking. And, you know, you get that rich fruit concentration from the heat on the middle of the palette, but it finishes super light, super dry, super fresh. It's really and that drinkability factor, I I liked that word. Yeah. The drinkability, yes, Yes. We we we drink a lot of this one. Unfortunately, now, now I'm on a diet. I'm starting, like, two weeks without alcohol. I'm fortunate. So I'm I don't have a glass of wine in front of me right now. So I have just a glass of water, unfortunately, but I I I love this wine. I I live in the, Rosemary that you can can feel, ripe fruit, mint, as I said, before time. And so it's very complex, wine and very, even the, not so the the the the elegant tannin, and the persistence of this wine in the mouth that is, is really long. Is it is lasting a lot, a lot in mouth. I can attest. It's lasting while you're talking. It's, I think the elegant tannins are are a great point. You know, it's Norello Moskaleza we know is such a tannic variety. It's why you do all this work in the in the winery to to calm those tannins down. Drinking Norello onprimer or really young out of tank can really dry your palate, but I like the balance of the kind of slightly soft and tannin and the the ripe red, cherry fruit here. It's almost like a black cherry, for the fruit is. It's really yummy. Yeah. And then another great, feature of this wine of the, say, of most of the red wines is the, that you can pair this wine with a different kind of food. But you can withdraw from, with everything. I remember I had, like a testing in Miami in a Thai restaurant. And when I first arrived, it was, like, it was a little bit shocked to say, why? Usually, when I go to Thai restaurant, I drink beer ordering. These kind of things. But they they paired the the, you know, the thai food with, it was really perfect because you can it's a lot. It's like, let's say, so many dream because they can suggest this wine almost with everything. Starting from the, of course, steak, just to meet, and everything like that. My mom's macaroni with with Sugo. Yeah. You you probably, for sure, you know, because you, you, you are low. You are in love with that. And so, you know, it's, like source of, with, with the handmade macaroni. But you can, you can, drink this wine with, with, with, some swaddish with, many, many, many different dishes. This, I think this is a a key one of the reason of the success of happening in the world because, it's, like, really elegant wine that you can, you can really pair. We can really drink with almost everything. Well, and you can think about it as, you know, everyone says, you know, what grows together goes together, you know, you've got the black pig of the nebrity over there. So at pork is perfect. You've got the ocean there with the tuna and the swordfish with those kind of heavier fish. It's it's and good with some vegetarian things too. I like it with some eggplant. Yeah. You should try you should try my mother's carbonata that is quite famous in. Oh, I will. I'm on Gallo. I'm on Gallo. Managers. They love it. Perfect. Next time I'm there. Because of my mom's Kapanata. We're always joking about that because they I remember Jogalo came to that time. My mother was cooking, ma'am, he's he's cooking this cup on other. It's really amazing. It's really fantastic. And he was he fell immediately low with Dorador. No. I'm joking. It wasn't wasn't because of I think, you know, you you could include a rest a recipe and a shipment here and there, and people might might buy some more money. Yeah. But, you know, you know, you have this food and drug. I don't know why. I don't know how to ship it. No. Just the recipe. The rest. We'll come to the rest of the Yeah. Maybe I can carry my mom with me next trip and so we she will, make some, like, a kind of show cooking showing her how she she does it, but she's she's really something amazing. Should be a hit. A total hit. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I think think we we've talked a lot about, you know, everything from your winemaking philosophy. You know, I think what makes what makes it so special is really that you are so focused within the DOC on the on the north for those that, you know, aren't into all of these value legislation. We've talked about this a bit, but it really does mean under eight hundred meters. So that four hundred fifty to seven hundred meters where the tornatorre vineyards are puts them squarely in the middle of it all. You know, I I love the story about your non note remembering that grapes weren't ripening up there and and not being a driving reason of not not investing further north. It's maybe my favorite little story we we said today. Okay. So I'm very happy to to speak with you and to tell you a little bit about the the family about, you know, What we we saw in the past is that when, when you talk about our state, our vineyards, yes, people, they like it, but when they visit our vineyard, they they fully live, they fully live with it. This is something, quite unique that is, is very difficult to explain by words. It should, should definitely come and visit. We have even, like, a small resort with, rooms to cross people. So we are we are one hundred percent in the business, ma'am. Believe me, it's not just for business, not for business, but is, yeah, of course, there is a business reason behind all our what we are doing, but there is a passion. Passion is everywhere starting from my mom's Caponata ending to to the last worker that we have in the land. No. I think that comes through and everything. You know, it's, and I agree everyone should book a ticket. This should be the first place if you haven't traveled in a long time that you go to. It's you've gotta see it and smell it and taste it to really understand that net so special. Well, thank you. This was really exciting. And, you know, I think we'll just say that's our we'll be continuing this series next week, same time, same virtual place, with Marielis Allegrini. And a little reveal for the US market. So with that, thank you all, and hopefully see you next week. We hope you enjoyed this episode of our new Gallo luxury wine port Folio series. Tune next Saturday for the next installment, featuring another in-depth and intimate conversation with the Heritage Italian wine producers that form the core of the Galloe Italian wine family. To learn more about today's featured producer, see our show notes and visit their websites. Don't forget to subscribe and like our show and tune in to the Italian wine podcast wherever you get your pods. Hi, guys. I'm Joy Livingston, and I am the producer of the Italian wine podcast. Thank you for listening. We are the only wine podcast that has been doing a daily show since the pandemic began. 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