Ep. 1361 Luca Collia | Wine, Food & Travel With Marc Millon

By now, you've all heard of Italian wine Unplugged two point o. The latest book published by Mamma jumbo shrimp. It's more than just another wine book. Fully updated second edition was inspired by students of the Vin Italy International Academy and painstakingly reviewed and revised by an expert panel of certified Italian wine ambassadors from across the globe. The book also includes an addition by professor Atilio Shenza. Italy's leading vine geneticist. The benchmark producers feature is a particularly important aspect of this revised edition. The selection makes it easier for our readers to get their hands on a bottle of wine that truly represents a particular grape or region to pick up a copy, just head to Amazon dot com, or visit us at mama jumbo shrimp dot com. Welcome to wine food and travel with me, Mark Billen, on Italian wine podcast. Listen in as we journey to some of Italy's most beautiful places in the company of those who know them best. The families who grow grapes and make fabulous wines. Through their stories, we will learn not just about their wines. But also about their ways of life, the local and regional foods and specialities that pair naturally with their wines, and the most beautiful places to visit. We have a wonderful journey of discovery ahead of us, and I hope you will join me. Welcome to wine, food, and travel with me, Mark Milling on Italian wine podcast. Today, it's my great pleasure to be in Verona at Vin Italy, Italy's largest and most important wine gathering, wine fair, bringing together wine people from all over the country. My guest today is Luca Colia, of a very important historic wine estate. Casa Emmanuel de Mir fiore, in the heart of the barroller mine region. It's a story that really is at the heart of Italian history. So I'm eager to meet Luca and hear all about Casa Murifiori. Thank you, Mark, for the introduction. I'm very happy to be here. I actually honored to be with Italian White Podcast. I'm happy to, tell you about as a beautiful historical, journey. Great. How's your visit to be going so far? Well, well, I mean Italy's awful. It's beautiful in my point of view because, you know, you gather with all your friends, your partners. Of course, we are in Italy. So, you know, a lot of going on that's, we are very happy with the business we're making and showing our beautiful, winery. Well, that's great. Yeah. It is an extraordinary event because the whole Italian wine world is here, not under one roof. There are many roofs. It's very big, all of the different halls. But it is a chance to, to meet people from all around the country and to taste wines from all around the country, really getting a incredible picture of the diversity and the wonder and beauty of Italian wines. But you're going to take us to, a very special place to the heart of the Barolo, wine region, one of the most famous wine regions in Italy. And the Mirafiori story really begins as a love story. Can you tell us about this? That's true. That's true. We are in the Lanc area in Sadalunga Dalba. And, we started, let's say, our journey, in the middle of, eighteenth century, so eighteen fifty more or less before Italy unification. And the first king of Italy, it told him earlier that the second, he was, he used to love to, to, to come in the leg area to hunt, But during a parade dedicated to him, he met this beautiful, beautiful, woman, Rosa Bechelan, a very famous name in in Pimono culture, and they got in love. So they had two kids, one of the kids, the first grade was Emmanuel. That's why the the one risk called Casa Manuel de Mira. And, you know, this was, a secondary marriage. They were not they couldn't get married because the queen, they were still living. So when the the queen died in Toronto, he he wanted to to marry Rosabella. And, of course, they were not recognized by the the crown. So to leave something to Emmanuel and then and, his sister, Victoria, they they let's say they gave us the, a legacy. They became counts. In fact, it's contempt and will admit a few of them. But everything like you said was borne by a love story. Okay. It's an extraordinary love story, and that love story really is at the heart of the Mirifurre estate. As you say, the king, was he the king of Sardinia at the time? And then became the king of Italy? That's true. He was the king of Sardinia Pidment. Till eighteen sixty one when they unified Italy. And then they became the king of it. The first king of Italy. Okay. And this is, very much part of the history of Italy, but also the history of barolo wine, too, because, this was a time when But all of, as we understand, it was really being developed through the Savoya, through the first prime minister, Konte, Kavur. And, this is really all around the Mirifiorre Estate. Now this king who was very in love with La Bella Rosine, I've seen a, painting of her in the villa. She was very striking, very beautiful, and he built her a villa. That's true. That's why we have a, in the middle of our property, still with their beds. You know, they have they had used to have separate rooms, but they're still there. And, when people, they come to visit us, they can, visitors of these rooms. And there's this beautiful estate, with a lake with, more than one hundred hectares of property. Now we have a beautiful beautiful hospitality. In fact, we have a tree hotels and tree restaurants. One is a Michelin Star with the restaurant. And they it was from the very beginning of community. You know, the Villarayale was their house, but, all over the property, there were different bill links. And, there were two hundred people living in that, property together and working for making wine from the very beginning. That's, say, eighteen fifty eight. So before it, Italy unification, So it's a very historical, historical area to come and visit for Barolo. Yes. Very, very historical. And I'd like to talk about, the hospitality, a little bit later and about this wonderful restaurant that's in the villa, but it is interesting as well how, how the count of Manuel was really a visionary, not only in developing wine and creating a modern style of barolo, that was very soon winning international awards, but also a visionary in terms of how to create a model community where workers were living, working in harmony, and creating very good living conditions. Of course, we're talking about the eighteen sixties, eighteen seventies, eighteen eighties this time when there was a lot of poverty, when agricultural working, it was a very hard life. But on this estate, it was a model estate, and that was very much at the center of how he developed them. That's true, Mark. This is very crucial in our, today to say. Emmanuel, like you said, it was a a pioneer, you know, a missionary. He wanted to create this community. Community is the keyword. This case, you know, and imagine it forbidden the Mediterranean. Beatatria was, kind of a dynamic that, with, the lower the time in the area. So if you I would, own a land. I would, rent it to you and you could, starve all year long and get just fifty percent of the harvest at the end of the year. So you imagine entire family starving during the year. If forbidden that, and, before anyone else, anyone else in Italy, not just in Piedmont. He was reading books during the nights to the farmers because he was thinking, you know, knowledge. First, would help me more than someone that doesn't know anything. So our visionary at that time, not today, it was this guy. We have a book into the winery dated eighteen ninety, and he wrote by his hand. I'm very open to suggesting comments about how to make wine and how bad I should manage this community in this winery. Eighty, ninety. So it's been a while. Even now, it's pretty difficult to assist just to white maker how to make their wines. No, they they don't like that. Yeah. But this guy was so open minded. It was very intelligent. And like you mentioned, he understood the potential of Barolo. He had connection with Kevur, and only the most important person for our unification. And he he had the possibility to export for the first time Barolo. In in the woods. So imagine, eight, imagine we won some medals. At that time, they were not writing but medals in San Francisco, eighteen sixty four, and two years before in Los Angeles in Chicago, sorry. So imagine how important was the wonder at the time and this guy, how visionary he was. That's extraordinary. Very interesting what you say about the Metsudrilla and how that was a system that wouldn't when it was not working well could leave people in in extreme poverty with very little. And he found a way to to, give give his workers a better life. Also, very interesting about winning awards. We're talking about, you said, eighteen fifty eight. The works were eighteen sixty eighteen sixty four. So this is just after Italy became a unified nation, the kingdom of Italy, and already from this, Royal Villa, the wines are being taken around the world, and the name of Barolo is being, paraded around the world. I I think the wines were exhibited in exhibitions in Paris. Yes. And again winning awards. So this was a, an important moment. Now, we consider Barolo. We know Barolo is one of the greatest of all Italian wines and one of the greatest wines in the world. But this was a very early example of of of Italian wine being taken abroad quality wine. Well, if you imagine one hundred and thirty years ago, this guy was already more than one hundred one hundred and sixty years ago, this guy was already sporting and understanding the potential about aging barrel, you know, the appalachian barrel came many years later. So neither the appalachian was there, and he had connection also with French winemakers, you know, Kemantes on the on the border with France. So the influence, also in their dialects is huge and the wines, especially, you know, but, although, now the land is the, only thing in the wood, you can compare to burgundy. In terms of quality, in terms of production, in terms of a style, you know, So this guy was really a star at the time. Yeah. Actually, that's a good point to Luca you've made because prior to this, there wasn't a a red wine to age. I think Barrola was a a sweet wine. Sometimes, there was a mix of grapes in it. It's barbera. Yeah. With barbera. And it and this through knowledge from French technologists that had come to work with cavour and and working on the Mitterfury estate, this modern style of a big wine, vinafine on the skins to extract tannin, to allow it to become a wine that could be conserved in aids for decades. It was really a, that would have been a very modern invention under Countuana. Sure. Imagine they didn't have the technology. We the knowledge we have now. So to understand that and to a g dawson Barals at that time is Livonian book. Actually, they started chestnut, because they were the areas full of chestnuts of trees, but then they went to, Slavonian. It was really something new into the the scene of, of the wine. But, another important new thing introduced into the wonder. But, actually, Europe, Emmanuel asked to a Switzerland company from Zurich, Bursaria Zolig on that time to come in the in the Saranga area in our property to build when the first will act to make wine in Europe, not just in Italy, eighteen eighty seven. So imagine how important now, you know, cement concrete is very popular trendy. Sure. But that time, we're talking about eighteen eighty seven. So it was incredible. And the at the still there, we still use it just to stabilize the temperature of the wine and, cannot be touched because the Italian government does another horse. To change it to this. It's it's an it's a historic monument. Yes. That's great. I know. Yeah. So the the wine had great success up until the nineteen twenties, was it? And then what happened? It happens that, there were different problems. The first thing, Manuel was a very smart guy, but he died very young. He was forty four when he died. And that was the biggest problem, I guess. And then the in that time, we used to have a most of the vineyards in Europe with Filosir. So the destroy the philosopher destroyed most of the plantation all over Europe, And then the financial crisis from nineteen twenty nine by United States. Gastona, the son of Emmanuel was not able to take care of the business anymore. He went bankrupt. I must say gastona was not like the father for sure, this. I was not, so focused into the one. It became a politician. It was, very into, having fun. It's, you know, I think they like that fun. But, but in nineteen thir nineteen thirty one, he had to sell, the property, so the estate. The name of the the estate is called Fontana Frite. It's a County of the commune of, Sarunga Dalba. And, the brand was sold to another producer from the Astoria. So, basically, Mirafiro, let's say he he was in a freezer for seventeen years, more or less, because they were producing, but, you know, there was not so much focusing to barolo since the other producer was from another area, more focused on sparkling wines. So let's say the story, it was going on, but, a little bit interrupt by this situation. Sure. So, really, the famous historic gaza Manuelity Merefiore name, this historic label on a bottle, disappeared, but now it has appeared again. And virtually, with the same historic labels again. Tell us the story of the renaissance, a rebirth of rediscovery of this incredibly important historic winery that's also making great wines again. Well, in our property, we have a nineteen o three barolo, label bottle, and it was written, that's a millimeter if you're on a side of the brand of the the seller. And so again, an historical piece of art. Of our journey. And, you know, to say, Mirafuri, lost like you said a little bit, the production, but, in two thousand eight, Oscar Farnetti, the Fondro, Italy. He, came and he bought back the the the winery. He had the the lacking as to get it back into the the region property in Fontan Freda County in the state. And, you know, it started again to develop the brand, the sampler, and the the labels. Okay. So we are using labels that are from the past. Of course, in a different way. They're a little bit more modern for sure. But, it's, like, getting back to our roots and expressing, even in the wine mix style, the kind of wine we used to make mix. Mirafione is a very traditional kind of winery in the sense that we use cement, but we also use, original technique from, Piamont. For example, we use capitalism Meursault technique into the cement, some American hat. Or we use so. Just explain that to our listeners in case they're not aware. There are many ways to extract color and tannin from wines. You might pump the juice back over the grapes at rimontagio, for example, to extract the color and the tannins. But they they kept that also matters. So that's really traditional, holding the massive skins that float to the top down to to extract. That's per important. And there is a reason why you don't do that, the opposite. So first of all, the concrete. Tanks are like a pyramid on the top. Okay. So in this way, the solid part, the skin grip is always in contact under the liquid. Okay. That's very important. If you have squared one, big tend to go just up and, you know, to leave a little bit of the liquid. Right. In that way, you extract less. But why we do that? Because we don't want to stress our wine. So when you pump over, you do all the things, you stress a little bit of wine. So in this way, with the capitalismers of technique, capitalismers of technique, you have a just to push softly once per week. It's sort of dark down. Just just one second. Because, like I said, it's always under the liquid. No. It's extracting all the time. In this way, you also have more harmonious wine, and that that can last for many, many years as borrowers should be. Yeah. Okay. More or less. Italian wine podcast. If you think you love wine as much as we do, then give us a like and a follow anywhere you get your pods. It's also interesting to me that Minifiora began as, as a model of of agronomy of agriculture with, of of making mine, of wave, the community living together. And that sustainability, the organic principles are still part of the whole philosophy behind Mirafione today. I would say that's central for us. First of all, the the community is still there because into the property, we still have twenty families more or less living there. And, with their kids, the company is taking care of their kids during summertime, for example, we do after school. We have two professors. So if I have a kid for free, can leave your kids close to you where you're working. Amazing. Yeah. That's very important. We have free meal every day, and so the community is still, alive. And, actually, this is the dream of a manuel, so we are continuing. And, they want to question with, about, the organic and sustainability, the the organic, the sustainability, more than organic, it's very important for us. So imagine we started the organic conversion in two thousand fifteen. So from two thousand eighteen vintage, all our wines will be organic certified. From last year, we got the vegan certification. And, even last year, we got another, in very important, in my point of view, certification is called equalities. They look for your sustainability and agriculture. Okay? But especially your ethical way of treating your employees. If you have day of good salary, you'll be happy to work with you. Very, very important certification. The last we got is the FSC certification, which, show that shows that your, raw materials or paper for your, labels, the, bottles made by glass or the quirks are from, are sustainable, so from replanted forest or by recycled glass. How important for Mirafiora is the sustainability. Sure. We are almost three hundred sixty percent. And also in, in our property, we have solar panels that we use to produce energy. We have a lake, like I said before. So we a purified and we use the water for agriculture properties. We cannot urugate in the lung area. This is the room, but we can use another waste without wasting it. Sure. And the water is very important right now. Of course. Now I know you produce a broad range of wines, but let's just talk about the classic red wines of the language. Let's say, we are very focused just on the language X to Barolo. Varietal. So we just produced Ocshedo, Barbera, and Abiodo, basically, and white, as a white line and a shift. But, of course, our main solo would say, our main focus would be always Barolo. Is like we said before, we were one of the most important from the very beginning, and we are very focused on this. We are in a very important comment for Barolo, the OCG. So in settling at Alba, one of the eleven municipalities in the world, you can make Barolo. Imagine, like, it's a very small place. So, it's a it's a very fragmented kind of, a wonder scene. And, Barolo for us is, it's everything. You know, Nebula. It's a very complex kind of varietal. Why maybe one of the most complex in the world, not just immediately, with this long potential to aid this elegance when you taste it. It was this beautiful tannins. I tasted a bottle of Marola just the other night over dinner. It's absolutely beautiful. Thank you. Thank you very much. In twenty seventeen, so not not too old, but Not too old, but, yeah, because the approach nowadays is to be, of course, traditional. What we're saying before we don't use any, we don't use any, we don't use any, just need a more big size, slavoni, nuke. But at the same time, we want to be contemporary, you know, wine, you, of course, those are wines you can eat, you can drink in many years. But we also want to produce democratic pessimistic word wines for everybody that everybody can enjoy. Of course, premium wines, but they can taste, forever palates. I think it's important because, you know, we want to taste wines. We wanna be able to buy wines that we enjoy now, not that we have to buy. Wait. Which seems to be the case with Motorola. Mark, I always sell to my I always say to my clients, to my customer, to my partners. When you buy a, a bottle of vintage, you buy at least one case. So you can drink a bottle now. Another bottle in two years. And so, you know, five years, ten years. So you can imagine an out and see. Check how the, barrel can evolve. This is a special thing about the barrel. It's evolving all the time. In your bottle, but also in your glass. You pour your bottle every five minutes. It's different wine as layers. That's actually a beautiful, tip, I think, for wine drinkers who are listening to us. Some people feel you have to open a bottle, pick up of days or if it's a big wine or a day, decanted. But at what Luca is saying, I agree completely. You need patience when you actually have the wine in your glass. You need to sip it and swirl it and enjoy it. And then maybe leave it for a little while and see how that wine just in that moment is developing. My problem with that Luca is that when it's just starting absolutely magnificent in the glass, you finish the bottle. Yeah. That's true. That's that's the only thing you've got to open another one. Yeah. We say to people, you know, when it's Friday night, you want to treat yourself after a hard week with your wife, with your husband, whatever. You just sit on the couch without any food, actually, maybe dark chocolate, if you if you want to dare and just a glass of about all of two and enjoy it. Enjoy the the end of the week. Absolutely. It's it's Broola truly is Avino Dame de tati on a line that you can, that can take you places as you're sipping it. But it's also very much a food wine as our Dorceto dalba and Barbera, dalba. And I'd like to talk a little bit about, food and wine, and in in particular, about this magnificent Guido historante Guido that's in the villa, the the Royal villa, the villa Contessa Rosa? Yeah. It's critical. In honor of La Bella Rosine, which is one of my favorite restaurants in the world. I think it's a magical place and chef Ugo. It's a modern Michelin Star restaurant, but it's very much based on the traditional foods of Lehlanga. So just tell me a few of what these foods are, a few of your favorite foods that you enjoy with the Mirafione wines. Well, first of all, I'm a very lucky person to be there. You're very lucky. Yeah. And then, even because I'm Italian in in Italy food, it's culture, more than an every other country, I guess. I used to live in US, so I've I've seen different things. So food is per link to wine in any way possible. So when we talk about wine, we need to talk about food. Came on as a beautiful, beautiful cultural food. They're very linked again to France in this way. And, Weido Al Chati, the founder of the Weido restaurant, He was, visionary and another incredible guy. He, was on one of the first in that area to get the mission star. And like you said, You have very different, Mission Star restaurants in that area, maybe the more concentrated area for Mission Stars immediately. But, the others, they, tents, and this is a good thing. Don't get me wrong. It tends to mix the fish fusion to have fusion of different kitchens to do explore a little bit. We do is very focused and still Uber, the the the sun, which is the the main chef now, Imperial, which is taking care of the management of the the restaurant. They want to continue the tradition. They're their family. Also their mom and their grandmother, they used to make some beautiful dishes. So it's a one national store, but if you come and visit, you will taste the tradition when it's passed. Imagine what, when I am when I'm good there, and I'm very lucky I have the possibility to to eat the best partner Cruda, the raw meat, at the same time with a little tomato in a special special way. Very thick. Kind of it a lot on auto. And especially, it would say, the annual lot of that lean. So this beautiful beautiful pasta, dumplings, let's say. Yeah, in a way, made it two different ways. The first one would be with the roasted sauce, okay, from different kind of meats. And at the same time, and this is the recipe of their mom. And the recipe of their grandmother is that it's, really, really interesting because It's in a nappy. So in a napkin, they put without any sauce. It's a yellow to the plane, and you eat it by hand instead of it. It's really beautiful. Like, this part of the action. I think I've had that as, with a better deal when we've been having a glass of beautiful sparkling wine. But that only looked at our plan Delidea, I think. Mhmm. Delidea, is really extraordinary. One of the real traditional handmade past us with a filling of, I think, a variety of different meats, different meats. And, as you say, simply served with the juices from roast meats. It's, absolutely exquisite And I think it's a wine that, it's a a dish that goes beautifully with maybe a lung and a bureaus. Mhmm. Yeah. And you you suggested just say something very nice we didn't talk about before. We said that, Mirafiro is very toxic in the Langage parietals, but lately, and it's part of the cultural pediment, actually. We started making an Altaalanga. Talanga is a sparkling wine. In Pemonte, they're saying they invented the method of classical. In eighteen fifty, if you go to France, they're not the main, but, it's it's a one meter of pinot noir in Shödling. In our case, we just use pinot noir in the highest part of the land area. So imagine a list. At least three hundred meters by the sea level, but we have been some meters even to six hundred meters. And it's a bit of an expression. And why not to use other than per div or also with some anode supply? Of course, like you said, Maybe the most famous matches with, lange biola. It was, pure elegance and the really pair with this kind of food. Yeah. Absolutely. And then perhaps, a Brazil alvarrolo with with Barolo. Sure. Sure. Sure. Sure. Yeah. For sure, Prasato Barolo. Even other main, kind of issue, they can go very well with with Barolo. I would say that, Dol cefton Barbera are fresh fruity with the wine. So they call for we we send it to the foodie ones. Absolutely. So salami cheese, you know, don't match very well. When we are on the bottle, we have a little bit more elegance for sure, more complex. Also, you can play around with different anxious. Yeah. No. It's a it's an area of exquisite exquisite wines, but also, one of the greatest cuisines in Italy. And of course, we haven't even mentioned the torto von Bianco dialic. The white truffle which is, of course, one of the glories of being in the region in October, November. Yeah. Mark, when you are in the in the area of September, the end of September till, the end of December, it's perfect spot to did some white truffle. Absolutely. Now finally, Luca, let's just mention some of the hot what hospitality you offer at Mira fiora. Yeah. I mentioned before a little bit, short so we have now, three different hotels. It's a semital, but it's a spreadable kind of hotel. So different concept for the three buildings. We just released. We just opened the third, which is the laxer spa. Very, very small ten rooms. That's it. And, it's high quality kind of hotels and, and also restaurants. Because like I mentioned before, we have three restaurants, something is a little bit more casual like this window. And with us, the initial start we just mentioned. And then we have a, another one close to the lake that we we attend there many weddings. Imagine we have fifty weddings every year people coming. I can imagine what a beautiful place to get married. Yeah. Then we have a theater, a small one dedicated to, some, important person from Italy, Oscar Fonetic during fall and winter invites very famous people. They can be journalists. They can be singers. They can be actors. Many, many arts. And they come to talk about a specific topic. Most of the time can be environment sustainability, but, you know, can vary, of course. And it's for free. For the community. So even people that are not into the property that don't live there, or like me, employees, employees, they can come for free. They just need to reduce the rates of a small place, and they can hear to to the where they say it's a beautiful thing. Do we have a conference center? That we rent for. Beautiful, companies close to us. For example, Ferrero, one of the most famous in Italy. And this end, we called all this hospitality Milajon Arante, the storytelling village because you can also walk into a booth, and in Moscow depends here in the boot of toads, where you can go for free without getting registered and just walk into one of the only boot left in the landing right now. So imagine that people are just entering without any stop and enjoying the place. Well, it's an absolute absolutely beautiful place I can confirm. And I think for me, wine tourism has developed so much in recent years. And I think what you're offering is, a really attractive, proposal because people can come and really immerse themselves in the life of a community. Not simply just going somewhere to taste wines or to even stay in a beautiful hotel, but really the vineyards are all around, easy to get to Alba. Beautiful area and, of course, magnificent wines and foods. Luca, it's been a real pleasure having you here today for being my guest and explaining this wonderful and important story. About Casa Manuel de Merciorre and the re, the renaissance of this historic winery and the wonderful wines you're producing today. So thank you very much. I hope Vinitally continues well for you. Thank you, Mark. It was, really an honor to be here with Italian wine podcast. It's, really, really, I'm very excited. And and what you're not always here in Italy. It was a a beautiful moment, Belissimo. Thank you very also for me. We hope you enjoy today's episode of wine, food, and travel with me, Mark Millen, on Italian wine podcast. Please remember to like, share, and subscribe right here or wherever you get your pods. Likewise, you can visit us at Italianwine podcast dot com. Until next time.